Help. I've changed And I'm Worried...

[UnknownToTheKnown]

Hi guys. I made a point of registering with a forum to post my "problem" because it's getting out of hand. Any assistance would be beyond appreciated.

It started when i went to a countryside cottage in summer. I stayed their for nights, but one night i woke out of a very light sleep and had some slight dream imagery in my mind, when for no apparent reason i said to myself - lets think of a good environment to Astral Project. I first thought of mountains, then flat desert (I currently live in Dubai) and almost instantly afterwords that high pitched sound in my ear became lower in pitch, very loud and very soft. Soothing on the ears. I was lying on my stomach and i could feel deep strong vibrations in my abdominal area. I had read enough about Astral Projection and OBE's to know this was probably the vibrational state. But i couldn't hear any pink noise or static. At least i don't remember doing so. It was crunch time, the stage before leaving my body. And i have always wanted to Project, i used to spend countless days trying and only ending up falling asleep. But now i was worried, cautious so i opened my eyes. And i've never forgiven myself for it.

Now. I got back to my home home and every since that experience sleeping has never been the same. I constantly hear this high pitched sound in my ear and i can always feel slight quiet vibrations in my body. Not from my muscles, like it's on a completely different layer of itself. And now i have this tendency to phase between a the dream state/hypagogocic (sorry if i spelt that wrong, it's one hell of a word) to the waking world. And everytime i start to enter my dream state, i hear noises of people talking in the background, sometimes music (i love music) and the occasional image forms, for no reason i bring myself out of it. And whenever i do the high pitched sound becomes louder, and the vibrations stronger. But thats about it. Not the same vibrational state i experienced in the cottage.

Now, yesterday i got too deep into my dream state and once again, for no reason - as if it was beyond my control i came out of it and my mind felt like it had been pushed back into my physical body. Very smoothly though, not like i was falling back into my bed with a jolt. No. It was like i was on a hammock swinging and my consciousnesses swung back into my physical body. It was disorientating for a second, but come to think of it. Pretty cool.

I want to Astral Project badly but i'm gullible. 20 people can say nothing bad happens but it only takes 1 person to say "demons got into my body, i couldn't return for hours" to worry me. I need to be reassured that i will hopefully have the time of my life. Once i get some good techniques. It's getting to the point i'm actually cautious to go to bed.

MAYBE it is relevant to note that i do meditate when i can. But i don't think I've managed to balance or even activate one of my chakras. Although i wouldn't know what that feels like. I need to get my third eye going or possibly my crown?
Thanks for reading. And i'm sorry if this is in the wrong forum, i had to get it off my chest.

[Stookie_]

I wouldn't worry about chakras or anything like that right now - maybe when you get more experience and become comfortable with the process. It sounds like your at the fear stage. I think pretty much everyone who learns OBE has to go through this. No one will ever be able to convince you it's 100% safe. You have to be determined enough to get through your fear. It's all in yourself. Think strong and positive and know that not only are you going to be OK, but that you'll eventually improve your entire being. There's so much to gain.

It sounds like your right there, you just need to stay motivated and keep practicing.

[Bedeekin]

I've seen some terrifying things. But I have also had the most wonderful amazing experiences.

Once during an experience I was beaten to a pulp by a gang of six faceless guys... another time I watched some kids kicking a fox to death.... Then... I saw a guy falling out of a 15 story building... he hit the floor, bounced... then split open... This guy raped...

Hang on.. These are physical experiences... Sorry... these were REALLY terrifying though.

Anything I have experienced nonphysically has been paled into insignificance when put against the evils in this reality.

Fear may help you anyway. You say you are a bit fearful to go to sleep... this is good... this is how I started. You are hooked now anyway... so you need to start to get used to it. 

[roman67]

I have also faced some unforgettable experiences. When you will experience all this you will be comfortable with this process. You just need to do more and more practice.

[Skrylar]

I have a somewhat disconcerting effect like this.  When I tried to consciously project, it felt like I was trying to die so I stopped.  On occasion, I get these strong pulses from sleep that put me in a separate state; this second one happens most often when I've spent time pondering, discussing or reading spirituality heavily and brings with it some physical things like:

• Problems consuming normal food; thus far grapes seem to be okay though.
• Sometimes feeling like there's a hole in myself
• Serious discomfort from being near strangers, especially a lot of them

As for astral demons; usual rules apply here: Learn self defense (shields, mental centering), find good friends (spirit guides, or trustable spirits.)

[UnknownToTheKnown]

I have a somewhat disconcerting effect like this.  When I tried to consciously project, it felt like I was trying to die so I stopped.  On occasion, I get these strong pulses from sleep that put me in a separate state; this second one happens most often when I've spent time pondering, discussing or reading spirituality heavily and brings with it some physical things like:

• Problems consuming normal food; thus far grapes seem to be okay though.
• Sometimes feeling like there's a hole in myself
• Serious discomfort from being near strangers, especially a lot of them

As for astral demons; usual rules apply here: Learn self defense (shields, mental centering), find good friends (spirit guides, or trustable spirits.)

