which Monroe book is best?

[lateralus897]

I myself just ordered 'Ultimate Journey.' If you go to amazon.com and find ultimate journey, you get one of those "look inside" things and it gives you about the first 20 pages of the book. From what I read, looks great. Nice and easy to read and understand, just the way I like it.

[clandestino]

hi Gandalf,
to be honest I think that all 3 books are pretty scant with regard to actual techniques, and how Monroe goes about projecting.

In the first book, he talks about how the OBE's just started happening to him. I think that he gives some basic techniques, but nothing you couldn't get from this forum, or Astral Dynamics. Nevertheless, its a very interesting read. Bear in mind that the views expressed are based on the experiences of the author, his "learnings so far", if you like.

"Far journeys" was my favourite of the three, possibly because I enjoy to read about actual accounts. This book reads like a novel set in the astral, with interludes in waking conciousness...At least that's how I remember it.

"Ultimate journey" struck me as more personal, and involved more complicated ideas. I guess it would probably be the most interesting read if you were a seasoned projector. I struggled with some of the ideas - but again, bear in mind that these are the personal learnings of an individual over many years.

Which one should you get ? number 2. Try and read the others at some point too, they're very good.

[Frank]

Gandalf: I echo Clandestino's comments here as both FJ and UJ are not "workbooks" such as Astral Dynamics, for example. So they contain very little practical information for beginners. Plus, UJ details Monroe's more advanced excusions to the extent where you'd need a fair degree of experience to follow it. I think that's why the write-ups you have seen for UJ tend to go on about it being more to do with Monroe's beliefs and personal philosophy.

What Monroe has actually done in UJ is to describe in a high degree of detail what advanced Astral exploration is like, and the kinds of avenues of thought it opens up within your mind. The actual "Ultimate Journey" he was writing about was the search for what he called: his Missing Basic. Which is why the book takes on a more personal slant. He sets out to trace his roots through the Astral and discovers his "higher self" or I-there as he calls it. Plus, he finds other fragments of himself in all kinds of circumstances and time periods.

FJ as the title suggests is more to do with Astral Jouneys generally. Monroe meets up with two friends AA and BB and some of the antics they get up to are hilarious. Especially where he is trying to introduce BB to what life is like within the Physical. As with UJ, the book perfectly describes what advanced Astral exploration is like, and what fun you can have as well as learning about the true nature of life.

What both books also demonstrate is the clear-cut way Monroe goes about his exploration. No mystical notions, no demons and dragons, and such like. Just methodical, analytical exploration. (Exactly as it should be IMO.)

Yours,
Frank

[clandestino]

! ha ha, I'd forgotten about AA and BB !! they were a couple of characters !

Mark

[Gandalf]

Thanks guys, sounds like FJ is the best one to go for with respect to my curent stage of development, I'll leave UJ until I'm further on as I'll probably appreciate it a lot more.
FJ sounds closer to where i am at the moment - 'the view outside' as it were!

Time to dig out the credit card........

Douglas

[Frank]

Douglas: Yes, I think that would be best to start with as another point I realised was that Monroe used specific words to describe particular events, situations and places within the Astral. These are introduced to you in FJ.

Yours,
Frank

[Frank]

quote:Originally posted by clandestino

! ha ha, I'd forgotten about AA and BB !! they were a couple of characters !

Mark

Yes, especially BB as he had never been human. The first part of chapter 14 always has me laughing my socks off.

Yours,
Frank

[Gandalf]

Yes, especially BB as he had never been human. The first part of chapter 14 always has me laughing my socks off.

Yours,
Frank
-------------------------------------------------

Is it the case then that there are many astral 'persons' out there who have never been human?
I too always thought this the case, Robert Bruce makes mantion of many types of astal beings, right down to astal 'wildlife' as he calls it but also including advanced beings.

But from looking at Bruce Moen's site, his Faq seems to suggest that the vast majority of astral residents are human (meaning that they have been embodied on Earth at some point)

Mind you, perhaps I picked him up wrong as he also mentions all the other physical civilisations out there on other planets, which he deems as being quite likely.

This points out a seemingly differing opinion between Moen and Monroe however, as as far as I can tell, Monroe found no evidence of other planetary civilisations on his travels (we're talking about the RT zone here).
Of course, maybe I've misread it, and anyway there's no law against two projectors having differing opinions!

Douglas

[Frank]

quote:Originally posted by Gandalf

Is it the case then that there are many astral 'persons' out there who have never been human?

