Our universe is collapsing, not expanding!

[galaxy_storm]

Well, for some reason I feel this is a part of my life mission, to spread this message

I posted about this here once but for some reason I can't find the post, I think it got deleted.

Here are the archived pages (they are no longer online): http://web.archive.org/web/20070214094409/http://www.btinternet.com/~mtgradwell/
Please ignore small innacurates in the documents (if someone ever notices them), they do not disturb the whole of the message

The main ideas of the concept are:
1) The universe is quite small, it's not homogenous, there is only one (gravity) centre, and there's less and less matter as we get closer to the edge.
2) The universe is actually quite small. What we see as distant objects or even the "cosmic microwave background radiation", are multiple images of closer objects! How can this be? Well, because we assume that the light has travelled a straight line, but it has not. The light can orbit around the gravity centre, even multiple times, to create an "illusion" of distant objects. This page illustrates and explains the elliptical light paths: http://web.archive.org/web/20061110033735/www.btinternet.com/~mtgradwell/whatwesee1.html
3) The universe is collapsing. Why does it paradoxically seem to us that distant objects are moving away from us (they are red-shifted), is nicely explained here http://web.archive.org/web/20061110033742/www.btinternet.com/~mtgradwell/universe2.html . (note: red-shift=the light path from an object to us is getting longer, blue-shift=the opposite). Again it is caused by the light path from point A to B orbitting further and thus getting longer as these objects move to the centre. However this does not apply to very close objects and is also explained why (maybe scientists will someday find that close objects are getting closer to us while distant galaxies are moving further from us, and will consider it a paradox of all paradoxes )
This also explains the modern findind that "the rate of expansion of the universe is increasing", it's not because of mysterious dark matter, it's simply because as we are getting close to the gravitational centre of the universe, everything speeds up.

There was also the notion that the universe can be a form of a black hole, this is the reason why nothing can escape.

I hope someone educated on astro-physics can read the pages properly, but even to me it makes perfect sense! I feel like this is a key to all the "unknowns" in the universe that everyone is searching for........


Please excuse me if I've interpreted something wrong from the pages, but this is how I got the image.


My own insights: I believe that our universe is eternally old. Old objects are always falling into the centre and new ones are always being materialised on the edge from light (or so I read it).
We think that the universe is x billion years old, but this is just the time when the close universe around us was born.
So everything in this universe has a beginning and an end, but the universe itself is everlasting. Isn't that cool?  

[galaxy_storm]

...(maybe scientists will someday find that close objects are getting closer to us while distant galaxies are moving further from us, and will consider it a paradox of all paradoxes )...

It's coming...

From http://www.physorg.com/news145113960.html :

The way galaxies move through the cosmos has recently begun to baffle scientists. Even when the gravitational theories of Newton and Einstein are taken into account, the universe is expanding and galaxies are rotating in ways that do not comply with our current knowledge and predictions.

[interception]

Hmmm, very interesting theory.

Would this not be detectable though? Surely, with highly detailed computer models scientist should be able to see that galaxy A, B, C are actually the same galaxy viewed at different angles and ages? Or could it be that one has to look at this galaxy with this in mind to being with, and not just assume they are all very homogeneous but spread out.

You know what they say about assumptions. 

On the other hand: The theory seems messy. Messy, because the whole universe is so neat and perfect, why would this distorted-multiple-images-of-the-same-object be present in this otherwise neat universe? It just seems untidy somehow. Like a flawed science experiment. Or maybe that's what this universe is? 

[Jisei]

Gravity center of the universe?

You stumbled on a different theory for gravity that is different from Einstein's?

[CFTraveler]

Messy indeed.  It seems to propose different explanations for different objects, as opposed to one for the whole universe.

[astral traveler]

1) The universe is quite small, it's not homogenous, there is only one (gravity) centre, and there's less and less matter as we get closer to the edge.

our universe is one of an infinite number of universes in a greater metaverse.  some universes are expanding and some collapsing.

[galaxy_storm]

our universe is one of an infinite number of universes in a greater metaverse.  some universes are expanding and some collapsing.

That may be true, I was just speaking of the one we live in now. The main message is that things may not be what they seem to be...

[astral traveler]

That may be true, I was just speaking of the one we live in now. The main message is that things may not be what they seem to be...

yes, our universe may be collapsing.

[Clockwork]

This has been disproved. I'm sorry but saying that it still has any merit is completely ignorant of current scientific knowledge.

1) do you even know how gnarly of a gravitational field you need to even bend light at a 45 degree angel? Let me give you a hint. Our sol can't even bend light a single degree.

2) Dark matter/energy has been proven to indeed exist.

3) if the light did indeed bend around stuff like that the universe would be freckled with all sorts of blue/red shifts. It would be a well known anomaly that the shifts would be all over the place. Considering that the details aren't exactly well known, I would assume that the shifts are relatively uniform.