How can i can shield myself? All i do is imagine pure whiteness all around me, but sometimes that can be hard to do while my mind wanders.

[spark]

Hi.  It sounds like you are having very normal experiences.  And, these things can be very scary.  Personally, I tend to think that it is probably a bit foolish to go headstrong into things without caution.  For me, I am in my 40's, and I have had perhaps thousands of so called OBEs.   I am not certain, but I do tend to think that there are perhaps some risks that many people disregard.  However, I also don't think that the risks mean that one should run for the hills.   I think it is helpful to learn how to avoid the risks.   Perhaps, it is similar to walking along a roadside on a sidewalk instead of running back into one's house in fear of cars.  For me, within the early stages of the dream state, I would often confront things that scared me (seemingly, negative entities).  The way that worked for me was to 1) focus on feelings of love and 2) redirect my attention.  In short, love seems to perhaps really be "empowering" -- kind of like being in harmonic oscillation with the world.  Scary things seem to just melt away once one embraces this power and also turns one's attention elsewhere.  The attention aspect is key too.  By simply thinking "good bye" one seems to be able to move away from scary things.  Anyway, so that is perhaps a way for you to enter this state and to know how to remain on the sidewalk.  Anyway, there are many wonderful steps along this path.  For me, the initial OBE state was very exciting since it felt like such an enormous "change."  But, there are more steps too.  For example, perhaps someday you will start to experience some of these things in the waking life -- i.e., there are wonderful aspects that are applicable to daily life in wonderful and helpful ways -- such as, e.g., interacting with so called energy/chi/prana.  With all of these experiences, I also believe that it is very important to avoid making assumptions -- for example, if you get into the OBE state and see your grandmother, or Jesus, or the Pillsbury Dough Boy, don't assume that you saw what you perceived.  Life is complex and it is best to go with the flow, to embrace in faith and to observe along the way ... well, from a safe vantage point on the sidewalk.... Anyway, don't worry.  This is all really wonderful.  Enjoy.     

[Bedeekin]

What risks? What?

Putting any idea of risks in anyones head prior to having the experience is just going to reinforce their fear.

Spark, if you have had perhaps thousands of these 'so called' OOBEs then why are you giving advice that seems to come from somebody who has read about it instead of somebody who has never been harmed or come to harm?

Astral demons are your own... they will swarm to you if you want them to.

On the other hand if you disregard demons or the very notion of them, then after 4000+ experiences and 27 years later you can safely say that either...

A) Demons are based upon dogma and belief and exist in the mind of the beholder

B) By disregarding them you become immune and don't get harmed

but... for some reason... the notion of a demonless 'astral' world leaves some people upset... as if they require the demons and evil present because it makes them... I don't know... makes them feel whole? or the sense of the black and white balance of of good and evil. Something they can banish with faith?

Why do people seem to get upset and defensive when someone says with experience and truth... "there's no such thing as demons?"

[Astral-Trea]

Hi Unknown,

It sounds to me like you are doing very well so far.. you have gotten to a state where it is easier to get to the state right before exit.. you just have to go with it now. All of the sounds, and scary things that you may feel when its about to happen just keep you from completing the exit. From my understanding, all of these things are just symptoms and go away usually once the exit is complete. I'm not sure why these things happen.. one would wonder since it seems to happen to everyone at some point, if it isn't somehow telling us to NOT astral project.. like as if it is some type of alarm system in place.. but I feel strongly that isn't the case. I think if anything it is your vibrations shifting through different frequencies while exiting, almost like a dial on the radio that goes through static, then a station, more static, another station until you finaly find that clear station you are looking for.

The fear thing can be hard to get past, I have been working on that myself.. but I'm getting better. I have heard also to try projecting during the day rather than night.

Good luck!

[Xanth]

You'll project when you're ready.  Don't force it.

[spark]

