My Thoughts

[Gaarden]

Okay, I am an agnostic teenager who used to be a passive Christian and then a strong atheist when it came to religion.  When I was younger, I was very passive about religion, just kind of being there and not understanding anything.  I claimed I was Christian, being baptized when I was 10, without really knowing anything about Christianity.  I then brushed all of these ideas off as mere fantasies of the mind, and of wishful thinking.  However, since my anxiety and depression took hold of me with the self-realization of how scary death actually was (happened 6 months ago), I really began to fear the possibility of empty nothingness and oblivion after death.  I have gained an appreciation for religion that I never thought existed, after I began to read from many different sources about many different religions.  Based upon what I have read, I have determined that I am neither a Christian nor a strong atheist, but an agnostic at heart (I like to call myself a liberal agnostic, for both religious and political purposes).  I haven't read all of the Bible yet (few ever do), but based upon what I read of it, I can't believe how people can call this ancient collection of documents written by many different authors over a long period of time as inerrant.  Especially of concern is how people can interpret the Bible only one way when conflicting passages and much ambiguity exists within it.  Among my most favorite topics are: salvation, proselytizing (known as witnessing or conversion by some), Biblical genocide, absolute morality, absolute knowledge, and the Golden Rule.  I have many questions, and very little answers for any of them.  I am especially confused about the prerequisites (requirements) for salvation, confused that mere thoughts would prevent one from going to heaven, and confused that an all-loving God would send people to hell for eternal torture. I have read countless articles (and even Biblical passages) about salvation, and it all seems very confusing. With thousands of different denominations in Christianity, who is more right than the other? Who determines who is right and who is wrong? Does absolute knowledge and absolute morality even exist? Why is the divorce rate among conservative Christians higher than that of atheists? Why can't science and religion co-mingle in ideas, rather than shoot each other down? Why do wars based on religion happen if the Golden Rule exists in almost all religions? Why is it that negative news is portrayed much more often than positive news? These are but a few of my doubts and questions, many of which prevent me from joining a formal, organized religion at this time.  However, I wish to start going to a Unitarian Universalism church at some time.  Anyways, that's the lowdown on my current path in religion.  With all of these questions, I am sure that there is an answer!  If any of you knows the answer to any of my questions, I'd appreciate it!  If they are unanswerable, having multiple viewpoints from others is all that matters!

[jilola]

Perhaps it would do you good to read the Bible in terms of belief constructs and people who have had an enlightenment experience trying to put it in the words of the time.
I can only understand the biblical writings in terms of a glimpse (or a longer experience)  of the conscousness we all share and express as our perceived reality. It makes much more sense given that perspective than as the account in a solely physical frame of reference in which it's usually interpreted.

2cents & L&L
Jouni

[Gaarden]

Yes, I never interpret the Bible in a physical sense anyways.  I always view it as an ancient collection of documents, written by many different authors over many centuries of writing.  Many of these ancient documents have been lost forever, scattered into the winds of change, which would help to explain its many conflicting viewpoints.  And, since the discovery of some of the ancient Gnostic documents (such as the Gospel of Thomas), I have reason to suspect that the Bible is incomplete.  Actually, in most translations of the Bible, some of the original documents have been omitted (such as the Gospel of Q), further proving that the Bible is incomplete, I believe.  I feel that viewing an incomplete collection of ancient documents as inerrant is a fallacy in reasoning.  The reason for its conflicting viewpoints is also because the viewpoints of the authors have changed with time: this is the main reason why the traditional Four Gospels are all so different from each other, I think.  I have not read the entire Bible yet, only some excerpts from various passages.  I plan to read the entire Bible someday, but I think that this will take years to achieve...

[Wronski Feint]

Yeah, I hate that 'Im gonna die' feeling.  I realized what it meant to die and be dead abou 2 yrs ago and I still think about whats on the other side.  Im not a very religious person, I do beleive in god though im a christian, but i dont go to church because I dont agree with everything they say and if I tell them that, they spend an hour explaining how im wrong.  I dont think god is like most christians(i mean christians where i live) think he is.  I dont think he is a big mean guy that will send you to burn for enternity just becuase you dont go to church or pray everyday.  I think of god like a father figure, no matter what you do he will always love you.  I think hes like a counselor in life also.  If you gotta problem he will help, if he thinks you really need it.  I dont think, as god that loves you he will send you to hell because you may have neglected him sometimes in youre life.  I dont mean you can completely ingnore him and go kill people because if you act up you will get a spanking aka hell. But you wont go forever.  You know in your heart what is wrong and what is right.  Just abide by that and youll be ok.  As for the death thing, I dont know exactly whats on the otherside but it dosnt make sense, to me, that there is nothing but nothing after this life.  And I do think that modern relgion tends to kinda push people apart so, I beleive that spirituality can exist without specific religion.  Hope this comforts you in some way.


PS: Like I said im not a church goer so I mostly figure this stuff for myself.  Im not clear on every religious law either.  So i say youre ok.  And dont fear the whats going to happen to you when you die, nothing lasts forever, not even the end.

[Gaarden]

Wronski, as my quote says below, I may not be religious, but I'm still spiritual.  I have too much of an open mind not to be skeptical of dogmatic creeds, whether that be in religion or science.  I haven't been to a formal church service since I was baptized at the age of 10.  Back then I called myself a "Christian," even though I was really an atheist at heart.  I didn't read the Bible, barely knew who Yeshua ben Nazareth (Jesus Christ) was, and I thought of it all as "wishful thinking."  That changed since my depression: never before have I had such an open mind as I do now.  I can't accept or reject anything as true or false, which is why I am here: to prove to myself the existence of an afterlife/spiritual existence!

[Wronski Feint]

I wasnt arguing with you, your post sounded like you felt bad for not being really relious or somthings, so sorry If I misunderstood.  I just shared my beleif on the situation and maybe you will see where I was comming from and you would feel better.  Apparently this is not the case, sorry for the wasted space.

[Charles Adler]

Gaarden,

I've heard this a long time ago: "It doesn't matter what you believe. It matters what you DO."

You may join a new church, group or sect. Read new holy books. Pray with different words or in different ways. And in the end... it all comes down to Love.

Spirituality is not about identity, reading mystical scriptures or even praying.

Spirituality is about loving. Loving yourself, thus becoming a better person as time goes by. Loving others by wishing them happiness (even to the worst kind of human being), and doing everything you can to help people when they need you.

If you choose to love, you'll lead a happy life and when death comes knocking at your door, there will be no fear about nothingness or whatever death may bring to you.

I don't know what life is all about. But I do know what a happy life is all about...