Help with astral projection from lucid dreams

[martits]

Hi. I have started polyphasic sleeping with the everyman cycle (3 hrs core sleep then 3 x 20 min naps) and have found that I
get into really vivid lucid dreams on my first nap.

I realise that I am in one and as soon as I do, I start to float because I know that I can and my physical body starts to tingle all over.

Everything is very vivid and clear but I know that I havent astral projected because I can't see my body and things in my room are not as they are in real life.

What do I do from here to astral project?

Sometimes I just float there concentrating and even asking for some entity to help me project but nothing happens. I either wake up or continue dreaming.

[Xanth]

Hi. I have started polyphasic sleeping with the everyman cycle (3 hrs core sleep then 3 x 20 min naps) and have found that I
get into really vivid lucid dreams on my first nap.

I realise that I am in one and as soon as I do, I start to float because I know that I can and my physical body starts to tingle all over.

Everything is very vivid and clear but I know that I havent astral projected because I can't see my body and things in my room are not as they are in real life.

What do I do from here to astral project?

Sometimes I just float there concentrating and even asking for some entity to help me project but nothing happens. I either wake up or continue dreaming.

You don't have to do anything else from here... you're ALREADY projecting.
A lucid dream is a projection.  Just place your intent to go do/see whatever it is you want.

The misunderstanding most people have is that they need to return to their bodies in order to then "project"... as long as you're experiencing a reality which you identify as not being this physical reality AND you're aware of this, then you're projecting.  Think about that for a second too... it now opens up a lot of experiences which you might have had and written off as not projections which actually are! 

Most people are much better at projection than they even realize.

[Contenteo]

Yup, that is absolutly a project. IMO, there is no such thing as directly visiting this plane of reality through projection. People project into their mental models of reality and quickly assume, because of the similarities, that it must be this reality. Their are many variations of the way you life exists in your mind. Greeks called these mental palaces. The structure of the 'lower astral' you visit is most often correct in terms of walls and doorways, however furniture and decor is usually much different.
It's amazing vivid, isn't it? And your memories. They are as palpable as your waking ones, even Moreso sometimes.

This is not to say there isn't a deeper. There definitely is.
If you want to go deeper, look into BSTs, belief system territories.
When these realities start getting many independent entities that are beyond your 'intent control', usually in much vaster areas too, you've made it. There are plenty of juicy articles in the archives on this.

Cheers,
Contenteo

[martits]

Thanks for your replies.

Although I love this dream state I can't say I'm not a little disappointed as I was expecting another level from here. I've seen topics discussing the merits of lucid dreaming vs AP and I can't see any difference personally. To me this is just a lucid dream. I am aware that I am dreaming and I can create scenarios with my mind.

The trouble is, I am not very good at imagining the things that I want to see or do. I seem to only be able to fly out of my window and not be able to transport anywhere due to the limitations of my mind in changing the scenery. Sometimes I can't even imagine anything and its all black. I had another go last night and as I was trying to project, I couldn't stop spinning in a circle until I woke up. This was really annoying! lol.

The other reason that I am disappointed is that I have read so many accounts of people saying that this is absolutely real. That you are basically a ghost and you can go to any real life location and prove it by going somewhere you have never been and be able to recollect what objects where there and verify them later. Also I have heard that you can feel things and also speak to dead family member and aliens.

I was hoping that this would be some sort of confirmation of what happens when you die but I don't buy it at all. I mean I wasn't 100% believing all the stories but I am open minded and thought I had nothing to lose by trying. I really hoped it was all true though.

I will still be practicing as it is a lot of fun and will certainly improve my dreams now that I can concentrate on having fun instead of going to the next level. I will also try reading up on what you suggested.

One thing I can't explain though, is the physical tingling throughout my real body when I get in this state. Is this normal?

[Xanth]

Thanks for your replies.

Although I love this dream state I can't say I'm not a little disappointed as I was expecting another level from here. I've seen topics discussing the merits of lucid dreaming vs AP and I can't see any difference personally. To me this is just a lucid dream. I am aware that I am dreaming and I can create scenarios with my mind.

The trouble is, I am not very good at imagining the things that I want to see or do. I seem to only be able to fly out of my window and not be able to transport anywhere due to the limitations of my mind in changing the scenery. Sometimes I can't even imagine anything and its all black. I had another go last night and as I was trying to project, I couldn't stop spinning in a circle until I woke up. This was really annoying! lol.

The other reason that I am disappointed is that I have read so many accounts of people saying that this is absolutely real. That you are basically a ghost and you can go to any real life location and prove it by going somewhere you have never been and be able to recollect what objects where there and verify them later. Also I have heard that you can feel things and also speak to dead family member and aliens.