Hello again.  As for the inquiry from "Bedeekin," I have not referred to any Deamons.  Personally, I think so many people out there speak in such absolutes with very little bases to go on.  There are many things one perceives in various states of mind, and grasping onto ideas or beliefs is, in my opinion, one of the greatest things that holds people back.  I believe that it is critical to growth to avoid making inane assumptions of any kind.  I do not say that there are deamons (whatever a deamon is by the way - would it be a horned goblin, or would perhaps an frightened person in a dream state's energy body be a deamon, or whatever else).  I do say, however, that there are perceptions of various things and clearly various interactions of very complex and hard to fully grasp kinds (e.g., energy wise, etc.).  Whether or not such things we "perceive" are real or not is very hard to say.  However, I do think that at the same time it is foolish to emphatically say that nothing dangerous or risky exists, and that the world is free and safe.  Then, why not just walk freely into the jungle.   There are beatiful trees and birds and the sun will shine on you 99% of the time.  In reality, we all do not know very much.  But, we do learn bits at a time, and some of us learn some more bits than others.  I was suggesting a very useful and real way to deal with issues.  Also, by the way, I also believe that there "might" be other issues that even just relate to one's energy body due to OBEing.  That is, I think it "might" be possible to negatively affect one's energy body in some ways doing OBEs frequently (well, doing some improper things perhaps, like very forced/jarring exits from sleep, etc.).  I am not certain about that, but, based on experience, I do wonder about it, and I think it is kind of fools talk to assume that all is free and clear.  To be honest, I have read very little.  I have grown by personal experience and found a few high end folks (such as, e.g., Robert Bruce, who, by the way believes fully in so called neg entity risks) that I can discuss matters with at a much higher level -- i.e., there are not many folks that have a great depth of OBE experience, energy body experience (e.g., sensations of all chakras, etc.), kundalini experience and more.  I've found that some knowledgable folks do frequent this site.  But, perhaps it is hard to identify to new comers.  As I recall, Xanth seems to have a good depth of experience.  I also have a good depth of experience.   But, I have read very little.  And, I realize tha tI don't know all that much too.  Or, rather with all of my experience, I am able to see that there is much more to the picture that is well beyond me.  I am not really up to speed on various common theories, etc.  Personally, I think it has both helped my growth, and, at times, slowed it.  But, overall, it has brought me far and in the manner that feels the best to me.  Personally, I would recommend that all folks just proceed at there own pace, rather than following advice on the Internet- unless, such advice resonates very strongly with the person. 

[Astral-Trea]

Spark, you make some good points here but I just wanted to say that Robert Bruce has said and written that while there are negative entities out there, they cannot hurt you.. Only scare you. The worst he says that could happen is your energy being drained since he believes it is a copy of you not your actual ethereal body, it doesnt actually hurt you.

He also says you cannot have your cord cut or die or get lost... Or have a negative entity jump into your body. I think these are the main things people worry about that have all been debunked. After all, we are all enternal beings... These bodies may die but our souls will never.. Which goes along with that scientific saying that energy and information can never cease to exist and matter cannot either, it can only change forms. Just my thoughts on it

[spark]

Thanks "Astral-Trea."  First, I would like to emphasize strongly that I agree that so called negative experiences (whatever you want to call things) are readily avoided by doing that which I originally mentioned ... i.e. 1) focus on love and 2) re-focus one's attention elsewhere.  That is essentially the same thing as others are saying here, but others are, I believe, being less specific.  That is, by embracing in the knowledge that these things don't exist and/or cannot harm onesself, one tends to embrace in love and focus elsewhere.   But, I think it is more helpful to find answers.   I also think exercises like building walls, etc., are helpful, but I still tend to think that the key is love and attention.   Second, I believe that Robert Bruce considers negative things as having substantial impacts on folks.   Perhaps, they won't bite one's head off like in a horror movie, but if you read Robert's information, he does suggest a lot in terms of emotional problems, such as, e.g., depression, etc.  Basically, things like draining energy, etc., in my opinion, are real risks.   Anyway, we are all not afraid of cars, or bears, or bees, but we all have learned to live in a world with those things and how to avoid them.  I think this is perhaps similar.  They are essentially a non-issue much of the time.  Most of us dont have to look left and right to avoid bees or bears at every step.   But, to foolishly march along proclaiming that they don't exist is, I think, kind of silly and presumptive.   Again, i am not saying that they do exist, nor what "they" are ... whether entities, energy phenomena, parts of ourselves or imagination, but I do believe tthere is a good likelihood that some problems can occur and that it is best to have good idea of what one faces ... i.e., by problems, i mean mostly things that might affect one's energy body, which might lead to well being, happiness, and perhaps health in some ways ... even perhaps, just getting a headache, or whatever.  Anyway, for me, I am highly energy sensitive, and I feel energy from people, trees, whatever very intensely, and I feel it thru my body, etc.  As such, I also tend to have some perceptions that seem to suggest some activities or instances as maybe having negative impacts, such as, e.g., draining, etc.  I tend to think that the so called enegy body or whatever term one wants to use is very complex and way being my current grasp ... But, I think it is unwise to make presumptions about how all is and works, unless of course one is holding the blueprint of the original design of all things ... in a fashion that such can be readily observed and referenced (i.e., to all those that hold that we all know everything at our core ... which, is perhaps or maybe even probably true ... but, foolish to profess as such, I think). 

[spark]

One more thing, I would like to note that I am typing quickly, I when I say something like it is "foolish" to process something or the like, I don't mean to imply that anyone here is being foolish.  To the contrary, I think that folks here are rather smart, open minded and the like ... I love that all the folks here are trying to work through these unusual experiences.  This path is like a riddle sometimes, i think.  A kind of comical one at that.  Anyway, I have also had many similar thoughts and I am also not entirely certain myself.   When I say that something is "foolish," I mean for folks to contemplate whether such an activity really makes sense.  Thanks...