Gosh, yes, zillions of them. Though they would not normally be resident within the "Astral" according to the normal mystical definition.

quote:
But from looking at Bruce Moen's site, his Faq seems to suggest that the vast majority of astral residents are human (meaning that they have been embodied on Earth at some point)

Yes, of course, that is because we are talking here of the Astral in the normal mystical sense of the word. But beyond that there are an infinite number of worlds together with their associated realms. We are nothing more than the tiniest of drops in an infinitely large ocean!

quote:
Mind you, perhaps I picked him up wrong as he also mentions all the other physical civilisations out there on other planets, which he deems as being quite likely.

Not only quite likely but true.

quote:
This points out a seemingly differing opinion between Moen and Monroe however, as as far as I can tell, Monroe found no evidence of other planetary civilisations on his travels (we're talking about the RT zone here).

The Moen-methods while they serve a grand purpose in one sense, have serious limitations in another. Plus, while Monroe was perhaps the best in his day, time does move on (so to speak).

quote:
Of course, maybe I've misread it, and anyway there's no law against two projectors having differing opinions!

I think the two cannot be compared directly. Mr Moen himself readily admits he has no talent for the kind of projection exploration detailed by Monroe. Which is, ultimately, the limiting factor in my view.

You can see the various limitations, for example, where the Moen-School have to rely upon the "Interpreter" concept in order for them to gain a fuller picture: even when operating within the lower Astral. Whereas, someone such as myself who who began with the Monroe concept and developed my techniques thus, can now perceive all manner of situations directly.

I suppose ultimately it depends where you want to end up in the grand scheme of things.

Yours,
Frank

[Gandalf]

Thanks for the info Frank!

Yes, I suppose that both Monroe and Moen have their respective plusses and minuses.

Out of interest though, what's your opinion then on the status of other physical civilisations out there in the RT zone universe.
Moen thinks them common place.
Monroe I'm not sure about.
He didnt find any but then, that's not really a suprise as the RT universe is a BIG place.
whats your opinion on this?
I can't see a problem with other physical civilisations but it does tend to go against the grain of those who would like to think that Earth and humanity are some kind of special case and unique in the entire RT universe.

regards,
Douglas

[PeacefulWarrior]

Last year I read all three of Monroe's books and I found them all to be quite compelling and informative.  I must echo what others have said, however, about there not being a whole lot of practical info in them.  Well, actually, it all depends on what level you are at and what you want to get out of them...

Anyway, although it's been a while since I have read them, I do remember a few things in particular which stick out in my mind.  The first is the fact that Monroe was able to help recently deceased people realize they had died and therefore move on to the next step or level.  I was also very compelled by some of the things he shares in the last book, Ultimate Journey...and like Frank said, it BEGINS to give one some idea of what is out there and what can be realized by an accomplished and regular projector (I hate to use the word "projector" as well as OBE, language is so limiting!  And that's coming from one who studies English and language day in and day out!!!)

I echo what has been said, especially by Frank.  Namely about the idea that there is the astral and then there is the ASTRAL as in everything out there.  The immediate "zones" close to ours are often inhabited by "spirits" who once lived, etc. but the further out one goes, or the further in, or however you look at it, you find a yriad of beings and dimensions, etc.  

As an aside: isn't it just wonderful to realize all of this.  I don't know why, but today, in particular, I have been feeling almost giddy to think about the greater reality that myself and all of you, my friends, have realized.  I think that walking around campus today at the university and looking at other people my age made me realize just how limited the average persons views are.  They are all amazing and deep, down somewhere in the mind or self realize the truth but yet they live like a horse with blinders on.  I'm rambling...

Until next time,
Dan

[Ginny]

quote:Originally posted by Gandalf

Thanks guys, sounds like FJ is the best one to go for with respect to my curent stage of development, I'll leave UJ until I'm further on as I'll probably appreciate it a lot more.
FJ sounds closer to where i am at the moment - 'the view outside' as it were!

Time to dig out the credit card........

Douglas

Douglas,

The fascinating story of AA and BB takes on an even deeper meaning when the reader comes to understand why BB hooked up with Monroe in the first place...and just who AA really was all along.

Enjoy!

Love,

Ginny

[Frank]

quote:
Yes, I suppose that both Monroe and Moen have their respective plusses and minuses.

This one of the reasons why I always advise people not to take anything you read too literally (my work included) and to mix and match concepts you feel comfortable with, in order to forge your own path.

Monroe was a great pioneer but his work is by no means definitive. Explorers like B.Moen and R.Bruce, et al, appear to be pioneers in the making within their particular sphere of interest. But mankind is on the verge of discovering a whole new "science" so there is one heck of a lot more to come yet.

quote:
Out of interest though, what's your opinion then on the status of other physical civilisations out there in the RT zone universe.

