The Da Vinci Code

[thechunk05]

This book caught my attention at the book store last week. What exactly is it about? I just glanced at it quickly, didn't take too much time to read the back.

[Fat_Turkey]

Something along the lines of Da Vinci putting secret messages in his paintings and stuff.

Mostly, from what I hear, it's pretty much saying that the truth about Christianity has been lost because those punks who founded the Holy Catholic Church only chose specific gospels to be in the Bible, and the founder created a manipulative system in which he could control the people.

And as for all you Catholics out there, I don't mind Christianity. I'm just saying that the truth seems to be that your part of the religion was founded on lies and manipulation.

~FT

[exothen]

quote:Anybody who really wants to be Christian, read the Gnostic Christian Gospels. The 4 Gospels in the Bible were only 4 of several HUNDRED Gnostic gospels.

Why should I believe the Gnostic gospels since they are dated much later than any of the books of the Bible, are dependent on the gospel accounts themselves, and the NT writers write against Gnostic beliefs?

Anyone interested should read The Hidden Gospels by Philip Jenkins. The Da Vinci Code, from reviews I have read, contains a lot of fluff that has no basis. It is only sensationalism to make money, that's all.

[Eol007]

Hi Fat Turkey,

I cannot help but notice that you like to post somewhat thought provoking statements. Good on you!!! Forgive me for coming across as heavy in advance - hope you enjoy my little rant below ....

After recommendation from a friend I obtained a copy of the Da Vinci Code! She explained that it had obviously been written as a fictionalised mystery thriller for entertainment only, which no doubt you are aware. I for one am looking forward to completing the book, and hope you enjoy it as well!

As a completely lapsed Catholic I can appreciate why one can despise an organisation due to the cruel behavior of its representatives! OK I may be slightly off subject, but is it is it really worth while, or better still worthy of today's enlightened individual to string along rank old potatos as it were!!!

Yet, however pertinent to today's society the argument for considering the perversion of the original nature of Christianity and it's true roots, and regardless of the fact of it's Romanization and the bloody and tragic aftermath of that has followed mankind ever since, is there any real value for hating any of today's institution(s) for the sins of their forbearers?


The Da Vinci code however absorbing is only but a fictionalized representation of much of the pulp genre discussion about organisations (some allegedly secret), and their historical links to certain myths and legends or conspiracy theorys (however true): as mooted by popular authors like Gardener, Baigent, Hancock or even Bob Frissel or even the likes of David Icke et all. Although it might be unfair if not cruel to put them in the same bag!

One example could be for instance the discussion about the Graal quest! With out going into a song and dance about myth and history, could the Graal really have been a symbol for man's fall from grace and his blind search for a lost part or divided part of the soul as represented in the divine feminine, rather than what it perhaps became in terms of perpetrating a bloodline myth or not!

There are convincing esoteric arguments for the current state of the human condition human on this plane of experience or existence. However one perspective for consideration is the dominator (male) model 'symbolized by the blade; existing for untold millennia. It could be argued to have been one of the primary roots and certainly symptoms of human kind's disharmony to this very day. A study worth considering was the swing from matriarchal to patriarchal society as depicted in books like say 'The Chalice and the Blade' by Riane Eisler.

This seminal work in some way appeared to have been misunderstood by certain circles as was in some way considered part of the feminist backlash in the 20th century during the 80's. As much as I applaud the re-emergence of the Goddess, is there not a truer call for integration of the male and female aspects of our nature on all levels and dissolution of duality i.e division in the so called global community at large. In other words is there potential for the kingdom of heaven be seen to manifest on Earth, or do we continue to live in awe of those who control and think they understand how best we are to lead our earthly lives? I do not see myself as any kind of hero or saint, and regardless of the small part we each as individuals play upon this field of life's play - is it not a matter of personal responsibility for each one of us to take on the mantle of service even if only to help one brother or sister in need. Is this not what the true Christian message and the calling of all ages was and still is after all?

No doubt you would agree that regardless of historical perception of religion, society and politics the division humankind endures, must as a matter of balance come to peaceful harmony in time - least we exit the planet in no better way than the dinosaurs.
I am a great admirer of the search for truth or Gnosis and I very much appreciate the argument about the Gnostic and Synoptic gospels. I in no way claim to be a scholar of divinity, yet it may well be worth considering part of the Pope's Easter message regardless of ones lack of or professed faith: -

'The pope, speaking to tens of thousands of pilgrims in St. Peter's Square, prayed for leaders who are trying to resolve conflicts in Africa and the Middle East, including the Iraq war and Israeli-Palestinian violence. He called for what he described as the children of Abraham — Christians, Jews and Muslims — to rediscover their shared bonds'. Source CLIFFORD J. LEVY New York Times.

May peace be with you,



Stephen

[Eol007]

P.S.

Some of you - more decreped ones like myself may have enjoyed popular yet cult works such as Robert Shea and Robert Anton Wilson's - Illuminatus Trilogy See http://www.rawilson.com/illuminatus.html.

