Demon Wars and Inner Peace

[The AlphaOmega]

There is no demon war

[James S]

Shadowdancer,

Your post is intelligent and well researched.
I'm interested in seeing where you go with this.

I can see now where the term "demon war" fits in with your thoughts. Seeing you make references to The Matrix, it's rather appropriate to make references to a somewhat over used popular theory such as the demon war concept.

I do agree more with the thought that this "war" is more an internal battle than an external one.

James.

[Adam]

Shadow Dancer - love your signature. It pretty well sums up how I've felt for a while [xx(]

[Anonymous]

shadowdancer



If the core energy of an individual is being threatened, for example survival energy or base chakra energy or red energy, then do you expect those individuals who see this as an intregal part of themselves as gladly accepting the removal of this energy from all of creation? Does it surprise you that they resent and reject the notion that who they are at the core level should be taken out of creation after all survival is the main instruction of this energy? Individual survival does not believe that trust or cooperation is a part of survival nor do they support the idea of what is best for all is best for them. They struggle instead to be first in line, to keep thier job no matter how much they have to lie or connive to sacrifice others  so that  they are succesful. Any attempt to change this universe to peace and harmony then are acts of war to them hence their  struggle. All the rhetoric then of war stems from the defensive posturing that these individuals are using in thier attempt to develop support from individuals with other core energies. They hope that painting the events going on in the spirit world as bad and unloving they can maintain the status quo instead of accepting and participating in the change that is evolving.

[Logic]

quote:Originally posted by Adam

Shadow Dancer - love your signature. It pretty well sums up how I've felt for a while [xx(]

I thought that to be a Terence McKenna quote, but perhaps I am mistaken.

[shadowdancer]

Namaste,
    Thanks everyone for your input  I am currently working on a paper which will detail a hypothesis of mine that is connected to the ideas of a 'demon war', but not centered around, necessarily, that theme.  In the meantime;    
   
The AlphaOmega Posted - 25 July 2004 : 17:10:52          
       

quote:There is no demon war

    Your statement has a level of probability. <--What I just said means nothing.  Really, imho, it all depends upon how you see things.  If you are referring to a nexus in time and space in which there exist entities which are "normally" incorporeal, and said entities become suddenly corporeal(or in the very least are able to affect changes within the time/space continuum(3D); and wage a war upon humans.....it has a level of probability.  On the other hand, if you are referring to a nexus in time and space wherein humans are forced to acknowledge and unconditionally accept the "demons" or "shadows" that have been all locked up under the basement stairs of our hearts, or those very repressed wounds and unassimilated shadows destroy us; en masse, as if a war had ravaged the Earth.....it has a level of probability.  


runlola Posted - 25 July 2004 : 21:37:10
 

quote:Call it something other than demon war. This is just a metaphor for the upcoming alien war. lol. So call it the alien war or children against the negative dark collective. Whatever. This is too entertaining to snuff out. I am not above entertainment. If you still get grief, then publish a book about it, don't waste it here.  

   
    Thanks for the encouragement.  Entertainment is really, really much more important that I realized....It is the stories of our Ancestors that were our entertainment.  We learned too, but not without vicariously experiencing the emotional highs and lows of the mythical characters and ancestral heros and heroines that spoke of the human condition through campfire fairy tales and ghost stories.  A book...hmmm....

James S Posted - 25 July 2004 : 23:53:02
 

quote:Shadowdancer,

Your post is intelligent and well researched.
I'm interested in seeing where you go with this.

I can see now where the term "demon war" fits in with your thoughts. Seeing you make references to The Matrix, it's rather appropriate to make references to a somewhat over used popular theory such as the demon war concept.

I do agree more with the thought that this "war" is more an internal battle than an external one.

James.