It depends on your definition of physical matter. Matter can construct itself in ever so many basic ways. What we see as physical-matter is matter that is constructed in just one of them. Also, what we perceive as "our" RT universe is just one of God knows how many. I mentioned before that my regular guide Harath has never been incarnate on this planet. However, he has been incarnate on another planet which is situated within a completely different physical-matter reality universe.

He has taken me there several times now and I'm sort-of getting used to it. But I tell you, the first time we went it was more than a little freaky. It's one thing talking about the possibility of life on other planets, and so forth. But it's yet another thing to actually experience it first hand!

Within the Astral (well, technically they are not in the Astral in the traditional mystical sense as they are a bit far out for that) there are these tubular energy structures you can travel down and they bring you out into other realms of reality. Though doing that is definitely not for the squeamish as it is one *heck* of a roller-coaster ride.

I posted about them a while ago, and said about the time when I entered one and shot off at a terrific speed. Which I expected as I'd ridden similar tubes before. Only what I didn't expect is this one continued for what seemed like forever and, despite pressing every panic-button, I couldn't get back to C1. I did eventually, of course, but not until long after I had resigned myself to the idea I was a goner. Which makes me chuckle now as riding these tunnels has become second nature.

quote:
I can't see a problem with other physical civilisations but it does tend to go against the grain of those who would like to think that Earth and humanity are some kind of special case and unique in the entire RT universe.

We may be unique within what we call "our" entire RT universe. But, like I say, there are ever so many other RT universes.

Yours,
Frank

[Tisha]

Uh . . . Ultimate Journey triggered an OBE for me the first time I read it.  It put me in the right headspace for a launch.

I wouldn't read any of these books looking for "techniques."  You're better off spending your time learning how to sit still.  

Rather, I suggest everyone read the books for  . . . I'm looking for the right word . . . companionship?  There are folks out there who have had OBE experiences and were kind enough to write about them so that we could know we're not crazy.  They tell you how it FEELS and what they've found, so that when you get "out" you (hopefully) won't make the mistakes that they did. This, by itself, is worth the cost of the books.  

[Gandalf]

He has taken me there several times now and I'm sort-of getting used to it. But I tell you, the first time we went it was more than a little freaky. It's one thing talking about the possibility of life on other planets, and so forth. But it's yet another thing to actually experience it first hand!
Frank
-----------------------------------------------------------

This is really interesting, from the experience you had there, was it quite similar to our own, did people have the same basic humanoid forms? were they at a similar technological level? oe was it all radically different.

It's interesting about what you are saying about other RT civilisations from other 'alternate universes' if you like, as this concept is sometimes related by abductees.
Now I am the first to admit that many of these cases are bogus but not all of them. In some of the more reliable accounts, abductees have been known to question the beings about which planet they come from and so on.
On quite common reply they make is to say that it is not quite as simple as that. They don't come from another planet in our physical universe, they often state that they have travelled here from *another universe*.
That is, they have developed a technology that allows them to travel to different physical universes at will, allowing them to visit other civilisations.
What I find quite interesting about this notion is that it fits in quite nicely with what you were describing about the myriad universes out there, and although civilisations might be on their own within each one (on the RT level only of course!), with such a technology as has been described, they can move around to others and study different civilisations and so on.

I know that many people here will say that due to the much vaster vistas and potential of the greater astral realms, this area does'nt really matter, but I still think it important, as I believe that confirmation of the existence of other physical civilisations like our selves, even if in other universes or whatever, would transform the human race, IMO I don't think there's anything else that would do such a thing! It might be the only thing that will shock the human race out of its current situation and change things for the better.
I am sure that this has been considered before but perhaps the impact of such a revelation would be negative and so such an action has been ruled out, more's the pity.

Regards,
Douglas

[Frank]

quote:Originally posted by Gandalf

This is really interesting, from the experience you had there, was it quite similar to our own, did people have the same basic humanoid forms? were they at a similar technological level? Or was it all radically different.

Douglas: I'm sorry if my descriptions come across as being a bit sketchy. It's just that I have only visited 4 times and the first time I was simply too in awe to think properly. Also, Harath has taken me to the same area each time (the area where he once grew up) so I am not sure how representitive this area is with the planet as a whole.

Another difficulty putting a general spoke in the works is, because of the awesome nature of the experience, I'm finding it difficult to continually keep my thoughts and emotions in check. So I often experience reality fluctuations.

From what I have gathered thus far: they have basically the same human form only they are of a smaller build than the average Anglo Saxon. I know there are male and female and they wear basic clothing. I don't know yet whether or not they have the ability to reproduce in a normal Earth sense, and I haven't seen any children.