Not sure if this should be in the modern Christianity section... but what the heck!

Enjoy,


S

[tcastellon]

Although the Catholic Church may be guilty of many wrong things, it does not justify hatred. Hating is intrinsically evil. I think it says that in the Bible somewhere. Maybe you can hate the sin and love the sinner as Christ did.

quote:Originally posted by Fat_Turkey

The Da Vinci Code...who's read it? Who hasn't?

I'm picking it up as soon as I can, and from what I hear, I know hate the Catholic Church. Anybody who really wants to be Christian, read the Gnostic Christian Gospels. The 4 Gospels in the Bible were only 4 of several HUNDRED Gnostic gospels. Gee, I wonder why they'd only put 4 in? It wasn't because they were trying to be...MANIPULATIVE???

That probably makes no sense.

Just pick up the damned book. I know I am.

[Taalnar]

The DaVinci code is a well written fictional novel.  Its not actually written as a true book.

If you are interested in Gnostism perhaps it is best to read the gnostic gospels themselves?  I myself have read bits and pieces, it is very interesting but DaVinci codes probably isn't the best place if you're looking for "facts".

PS By facts I mean don't rely on something created as a work of fiction

[Lighthouse]

I've read it.  it is written as a mystery thriller, however to my knowledge (I've had a copy of the Gnostic gospels for about 7 years) the accounts within the book relating to them are true accounts.  Contrary to exothen's post, the gospels were written at the same time as the books in the bible, kept by monks for several hundred years than hidden in a cave in the Nag hammadi desert in Egypt in order to preserve them. When the monks in the monestaries that kept them were murdered during the crusades, the secret of the location went with them until the 1940's when they were discovered in some clay jars.  A good starter book for knowing about what the Gnostic gospels are all about is The Gnostic Gospels by Elaine Pagels.  this gives a good overview of the process and helps you understand the dates and tradition used to preserve the codecies.  

I posted a topic a while back relating to the Gospel of Mary Magdeline in relation to the DaVinci Code and here's the thread:
http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=9822

Kerri

[Gandalf]

I know hate the catholic church

Why is it that all christian factions apparantly make it their speciality to openly 'hate' each other?
Surely that is against the original message of your religion?

(I've even heard fanatical american groups calling catholics 'satanists'!!!).

The Orthodox church doesnt like the Catholic or Protestant Church, the Catholic church doesnt like the Orthodox or Protestent church while the Protestent church doesnt like either!

And that just the most simplistic divisions, even within these broad groups are sub-sects who all disagree with each other, often violently!
Why don't you just learn to get along guys? No wonder people are leaving christianity in droves!

And you had better come up with a better answer than 'its not our fault, its their fault!'.

There is also no point in bringing up old atrocities as a means of criticising other factions, this does not help. Ok the catholc church has had a chequred past and the Orthodox church ended up persecuting alot of pagans in the early day as well, but the Protestents dont come off to lightly either, the witch hunts anyone?
Scotland and Salem were two particularly bad examples. The Protestent church also didnt lift a finger to stop or at least moderate the taking all the Native Americans land and ruining their culture either (not to mention the loss of life and humiliation), rather they saw it as their divine duty to 'educate' the 'savages'.
Should we now lay the blame on present day americans for the crimes of their settler ancestors?

Hardly, the fact is, every religious group and/or nation has something of a chequered past, its called 'being human'. Its time to accept that and move on in a progressive manner.

At least the Pope (or whoever was speaking for him!!!) has made a positive move with his statement recently; perhaps other christian factions may follow his example, but I doubt it.

Regards,
Douglas

PS I am coming from a non-chistian perspective here; I'm just trying to explain how negative all this factionalism looks to the rest of us!

[exothen]

Here is a link that should be checked out by those who believe in the authenticity of the Gnostic gospels:

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2004/006/7.26.html

[Lighthouse]

Exothen,

Anyone who has credentials and an opinion can try to debunk the credibility of the other side.  This website is as slanted and warped to me as Pagel's book may seem to you.

By the way if you haven't already done so, maybe a read through of Pagel's book might be something you're interested in so you can formulate your own educated opinion instead of relying on the opinions of others who may or may not have read it or the Gnostic Gospels.  I have a copy of both and was reading the Gnostic Gospels and knew of Pagels long before The DaVinci Code was ever an utterance.   Like the man who wrote this article you reference, she too is a historian, Christian scholar and researcher, she is also versed in Coptic and helped to translate some of the Gnostic Gospels.  She is just as interested in the truth as you and I are.

Kerri

[Fat_Turkey]

The Da Vinci Code...who's read it? Who hasn't?

I'm picking it up as soon as I can, and from what I hear, I know hate the Catholic Church. Anybody who really wants to be Christian, read the Gnostic Christian Gospels. The 4 Gospels in the Bible were only 4 of several HUNDRED Gnostic gospels. Gee, I wonder why they'd only put 4 in? It wasn't because they were trying to be...MANIPULATIVE???

That probably makes no sense.

Just pick up the damned book. I know I am.