    Thanks for the nods  For me, the ideas of art, imitation, and life(which ever way you stack them)are central to the need for us(humans in general, "westerners" more specifically, and young people to be particularly detailed) to reclaim our Art.  The Wachowski(sp?)Brothers who wrote and directed to Matrix trilogy deserve everything they get and no mal intent is directed toward them.  In many ways, they, like many other young, creative people striving to make it big, to escape from the soul-crushing 9-5, are really reaching deep inside themselves in order to hopefully interest some huge multinational conglomerate to buy whatever they have.  I do not blame them for that.  Or for anything really.  In fact, for me, blame is a concept that is not so useful and any context.  Why do I bring up blame in the first place?  Well, just as the parents of that poor trailer trash kid who lit up his momma's home in a deadly comical mimicry of 'Beevis and Butthead', we have how many hundreds of Neo/Oazaki's out there?  What I see the essential problem being is not enough education.  Not to equate that with information.  We need to be able to teach people qualities, concepts and ideas that are really shunted aside in the mass mediatrix.  While Beevis and Butthead were violent, destructive, disrespectful, sex-obsessed, mentally retarded little boys; the question of why? is never asked.  the alcoholic and abusive parents who were never there for them when they were needed...school officials who never listened and only wanted obedience...the endless hours of bathing in the cathode ray....Never really even thought to ask....because everything those two kids did was so damn amusing.(cause it's not me!) Neo as the "one" is nearly completely devoid of a 'why?' ever being posed.  The 'why?'s' presented throughout the trilogy are all Maya-related.  Meaning they pertain to the exoteric aspects of Neo's reality.  We never see neo in a period of deep introspection, nor do we ever hear him voice and inner conflicts with his destined role to any of his comrades...even trinity.  We do see Neo looking a bit confused at times(is it neo we see, or Keanu just being himself?), and in the first installment, quite panicked...but never is it found out why....Morpheus's vision....What was it exactly?  And how did it lead him to believe that one person would save his world?  Why didn't Morpheus have a vision of a woman?  or a group of people working together?  
    James, kids today are very aware,(of which you are more than likely aware)particularly if you find them here on AP.  I think that as people trying our best to be mature...it is really important that we not shy away from, ban or censor their need to express themselves....I came down very hard on some kids here on AP about a year or so ago when I first registered.  They were of course claiming some sort of dragonball powers...I was so frustrated....here i was, having spent years of my life searching for a strong, scientifically oriented theoretical base with which to understand and communicate my own experiences with siddhis and other phenomena...and these kids were just plain liars as far as i was concerned.  but man, kids do that.  they lie.  they exaggerate and make claims that are more imagination than nominal reality.  my point here is:  we have got to try and use the dis/misinformation that young people ingest through the mediatrix, to use that excitement and awe of the whole matrix thing, to get them to do work.  hehe.  spiritual chores.  so young neo, you want to fly and shoot fireballs?  well, sit down, shut up and be patient!  That's all for now man.  One Love

mikel Posted - 27 July 2004 : 14:01:28
 

quote:shadowdancer



If the core energy of an individual is being threatened, for example survival energy or base chakra energy or red energy, then do you expect those individuals who see this as an intregal part of themselves as gladly accepting the removal of this energy from all of creation? Does it surprise you that they resent and reject the notion that who they are at the core level should be taken out of creation after all survival is the main instruction of this energy? Individual survival does not believe that trust or cooperation is a part of survival nor do they support the idea of what is best for all is best for them. They struggle instead to be first in line, to keep thier job no matter how much they have to lie or connive to sacrifice others so that they are succesful. Any attempt to change this universe to peace and harmony then are acts of war to them hence their struggle. All the rhetoric then of war stems from the defensive posturing that these individuals are using in thier attempt to develop support from individuals with other core energies. They hope that painting the events going on in the spirit world as bad and unloving they can maintain the status quo instead of accepting and participating in the change that is evolving.

Namaste mikel,
   thanks for the reply  although i am not sure that i understand what you are saying....are you saying those who believe in a 'demon war' are of the temperment you describe?  if i am on the wrong track here, i will await your correction.  if i am correctly interpreting your statements, i must say that i feel there are those who behave in the way you describe, and i would agree that their behaviour is definitely connected to, but not limited to 1st chakra issues.  they are, from my experience, in a perpetual state of fear for survival.  this i feel is purposeful on the part of government and corporate institutions....it keeps the masses busy.  although, in relating what you say to children who believe in a demon war....i can definitely see the relation to 1st chakra issues and a need to place oneself in a fantasy reality in which they are pitted against their inhuman foes.  but this is really a good reason to reach out to them...before they start pushing, shoving and clamoring for their piece of the pie.