They have houses and streets similar to what we have. Only the material from which these are made differs from the normal steel, concrete, brick and glass structures we have here on Earth. I'm not sure about transportation. I haven't seen any cars or buses. As I say, they do have streets but the ones I have seen have no markings on them suggesting any kind of traffic instructions. Harath says they can transport themselves as necessary using genetically driven craft which I talk about further down.

They appear not to have any kind of government or monetary system. While they can communicating by talking like we do, they are also in touch with each other on a telepathic or mind-to-mind level as well. They always talk to me verbally, however, as Harath says that is the custom. The people have always been happy to see me and expected my arrival. They smile and laugh just as we do, and they know about our existence here on Earth.  

As far as technology is concerned they are way more advanced than us. For example, their physical-matter appears to be genetically derived. The best I can currently describe it is, rather than manually constructing a house like we do using bricks, mortar, and so forth, they grow theirs out of various kinds of genetic material.

This I admit sounds a bit daft because it conjures up images of planting a house-seed in a patch of soil somewhere, feeding and watering it each day encouraging it to grow. Yet as daft as that may sound, Harath assures me that *is* the basic principle. Though the actual technology, when put into practice, is way different.
   
The planet is subject to a cycle of daylight and nightfall. I am not sure if they are subject to weather conditions in the same way we are, or whether they measure "time" like we do. On my first visit it was night-time and the area was lit by rows of lights which jutted out from the tops of the houses. But they have neither electricity nor lightbulbs, as the light is generated genetically.

quote:
It's interesting about what you are saying about other RT civilisations from other 'alternate universes' if you like, as this concept is sometimes related by abductees.
Now I am the first to admit that many of these cases are bogus but not all of them. In some of the more reliable accounts, abductees have been known to question the beings about which planet they come from and so on.

The subject of "alien abductions" is not one that I know all that much about. While I try to keep an open mind, I'm very much like you in thinking a large number of these cases must surely be bogus.
 

quote:
On quite common reply they make is to say that it is not quite as simple as that. They don't come from another planet in our physical universe, they often state that they have travelled here from *another universe*.

Yes, that is *most* interesting because it ties up with my experience.

quote:
That is, they have developed a technology that allows them to travel to different physical universes at will, allowing them to visit other civilisations.

Funny you should mention that because it is a subject I am currently investigating. Problem is, I can't really say a lot because I simply don't know all that much yet.

Perhaps I ought to make clear that UFO-sightings and the like, really don't interest me. The few bits and bobs I have read about over the years seem too far-fetched for words IMO. You know, all the stuff about the USA being in league with aliens and there's that Area-51 place. Plus all the conspiracy stuff. Okay, there may be an element of truth somewhere. But I reckon it has long-since been lost under layer-upon-layer of kak that's been produced over the years.

But what I do find fascinating is the genetic technology they have on Harath's home planet. Just recently, on the subject of transportation, Harath has been explaining to me about how they have craft made from materials which are genetically derived. And at the heart of this craft is a kind of biological propulsion device. But much of what Harath is explaining goes way over my head.

He tries to explain it simply by relating it to my experience of Astral travel. We have the ability to utilise non-physical energies in order to "travel" thoughout the Astral. Plus, we can do all manner of things besides. What he says is to imagine stripping away all the unwanted abilities, physical attributes, and so forth, and retain just the "ability to Astral Travel" element. This is basically what they create, genetically, which forms the heart of their propulsion system.

quote:
What I find quite interesting about this notion is that it fits in quite nicely with what you were describing about the myriad universes out there, and although civilisations might be on their own within each one (on the RT level only of course!), with such a technology as has been described, they can move around to others and study different civilisations and so on.

Like I say above, there does appear to be at least one other planetary civilisation with the technology to transport themselves between universes. And the people I met there are very much aware of us here on Earth. At the moment my understanding is next to zilch. But I am starting to find this area of discovery quite fascinating (to say the least).

Yours,
Frank

[Gandalf]

Although I am making slow steady progress with phasing I have decided to get hold of some of Monroe's original material.
Which is the best book to get for practical information?
I have heard that the first one has been outdated by his later work so that leaves the last two.
I checked them out on amazon, the second book 'far journeys' looks like a 'practical field guide' if you like, and is what I'm looing for.. The last one 'ultimate journey', Im not so sure about. Some of the reviews say this one is more concerned about his own beliefs and philosophy, not that there's anything wrong with that, its just that a begining 'phaser' might want more practical info.

which of the last two would you recomend? (sure, I could order both but I'm strapped for cash right now!)

Regards,
Douglas