4) this one just bugged me. Do you even know how a black hole functions? Its actually just like everything else until you reach the event horizon. that's when it gets freaky. but you a have to get close enough first

[Synergy]

...Of course, universe expansion or collapse is totally moot if you believe that space and time are illusions  

[galaxy_storm]

...Of course, universe expansion or collapse is totally moot if you believe that space and time are illusions  

That may be true, but you live here and now to get known of the space and time, so why not find out more about the physical Universe? 

[CFTraveler]

The word 'illusion' doesn't mean 'doesn't exist', it means 'it isn't what we perceive'.

Hi Synergy.

[Jaco]

My own insights: I believe that our universe is eternally old. Old objects are always falling into the centre and new ones are always being materialised on the edge from light (or so I read it).
We think that the universe is x billion years old, but this is just the time when the close universe around us was born.
So everything in this universe has a beginning and an end, but the universe itself is everlasting.

Have you ever heard of the Big Bounce theory?

[KI Aura]

Have you ever heard of the Big Bounce theory?

Nope, but it sounds like a horrible raps song  . This entire thread has interested me... In fact it leads me to a few different questions. For instance, when it's about to storm outside, or something bad is about to happen, animals can usually sense when things are going wrong and flee, correct? We as humans are supposed to be more intelligent and keen to our surroundings, but as everything, it has it's flaws, but still. If our universe were indeed collapsing and as you get closer to the edge and matter and mass seem to disappear as you say, where does it go, and why haven't we yet been affected? We would know by now if we were collapsing in on ourselves. It seems all to be a huge mystery, right? Cause even if the universe "grows or shrinks", we should have some major effects here in our world. You can't (atleast to my knowledge) make something from nothing. So if this is happening two things could or "should" possibly happen.. A. It's like a bubble or a balloon, what happens when there is too much? POP.. OR B. The opposite, what happens when you suck the air from a balloon? It deflates and goes flat.. But with this being said, matter still my knowledge and mass, can't be created from nothing, so if we are collapsing, where will we go? If we are growing, from what? 

[CFTraveler]

Virtual Particles.

[KI Aura]

Virtual Particles.

those would be .... hah

[CFTraveler]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vacuum_fluctuation

[CFTraveler]

Anyway, something about this statement got me to revisit some apparent notions that have been expressed that are not quite 'accurate'- the idea that an expanding universe (or it's collapsing version) somehow breaks the laws of conservation.
The idea of an expanding universe has all the energy requirements 'buttoned up', so to speak, because it doesn't propose an eternally expanding universe, but to the contrary, takes mapped movements and goes back in time to propose what may have caused it to be doing this.  Contemporary physics proposes (amongst other theories) that the Big Bang (Or Big Something-Else) caused what we are observing, but that eventually it will stop expanding and reverse itself and collapse.  That is not what is observed now- it's still on the way out, but not forever.

  what happens when you suck the air from a balloon? It deflates and goes flat.. But with this being said, matter still my knowledge and mass, can't be created from nothing, so if we are collapsing, where will we go? If we are growing, from what? 

It's similar to me being in a room with a basketball.  I throw the ball and roll it on the floor.  Two seconds later you walk in and see the way the ball is rolling, calculate where it was on point A, see where it is now, and from that data come up where you think the ball started rolling.  That's all inflationary theory says.  In fact, what made Mr. Hubble famous was that when scientists first figured out where the Big Bang must have happened, and when, they also figured out that if we have X amount of energy now, then the explosion that happened in point "A+ a little" must have been 'this much'.  What made Mr. Hubble famous was that he went to point "A+ a little" and found background radiation that was just a little hotter than the rest of space, and when they did the math, it corresponded with the amount that should have been left over from the Big Bang (Or big whoosh, or whatever you want to call it.)
Now, there are other problems with the big bang, and there are other theories such as the Brane theory that fit some of the facts better, but no one has come up with one that covers everything.  Unfortunately the collapsing universe as presented above doesn't cut it, because it looks for different explanations for when things don't fit, and that is not very scientific.
Sure, BB and others don't cover everything, but they're still looking, instead of manufacturing 'reasons' for why it doesn't.
So sure, eventually we still will collapse, and if you really want to know where everything should go when it does, study entropy theory and what happens to quantum particles when they meet their reverse values, and the chances of that happening.  It's too depressing to get into.

[genep]

Well, for some reason I feel this is a part of my life mission, to spread this message  

And it seems to be my mission to convince everyone in MY dream that it makes absolutely no difference... if the universe is expanding or collapsing .. it even makes no difference if the whole universe inside my dream is actually inside some computer that makes me look sound and feel real inside. 
-- wreally reality