Adam Posted - 26 July 2004 : 19:17:13

quote:Shadow Dancer - love your signature. It pretty well
               sums up how I've felt for a while

Logic Posted - 27 July 2004 : 19:47:13      
     

quote:I thought that to be a Terence McKenna quote,
               but perhaps I am mistaken.

Thanks Adam, I feel like most of the time i am treading water!!

Logic, if you find that it is Terrence, let me know, i would be happy to correct it

I look forward to replies!

[Anonymous]

shadowdancer

You have assumed I would understand myself enough to explain. I am only explaining that those you call having base chakra issues are in need of healing. That what is often described as war is as you have said internal war being expressed externally. WHat I have not heard you say is how to have these same individuals develop the trust in others to be helped when it does not seem to be the nature of thier core energy. We can offer to assist them yet if they see themselves as untrustworthy it is unlikely they can see those that would help as trustworthy. With out violating thier free choice I see no solution? So  what did you have in mind?

[shadowdancer]

Namaste,
    you have posed a really good question mikel....how indeed.  well, i think, just as a safety measure, i will remind myself that, i too, have 1st chakra issues as well.  basically, i want to be sure that i am coming from a place that i am not placing myself in unnecessary dualistic dialectic analysis based upon my inability to emotionally empathise.  with that said, i don't really have, nor do i think there even really exists any single "answer" for each individual's healing process.  one thing i feel fairly certain of is, if we start to condsider the use of applied force in order to redirect the will of another, in an attempt to facilitate the healing process....we inevitably rob peter to pay paul.(it was the closest metaphor i could think of, my apologies)  We end up damaging those individuals we are trying to help.  I do know there are a gazillion options out there for a person to choose from in order to facilitate the healing process...although i feel that the subject i am discussing is at once, tangental(i.e.-the healing process), and at the same time, frustratingly essential(i.e.-the healing process).....hmmm....better off for a different thread.  So that's my two cents on that

[Aileron]

I apologize, though I feel your "thesis" is very well structured and the topic has gained a bit of substance in its continuing growth, I feel much of what you are saying is rather overly-complex. I have actually had to reread a few of the posts in this thread just to follow along.

Let me see if I can get this right through simplification.

What is being spoken of when discussed on the topic of "Demon War" is basically as was said a few times already, the externalization of internal conflict on a massive scale, and that it is war itself that motivates evolution.

That through our individual struggles with the self; good, bad and neutral (If neutrality can exist simultaniously along with both aspects of itself), the growth of the person mentally, physically, emotionally and spiritually could be exponential.

That if the multitude work together in order to analyze and understand the scope of the conflict, growth/change/evolution would sweep the masses on a much larger and swifter scale.

is this the basic understanding I have of the topic at hand?

I believe many of your examples and metaphors to be used in a rather light-hearted manner, and though I think on one hand something of an example such as elves vs. dwarves or beavis and butthead and even the matrix at times can be easily understandable for many, it is also stretched away from the importance of what you seem to be trying to say. Dont get me wrong, I enjoy what you are discussing and find your awareness of the subject to be better fitted than others who attempt similar topics.

I feel you need more references in order to demonstrate similar systems of thought and action through others of like-minded ideas.

I feel you need to develop certain areas of discussion not only more readily for the lamen, but more in depth as well, centering each sub-topic on the main subject and refering back as much as possible to that subject when on other tangents.

dont get me wrong, I find your discussion interesting and in fact would enjoy the continuation of it, I think that you personally would benefit more by way of response and reaction by expanding the idea and working with it nose-to-stone.
There are many factors (as I am sure you are well aware)that have not been illuminated as much as I personally think they should be. Though that is not an insist upon the fact, I just think you could do well to do so.
such as the human nature factor that was developed only slightly during this thread, being that war, in exploring other strands of its concept, is ingrained through "Survival" issues and perhaps even encoded within all of us in order to survive and evolve. That without those unhealthy chakra points centered within people, there are no healthy chakra points. One must counter-balance the other.
This subject of course could be cycled over and over again lifting on many different levels and on and on.

