trail and error to increase the quality of lucid dreams

[mindflood]

         i have been having the occasional lucid dream for as long as i could remember. It wasnt until i learned what lucid dreaming was that i began to experiment with it. The first things i started working with were reality checks (ex. flicking a light switch,pinching myself), until i found that the light started giong on and it hurt when i pinched myself.
       Since then i do not have solid reality checks to rely on and its more just a lucid awareness and feeling i get that informs me that I am in a dream when i occasionally have one. Last week I had what i consider to be my yet. NOrmally my LD's only last for 15-30 secs, My last LD lasted for 2-3 minutes.First thing I did was look at my palms, because i read that on here, as soon as i realized it wasnt working, I increased my general awareness calmed down and started tapping objects which kept me lucid.
     
      I owe this small accomplishment through a system of trial and error  over a few years. So where are you on your journery? and what obstacles have you faced?

[Szaxx]

Hi,
Are you wanting to know of trips into the wider reality or lucid dreams?

[mindflood]

lucid dreams i guess, because that is my starting piont from which i plan to project, look at a past life, ect. I havent had luck with meditation or hypnosis so im trying to be grounded in that area. I know currrently I am IN BST when i LD. Is the what you are referring to (wider reality) in contrast to a lucid dream?

[Szaxx]

Hi,
The wider reality is all aspects of non physical concious awareness.
LD's are a fraction of it.
I don't want to categorise where LD's are as they can be related to all of the wider reality.
As they are dreams, or are apparently dreams can it be proved that you are not astrally there but only in possesion of a small percentage and the rest is where the dream lies? Its a very fine line between the two. In LD's you control everything. Out there you are part of wherever your environment is. Some are manipulated easier than others.
In a LD I've done all things from cliff jumping to predicting the future, the environment fits you. In the astral its a different story. You fit the environment.

[Xanth]

Mindflood,

First, welcome to the forums. 

Secondly, my suggestion to you is to forget all these labels you've read about.  Dreams, lucid dreams, astral projections, out of body experience, phasing... forget them all.
What you should focus on is this:  Consciously experiencing a reality which you recognize as NOT being this physical reality.

In LD's you control everything.

That's a misconception, at least in my experience.  To me, "control" is a secondary characteristic of a projection.
I've been lucidly/astrally aware and yet still had no control over anything.
Likewise, I've been lucidly/astrally aware and had complete control over everything.

We can then assume that there's a possibility that "control" doesn't completely rely upon the consciousness having the experience.
I think it's possible that "control" is more dictated by the reality frame you're experiencing, with maybe a bit of "you" mixed in.

Especially since it's all just varying levels of awareness anyway. 
As per my experience... you don't have lucid dreams, you have non-physical experiences where you're lucidly aware.  <-- there's a huge difference between these two concepts.

[mindflood]

[xanth][What you should focus on is this:  Consciously experiencing a reality which you recognize as NOT being this physical reality.
]

          What else are you referring to as "not being physical" besides dreaming when I am asleep? Is this something you focus on in waking reality?

[Xanth]

What else are you referring to as "not being physical" besides dreaming when I am asleep? Is this something you focus on in waking reality?

I'm simply giving you my definition of "projection".
In my experience, a projection is any experience you have within a reality which you identify as not being this physical reality.

[NoY]

that includes daydreaming


:NoY:

[Xanth]

that includes daydreaming


:NoY:

Yup!

[Szaxx]

Hi,
Defining the borders on this is a particularly subjective enigma. In the lucid dream state you are very aware of your environmental powers of change, ie making a dark place light by bringing a sun into the sky. They have a feel to them where you know you have the creative powers of a god. Anything less isn't really applicable to the title.
It's  what you can manipulate instantly having total control. Its also possible to do this with a lesser effect within a lucid dream and within the astral.
To say a non physical experience covers all of this and sounds good to me.
Its quite relative too, if you appear somewhere and have a task to achieve
, a rescue mission, you know so much about what you have to do it seems more than a dream and at times the area of this can be found to exist in the physical even though you've never been near the place.
The labels only help in some cases but not all.
Mindflood, are you more confused than at the start?
Subjective experiences become objective with validations. These happen so how subjective is all this in reality?

Dont we love all of this.

[Lionheart]

 The only problems I have when awaking in a Lucid Dream, then trying to gain control is that you are awaking in the middle of your dream, not the beginning. Your dream is normally in full fledged motion when you gain awareness, then you have to realize that, then you can start to control it. With Phasing or OBE from a Conscious state, you are there from the start of the process, so you already have awareness and control.