I was hoping that this would be some sort of confirmation of what happens when you die but I don't buy it at all. I mean I wasn't 100% believing all the stories but I am open minded and thought I had nothing to lose by trying. I really hoped it was all true though.

I will still be practicing as it is a lot of fun and will certainly improve my dreams now that I can concentrate on having fun instead of going to the next level. I will also try reading up on what you suggested.

One thing I can't explain though, is the physical tingling throughout my real body when I get in this state. Is this normal?

That's probably because you didn't have your full waking awareness.  When you have that, I call it an astral awareness, it simply blows everything else out of the water. 

[Fusions]

That's probably because you didn't have your full waking awareness.  When you have that, I call it an astral awareness, it simply blows everything else out of the water. 

Can you tell us about the differences?

[Szaxx]

In an astral projection you are the same aware of all the same as when physical. The environment is another physical world and it's extremely real. The inhabitants usually go about their daily routines in a similar way we do. Some you can communicate with and these can have their own persona. A few are easy and helpful others will choose to ignore you. If your mindset is doubting anything this can create an environmental change to suit what you are thinking. If it's an unreal or dreamlike aspect, this will be created. Your thoughts manifest and controlling this isn't the easiest thing to realise.
Generally fear is the most proficient environmental adjuster and this is usually obvious. Doubts fall second in the list.
When you have had many experiences you begin to fine tune yourself on these issues. Eventually to simply be yourself and reduce the limiting physical world thoughts, you begin to experience greater awareness and your extra senses start to be accepted as a normal part of it all.
Moving things with a thought or reading anothers mind is a natural ability you almost take for granted.
This applies to those experiences where things are like our world. There's many others where nothing can be referenced to the physical. These are so different.

[Xanth]

Can you tell us about the differences?

To build a bit upon what Szaxx said...

People BELIEVE there is a difference between the two experiences because they do FEEL differently.

The difference between a lucid and astral awareness experience is the same "level" as the difference between a dream and a lucid awareness experience.
When you gain enough awareness to simply realize you're dreaming, you still might not really remember much about *YOU*... the experience "clears up" slightly.  Now "clears up" is really a horrible way to describe it, but that's all I can think of right now.
When you gain MORE awareness, up to the point when you have the same kind of awareness that you have while you're physically awake (I call this a "waking awareness"), then things "clear up" even more and the experience feels even more different and removed from a "dream". 

[Fusions]

To build a bit upon what Szaxx said...

People BELIEVE there is a difference between the two experiences because they do FEEL differently.

The difference between a lucid and astral awareness experience is the same "level" as the difference between a dream and a lucid awareness experience.
When you gain enough awareness to simply realize you're dreaming, you still might not really remember much about *YOU*... the experience "clears up" slightly.  Now "clears up" is really a horrible way to describe it, but that's all I can think of right now.
When you gain MORE awareness, up to the point when you have the same kind of awareness that you have while you're physically awake (I call this a "waking awareness"), then things "clear up" even more and the experience feels even more different and removed from a "dream". 

Alright, because I have LD dreams where I am not that much in control and cannot fly and am still very much 'in' the story.

[Xanth]

Alright, because I have LD dreams where I am not that much in control and cannot fly and am still very much 'in' the story.

That sounds like, to me,  a nonphysical lucid awareness experience then.   You'd have too drum up some more awareness for it to become an astral awareness experience. 

[martits]

I think I'm starting to understand the difference, although I'm struggling to get my head around it.

So the LD is something that you realise you are in but kind of continue with the story you are in but have more control. But when you AP, you kind of reset your dream and start again to create what you want. Is that right?

If this is the case, I must have AP'd quite a few times without realising it. Although I have fallen back into a dream state. Now that I know this, I can take advantage of my time in this state and explore it more. I'm definitely not afraid of this, but my imagination is hard to control sometimes. I could be just floating in a dark room really struggling to make anything pop up. And I have never spoken to anyone in this state. I suppose I will improve with practice right?

[Xanth]

I think I'm starting to understand the difference, although I'm struggling to get my head around it.

So the LD is something that you realise you are in but kind of continue with the story you are in but have more control. But when you AP, you kind of reset your dream and start again to create what you want. Is that right?

If this is the case, I must have AP'd quite a few times without realising it. Although I have fallen back into a dream state. Now that I know this, I can take advantage of my time in this state and explore it more. I'm definitely not afraid of this, but my imagination is hard to control sometimes. I could be just floating in a dark room really struggling to make anything pop up. And I have never spoken to anyone in this state. I suppose I will improve with practice right?

Honestly, I really wouldn't worry about it.
All you need to focus on is having non-physical experiences... it doesn't matter how you get into the non-physical, just that you get there and have retained/gained some level of awareness of yourself. 

