My 1st post

[Beethoven2024]

Lumanza

You said a lot of interesting stuff there which I want to reply to when I get chance, thanks.


EscapeVelocity

After being into this for a long time, I know from experience that the later in the night I practice, the harder it is to go to sleep. I usually go to bed about around 10pm. I see my ideal practice time to be between midnight and 2am. After that, my practice will seem easier because I'm more awake BUT I'll just be lying awake for an eternity.

In a way I do a mini version of WBTB because I usually spend about 15 minutes trying to get motivated to start my pratice. I understand though that it needs to be much longer which is too difficult right now.

Thanks for the help.

[Beethoven2024]

EscapeVelocity

That's strange. I replied to what you said but it's mysteriously disappeared. I'll have another go later.


Lumaza

"It used to take me a good 45 minutes to an hour and half to find success."

Haha, I'm just getting into the trance state then! No seriously, when I've had success I was trying for at least 2 hours. It was like I didn't want to give up after lying there so long. My logic is - spend ages trying and as time goes on, the time will get shorter. I don't see lying there for so long doing me any harm. Maybe in the long run it might cause me to feel worn out though. The most important thing though regarding time is not to give up too soon which has happened so many times. As soon as I start to feel uncomfortable it's like... "OK that's it for one night."

"I had swallowing/saliva problems."

I may not have had this as bad as you, but I've experienced it which had led to a coughing frenzy.

"I had the sensation often that my physical eyes were opening."

I don't think I've had this but I've often felt my eyes twitch like crazy. This might be something to do with REM???

"I had the pain in the legs and other body parts. I had the cramping."

I can often get through an itchy nose or head etc. but once my legs start playing up that's the end.

My last OBE stage ended about 6 months ago because I felt like I had a trapped nerve in my upper right arm. I thought it had got a lot better, but a few nights ago it came on again when I ended my practice and rolled onto my side. I'm pretty sure it was a result of doing too much energy work.

OBE must be like a maschochist's heaven!

"I am 6'2 and am cramming my body into a 5ft bathtub. Not only the bathtub, but that is also the size of the walls on both sides. My legs are left climbing the wall, lol."

It's great that you can see the funny side, and it made me smile, but I can definitely understand how annoying that is.

I'm not familiar with the 'phase' term. I've seen it on here a few times but didn't fully understand it.

Are you saying that you're trying to have an OBE or something similar in the bath???

All the best...

[Beethoven2024]

EscapeVelocity

Please forgive me, I can be SO dumb at times!

My reply is still there. I didn't realise there was another page.

Phew! And to think that I'm trying to leave my body!

[Lumaza]

Are you saying that you're trying to have an OBE or something similar in the bath???

Yes, in the bathtub. I was surprised to hear a few years ago that "Archimedes" did the same thing.

 Years ago, while in the shower I had a brief extremely eye-opening experience. I was shampooing my hair. I got shampoo in my eyes, so I briefly close them. I then saw that I was teetering on the edge of raging waterfall. Immediately vertigo set in, and I almost pulled my shower curtains down trying to hold onto them as I was falling. It was so vivid and in my face. A few weeks later, I closed my eyes while showering and saw that I was in the middle of a busy city street. I felt my nakedness, but no one else reacted to it there. I then came to realize that there was something unique going on between "frequency shifting" and running water. If you are open to and aware, the "NPR" (non-physical realms) can and will teach you many different things. Not only things that you can use there, but things that you can use here, in this physical realm as well! 

 With Phasing, there is no need to "climb" out of anything. There is no "out of body". It is more like reaching "in to" consciousness. There have been times though that an actual OBE has occurred during one of my Phase sessions. with Phasing, you learn to move into the darkness before eyes. Sometimes, you will start it by imaging a object or action, like shooting hoops, let's say. then somewhere along the line, the scenario begins to take on it's own life and you just follow to where it leads. It could start as an imaginary driving simulation and leads and all of sudden your roads seem to take on their own direction and paths. You follow them to see where they lead. This is where having a strong sense of curiosity becomes a valuable asset.

 Many times, those images will begin grainy or as a fellow member said recently, in "sepia tones and colors". But when you continue to focus on them, they quickly become as real and sometimes even more vivid in color than our physical reality here is. With Phasing, you are moving your awareness from here to there without all the bells and whistles.