These are just ideas I am throwing out, if you are interested in expanding on your subjects and would like help at all, let me know, or even others on this forum as there are many people here who are highly intelligent.

Out of curiousity, is there any intent in your thread to put action into the topic itself, such as testing/ experimenting with the idea or perhaps even a motivated goal surrounding the idea of quickening the evolution?

[Aileron]

...sorry, elves vs. trolls...

[shadowdancer]

Namaste,
    I read a response that James wrote to my thread "The Child Hero and the Demon War.  It is a brief and articulate and, for all intents and purposes, correct.  In addition, it carries energy of uncomfortability.  There are many reasons for this, many of those reasons are logical and rational.  Given this, I feel that there are other energies and reasons that, if not present in the subtext to James's gentle suggestions of censorship; then possibly present on a deeper/subtler level of vibration, passes through his words.  Or I could be completely projecting.  In the very least, I am not trying to reinterpret someone's words in an act of manipulation.  I am trying to explore a particular energy that I felt as I read James's reply to my initial post; whether that energy came from inside him, me or the general unconscious mind of humanity is a moot point.  

    I think I have a perspective that may help when taken into consideration when trying to find rhyme and reason for the obsession/belief of some that there is a kind of impending "demon war".  In this sense, I must admit to having an agenda.  My agenda is to find something that either is, or can be, directly linked in a positive, emotionally evolutionary fashion, to our daily internal emotional states, high and low.  My guiding framework in this way of looking at things is predominantly my intuition in synthesis with vast amounts of "facts".  Facts being, in this case, those little points of intersection of individual perceptions of the world.  Such as the general agreement of the sky's color, that you can die if shot by a gun, etc. etc.  Facts can be extraordinarily malleable and right now, we live with a world of "facts" that are prodominantly based upon a Newtonian physics-type paradigm.  So my point is, in exploring the possibilities of changing "facts", I will do my best to build bridges toward projected changes.  For example, I will do my best to not make any claims of the existance of some sort of supernatural power without a solid ground of "facts" that may indicate a stronger possibility of such a "powers" existance.  Granted, the "factual" nature of any "facts" are what is called "talking points".  It is understood that there will be disagreements and thus inspirational and creative debate.  Now, before I begin with my thesis, do we all feel we can have a debate without using reasoning like, "just because"?  or something as asanine as "because i am god"?......Good

    Title "Demon Wars and Social Momentum", tries to illustrate that it is war which motivates us to changes.  Throughout recorded human history, war has played a predominant and pivotal role.  We definitely have to consider that in aborigional and native cultures, they knew war, but not nearly in the way Indo-European peoples do.  Tribal cultures may have fought with each other in the hundreds and thousands....We have fought with each other in the hundreds of thousands.  
So this post is shortened a bit; I am going to try and be brief.

What is war?-- For me, on a very basic level, war is the externalization of internal conflict, on a massive scale.

Why are we, as a culture and as individuals, obsessed with war?-- I feel this is so because we as a culture and as individual people, have very few tools to be able to work with internally the schizophrenic struggle that is induced within our individual and collective psyche due to the Lie Perpetuated by the Mediatrix.  Life is not like it is in the movies or tv.  It never has been, never will be, and when you are being raped or getting the crap beat out of you by your father, there is no other "fact" that stands out more.  Life is not like TV.  The moment that a person realizes on some level that he or she has been lied to by "the whole world"; that the internal conflict begins.  