Really simple.  Let the rest come later.

[astralee]

To build a bit upon what Szaxx said...

People BELIEVE there is a difference between the two experiences because they do FEEL differently.

The difference between a lucid and astral awareness experience is the same "level" as the difference between a dream and a lucid awareness experience.
When you gain enough awareness to simply realize you're dreaming, you still might not really remember much about *YOU*... the experience "clears up" slightly.  Now "clears up" is really a horrible way to describe it, but that's all I can think of right now.
When you gain MORE awareness, up to the point when you have the same kind of awareness that you have while you're physically awake (I call this a "waking awareness"), then things "clear up" even more and the experience feels even more different and removed from a "dream". 

just look at my post thats what i found you may not have any  real life memories when lucid untill you start doing mindfull meditation,then it just feels like true freedom  than memory loss.

[martits]

Honestly, I really wouldn't worry about it.
All you need to focus on is having non-physical experiences... it doesn't matter how you get into the non-physical, just that you get there and have retained/gained some level of awareness of yourself. 

Really simple.  Let the rest come later.

Good advice. I guess everyone has their own interpretation. I was just unaware that I was at the AP stage. I can now concentrate more on building my experiences and enjoying it. Thanks for your help everyone 

[Xanth]

Good advice. I guess everyone has their own interpretation. I was just unaware that I was at the AP stage. I can now concentrate more on building my experiences and enjoying it. Thanks for your help everyone 

Exactly.   I wish more people would realize the truth that people are better at projecting than they end realize and that projection isn't some kind of mystically hard step in spiritual progression.

Well it's actually not a step in spiritual progression at all really.   But that's besides the point right now. 

[Lionheart]

 I posted this on another Forum, but it seems to fit the topic at hand here as well.

"The thing that always confuses me is why do people want to "project" from a Dream?

If you have become Lucid in said Dream, why not see it through for what it has to show you?

For a number of months now I have been going with the flow per say, when it comes to Lucid Dreaming. I don't change a thing, other than reacting to what is happening in the Dream scenario fully consciously aware. This is the real way to learn more about yourself. There are lessons to be learned or something important to be shown in almost every sequence. I enjoy the adventures and ALLOW them to do what they are going to do. The hardest part is actually staying consciously aware of them for long periods of time. But once again, this gets better with practice!

The only reason I can see for wanting to project from a Dream, is to see if you can."

[astralee]

I posted this on another Forum, but it seems to fit the topic at hand here as well.

"The thing that always confuses me is why do people want to "project" from a Dream?

If you have become Lucid in said Dream, why not see it through for what it has to show you?

For a number of months now I have been going with the flow per say, when it comes to Lucid Dreaming. I don't change a thing, other than reacting to what is happening in the Dream scenario fully consciously aware. This is the real way to learn more about yourself. There are lessons to be learned or something important to be shown in almost every sequence. I enjoy the adventures and ALLOW them to do what they are going to do. The hardest part is actually staying consciously aware of them for long periods of time. But once again, this gets better with practice!

The only reason I can see for wanting to project from a Dream, is to see if you can."

have you noticed the more you wright down and try to project the harder it is to noctice whats all around you when you become aware, I notice the 3d blackness more when i donte  try to project and wright my dreams down.

[Lionheart]

have noticed the more you wright down and try to project the harder it is to noctice whats all around you when you become aware, I notice the 3d blackness more when i donte  try to project and wright my dreams down.

I find that recurring Dreams are the easiest way to become Lucid in your Dreams. You realize, hey, I've been through this or I've been here before.

The 3D darkness is not a part of becoming Lucid in your Dreams. The 3D darkness occurs during a shift, either going to the NPR or returning back from it.

[Xanth]

I find that recurring Dreams are the easiest way to become Lucid in your Dreams. You realize, hey, I've been through this or I've been here before.

The 3D darkness is not a part of becoming Lucid in your Dreams. The 3D darkness occurs during a shift, either going to the NPR or returning back from it.

That's definitely my experience as well.  It seems to be some kind of "inbetween"... kind of like, as Tom Campbell would say, you are shifting between data streams, and the blackness is the lack of a data stream between data streams.

[astralee]

thats what i think now aswell its when my waking mind turns off and my sub mind turns on to control my astral body.

[Fusions]

That's definitely my experience as well.  It seems to be some kind of "inbetween"... kind of like, as Tom Campbell would say, you are shifting between data streams, and the blackness is the lack of a data stream between data streams.

When you say it like this, it sounds so golden.
This whole NPR is just one big ('secret') gold mine.

[Xanth]

Mmmm gold...