linguistic structualism (sounds boring but isnt!!)

[MJ-12]

pes

[Lysear]

You see, thats what I was talking about with the whole loop thing! the problem is that surely anyone who comments on the theory is constricted by society and values, and therefore their opinion is corrupted, ergo invalid?

I agree with you on one point though, it is a whole load of Marxist crap, but very interesting Marxist crap!

[Lysear]

Plus, adding the concept of "occult" or any kind of non-scientific theory brings a whole new dynamic into the melting pot.

I would like to suggest (perhaps wrongly?) that most marxists would be athiests for a start, as they would suggest religion is a construct of the ruling classes with the intent of promising the labour pool a cosy afterlife if they're good little worker bees and do as they're told!

[MJ-12]

Thas

[Lysear]

It's possible to break out of the matrix, but I think it's generally a process of self-discovery and meditation and applying that improved critical eye to the world

Thats what frustrates me! Is it really possible to break out of "the matrix" ? All of our values, ideas about society are founded on the same ideals! good/evil man/woman. even the concept of breaking out of the matrix/not breaking out of the matrix, is understood by dualties!

With this in mind we are all therefore prisoners of our own ideals... or are we?

[Euphoric Sunrise]

I can't help but think of the Tonal/Nagual when i read this [].
From the second we are born we begin to create ideas of the world we have just entered. These ideas are heavily influenced by our surroundings, the people around us, the environments that surround us etc. So, you might say that a lot of what we think and feel has been influenced by society and very little of what we think and feel, if any, has remained untouched. I do think there is a part of us that can break through that social perception, though, and realise what our world truly is. Through our spirit we can break through any boundaries that society has put on us. You say it's when we travel the astral planes, you might say it's when we awaken the kundalini, reach gnosis.
The social part of it all, all our thoughts/beliefs, all our feelings is our tonal. The gnosis is the Nagual.
So really this debate can be summed up by saying that the Nagual is really just a part of the Tonal, but anybody who has experienced gnosis will tell you that gnosis is very different and, in fact, seperate from anything.
Sure we have used social techniqes to reach gnosis, but once we are there, there everything we have learned and known doesn't exist.
What i'm saying is that society (Tonal) can be a great tool to aid us in breaking through the mould and reaching the unknown (Nagual), but once we are there society is useless. In fact, once we are there society doesn't even exist.
I hope people understood that. I didn't really clearly explain what the Tonal and the Nagual are for those who don't know, but i'm sure you can find out. If not, i'd be glad to tell you what i think they are, although i don't really know what the Nagual is [].

You might also like to note that this is all very new to me (spiritualness), so a lot of what i say may be incorrect.

[Lysear]

I just had a fantastic lecture and I thought I'd share some of it with you to see what others opinions of it are. As the title suggests it is about a theory known as linguistic structualism. In a nut shell this is what it is, (Linguistic structualism: "help I'm in a nutshell, how did I get into this bloody great nutshell..." ) seriously though, it is about human constructs, we have surrounded ourselves with our institutions and religions, buildings, economy etc, the theory is about trying to relate to the world outside of this superstructure, which in essence is impossible because whatever we think is due to how we've been taught to live and act. In the world of history there is presently a fierce debate about how far this should be taken. You see thats where the loop is, your stuck and can't get out because if you argue in favour of taking linguistic structualism extremely literally, then your own opinion is worthless! as the theory dicates that you have come to this conclusion through lessons learnt in society!!!

I find this hilarious, but fascinating at the same time, a kind of chicken-egg type scenario without the use of embryos or poultry.

I would love to hear what other people think about these ideas, it seems like it's irrelevant to projection/occult etc but in fact its not. it's one of the corner stones of it all, attempting to think outside yourself, is it possible to really do this or is it merely an illusion?