"Perpetual War for Perpetual Peace"  
     To quote from Gore Vidal; although he was referring to our current administrations(US) international policies; he was also accurate on another level.  When we externalize our internal conflict, we effectively create a potentiality for a never ending cycle of violence.  When we hurt others, or are hurt by others, we call upon the need for justice and retribution.  On a microcosmic level, we find the clan struggle.  Although this kind of violent cycle can be devastating, there comes further complication when the cycle of externalizing violence comes on a mass scale.  We start to project our inner conflict onto certain groups of people, or the world as a whole.  We feed into the military-media-industrial war machine.  The result, in the least, is a state of perpetual stress on a multiplicity of levels ranging from job security in service economies that feed off of other countries labor like the US, to dodging bullets in any number of war-torn "third-world" nations.  Which is a direct result of the service orientation of "first-world" nations.  It is this last fact that leads us back inside.  It brings us back into ourselves.  It forces us to see the connections between the way we live, our everyday existance, and the fact(of course some will argue [] this fact)that our luxury is anothers death.  Many people have seen this and are working with the internal reconciliation that every day they are in some way contributing to the world's fill of injustice, suffering and death.  They look again inside for peace.  So for me, it is looking inside, and finding peace inside.

If Peace is Internal; Should we all be Pacifists?
     This is a view that is definitely popular.  It is essential to many eastern religions associated with, or connected to in some way, Buddhism.  I have found Buddhism to be an extraordinarily lucid framework for a world-view, although I am not a Buddhist.  Personally, I do not necessarily adhere to any one particular religious system.  For me, peace is a state of consciousness...a way of being and seeing.  In addition, my agenda is to draw connections between a "demon war" and something that can help us grow and learn and evolve emotionally and interpersonally.  So, for the intent of my hypothesis, I will state that peace does not necessarily equal pacifism.

How can a "Demon War" help humanity evolve?
      So there are some of you who feel there will be an inevitable war between humans and demons manifesting in 3d reality in some fashion.  Let us play around with the subtext a bit.  Demon vs. Human.  Demon comes from the greek "genius".  Really meant a "spirit" of personal inspiration and/or madness.  So the very origin of the word we use to place on our "enemy" comes from something that is part of us.  So using the YCYOR(You Create Your Own Reality)Model, there is reconciliation between the world view of externalization of literal monster-like "demons" and our struggle with our internal emotional demons like pride, envy, self-doubt, mental obsessions and childhood traumas.  Collectively, as each generation comes after us; we pass on built up repressed energy.  Generation after generation becomes more and more severe in its reaction toward a world of lies.  What I believe is that we are seeing the first fruits of a generation of apocalyptically oriented children.  Yes, it is because of the Mediatrix.  Yes, it is because the vast majority of young boys and girls are raped and beaten at young ages.  Yes, it is because our society is as immoral as they come; murdering with one hand while pretending to be praying with the other.  There are individual, as well as collective psycho-spiritual energies at play.  If we, as people who can see the relationship between internal strife and externalized violence, can learn from(and thereby teach)others who can only see what is outside; we can all evolve together.  In the specific context of the "demon war"; what if they are right?  what if there is coming an event in which all the repressed psycho-spiritual energy releases itself through the body???  What would happen if the pain, fear and repressed darkness swept throughout the genetic code creating near instantaneous and massive structural mutations in the body....creating people who were twisted into trolls and goblin-like mutations.  and in those who have cultivated a state of inner peace???  would they mutate to externally represent the stoic and peaceful eyes of and elf?  What if....What if magickal energies will rock this planet, leaving nothing quite the same.....
     What about the war though?  Well, if there is a time when someone's repressed shadow material manifests through their physical body....I personally would find a difficult time not being overcome with hatred for the beautiful elves, what I had become twisted into a goblin-thing.....I would have to have an extraordinary sense of inner peace to be ok with being a troll, while my friends were really really beautiful..........people would start to choose sides.....fighting and war would most likely follow.  For me, this is how I carry these children's message of a Demon War in my heart.  I know that the demons of my world are within me.  I know the importance of accepting and loving my own shadows, thus giving them light.  For myself, it is through giving myself this needed light into the darker corners of my soul that I feel a greater sense of inner peace.  It is through this inner peace that I feel better prepared for whatever may come, tomorrow, the next day, 30 years from now....and the cool thing is, that I don't fear my societal obligations so much....because I know it is a Lie.  Falsehoods pass away, for the Blessed River of Maya is constantly flowing.  The Truth of the Ages sits, unmoving, like the Old Mountain.  Sometimes you can hear then whispering to each other, the way Lovers do....