[Szaxx]

Hi,
100% agreeable. Its that knowing you're in a dream thing. You know you're non physical and this wakes up a frame of mind where you have to of implanted the fact of being in total control of everything. You know its a dream by its feel, also in many cases with this awareness the dream is.stopped putting you in a blackness where you can construct absolutely anything by thought. Its amazing having this creativity at your disposal. It makes flying really boring by comparison.
Thats a lucid dream to me.
Waking up part way through a normal dream into lucidity is the start of this. Drop some anchors with the fact that you're lucid. Its not too difficult. Once primed you're off. The intent has to be strong to gain this awareness or you lose out. The biggest problem is being too tired, your memory of the anchor may get delayed and then lucidity fades giving you the standard dream back.

[Xanth]

The only problems I have when awaking in a Lucid Dream, then trying to gain control is that you are awaking in the middle of your dream, not the beginning. Your dream is normally in full fledged motion when you gain awareness, then you have to realize that, then you can start to control it. With Phasing or OBE from a Conscious state, you are there from the start of the process, so you already have awareness and control.

Are you using the phrase "trying to gain control" in the same way I use "increasing awareness"?

[mindflood]

        to SZaxx,
     
            i am a bit more confused, my concept of dreams had to do with brain frequency (alpha beta theta) and your level of awareness. And that your  awareness make the difference between LD's, AP's and psychic powers. The labels help me explain to myself what I experience but i KNow that no concept or idea can accuratly depict the "experience". I know what you mean " its hard dilemna" because what defines the non-physical? Pure energy with no mass? If so that would make light a non-physical experience, also poeple who can see auras and spirit worlds in waking reality make it harder to draw that line.

I dont know what you mean by "Subjective experiences become objective with validations. These happen so how subjective is all this in reality?"

[Lionheart]

Are you using the phrase "trying to gain control" in the same way I use "increasing awareness"?

Kind of, you need Awareness first to be able to even attempt to gain control!  

[Xanth]

Kind of, you need Awareness first to be able to even attempt to gain control!  

Is it your experience that you've always been able to gain control of the environment after gaining an appropriate level of awareness?

[Lionheart]

 Every single time from a LD. First I will become aware of my surroundings, who's there, where I am, what I am doing. Then I will start to play/experiment with what's possible. Starting first with simple things like maybe creating a door, where there isn't one. Then going through it and seeing where it leads. If I don't like the new area, I create an door and repeat the process. I find that I don't always like to create a intended destination, I ask to be shown what I need to see, where I need to go, then I go there. This is why I call it a learning experience. It helps fill in the missing pieces per say. During the our waking physical experience we have many questions or obstacles. If you allow and watch, you will see that during the nighttime in the NPR you are finding solutions! 

[Szaxx]

Hi,
Mindflood,
Subjectivity is ones own experience. We have our own way of interpretation and this differs from person to person. With this everyones report is different.
In maths,
1+5=6
Also 2+4=6
And 3+3=6
See whats apparent? Each sum is different but the answer is the same.
Theres a validation thread on this site and a read of it will show that the subjective experience label typically fixed to dreams actually becomes a reality or objective experience.
The experience itself is subjective but analyse thousands and groups start to appear. These labels attempt to categorise each group experience but are not neccessary knowledge.
In simple terms, we need fuel in the tank to drive the car. We dont need an in depth understanding of the combustion process complete with its methodology.
Perhaps a little clearer?

[mindflood]

"the groups of dreams appear".. which are along the same lines as archetypes and elementary ideas.

[Szaxx]

Hi,
Keeping things simple, yes. There's the dreams where the event actually takes place sometime later. Another group where you are going somewhere and remember dreaming of it exactly as you now see it, the dreams  from decades ago.
There's meeting people who you know were in a dream. These are many and can't be shoved under a subjective title.
There's many more like this showing connections with physical reality.
If all the dreams we have were subjective then none of the above would be heard of. As it is heard of then the dreams we have can be objective. This is where the validations come to fruition.

[mindflood]

this morning i found myself in a strange building. I was walking around when i said to myself. What am I doing? I should be taking advantage of this. The dream wasn't vivid and the vision around my periphery was blurry. I tried affirming "clarity now!".. nothing.. I tried sitting down to meditate. Bad idea, as for when i sat down and began to relax everything went black and i lost the dream. Still in that state, I imagined my house and ended up there, I figured I might as well go out with a bang, for I dont know how long this will last. I basically ran outside my house naked, my cat followed, and i threw rocks at windows. Eventually i ran into characters from a dream prior to the one i was in, and I lost my awareness.

Does anyone have an affirmation thats worked for them in lucid dreams?

[Lionheart]

Does anyone have an affirmation thats worked for them in lucid dreams?

Just this one "I am Consciously Aware in my dreams". This being said many times during the day and night, especially before you go to bed will prompt that once you are in a dream, you will hear these words and react to them accordingly.

[Contenteo]

I usually have the brain chatter 'What is this?' as something otherworldly occurs.

Then I'll feel the classic 'pulled away' feeling, and I'll be like 'Hey! this is a dream.' Then a LD starts.

Cheers,
Contenteo