 Here is a fantastic Stickied thread that will introduce you to the Art/act of Phasing.
https://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome-to-the-astral-faq!/what-is-phasing-and-how-can-i-do-it/

[EscapeVelocity]

Beethoven- You are doing pretty well with what you are trying. Here are some suggestions for refining the process.

Going to bed at 10pm and trying techniques for an hour or two is beneficial in the sense of learning and familiarizing yourself with the cognitive/awareness aspect, but you are still fighting that somewhat overwhelming physical urge to simply fall asleep; so ultimately, I think the work is good but is also a bit self-defeating. Experiment with finding ways around that.

I understand and dealt with it myself: the physical reality of needing a good night's sleep and working the next day...the trick is to find a manageable way to work your NP explorations into your schedule. So, don't insist on it being a daily thing- make it once a week or twice maybe; where you set your alarm an hour or an hour and a half before your normal wake-up time and you spend that time consciously exploring that NP territory. Or once a week, try my preferred WBTB method which would be to go to bed at 10pm, with an alarm set for 1:30am, read a book for an hour and then go back to sleep with the intention to have an OBE of some sort...I know that this is difficult during a work week, but if you want results, then consider giving it a try and work this into your weekly/monthly routine.

With the WBTB method, you are really working with the process of the disconnect of the conscious mind, the subconscious mind, and the mind/body sleeping component involved in the whole process...don't be afraid to experiment with this whole process.

My point here is that you need to experiment and find 'your' specific recipe for these experiences. If you choose to experiment and try new ideas, you will eventually find what you are looking for...

EV

[Beethoven2024]

EscapeVelocity

I go to bed about 10pm but I don't usually start my practice until at least 2 hours later. I pretty much always wake up within a few hours of going to bed.

Everything you said makes perfect sense and it's definitely something I need to experiment with.

I have only just got back into this dream-type stuff so things seem overwhelming at the moment.

[Beethoven2024]

Lumanza

"Yes, in the bathtub. I was surprised to hear a few years ago that "Archimedes" did the same thing."

"Eureka! - I've found it!"

Having a dream-like experience whilst showering sounds really crazy. There is something magical about water.

I looked at that phasing article and it sounds really complex. It could take a while to get my head around it.

I have often looked into the blackness and seen hypagogic imagery. This has sometimes been incredibly real and has led to lucidity in the past.

[Tak]

Here a practitioner is reporting, who sometimes needs about three hours to induce an Ap, and she doesn't give up, Yay! I only give up after 4 hours (I have a lot of patience, yep). 
But in general, it takes me between 1:30 and 2 hours. 

All the advice given here is excellent and I like to reread these things to reinforce them. I use the same method as EV for over 10 years, it's what works best for me. 

And I like so much Lumaza's soak method, I had never heard of anything like that before, very innovative for me, and it has been used for millennia apparently! I should try one day. In my case it's the other way, I'm short and the bathtub is big, maybe I'll slip and be completely underwater LOL.   

Perhaps the biggest challenge of all this, regardless of the method used, is learning to relax and induce the state between sleep and wakefulness, since in my case I need to not be too awake nor too asleep, a "middle" state and it is difficult to achieve sometimes. Waking up and going back to sleep, at least for me, is not always easy. Even if I've only slept a few hours, between 3 and 5, my body and mind run at full steam. Re-inducing sleepiness and calming the mind again is quite a challenge. Perhaps before starting a method, one has to "practice" entering this state between sleep and wakefulness, without thinking too much about the OBE. And once you've learned this easily, apply your favorite induction method. 

When I read that people say that they have been in bed for a long time and nothing happens, I think... they just weren't sleepy! A little sleep is necessary... In my case, if I try the method after having slept eight hours or when I go to sleep after an exhausting day, nothing will happen. You have to find "the point" and that is a variable for many people. 

I have often looked into the blackness and seen hypagogic imagery. This has sometimes been incredibly real and has led to lucidity in the past.

<<< You have found the trailhead 

Go ahead!

[Beethoven2024]

Tak

Phew! You certainly have a lot of patience!

There have been times when I've spent almost the whole night trying to become lucid or AP, but these can probably be counted with one hand.

I had a change of mindset a few years ago. For a long time I questioned whether a 30 second LD once a fortnight, if that, was worth all the effort. But I realised that the great feeling of it lasted for many hours so that made/makes it all worth it.

BUT it's also the whole package. A lot of the excitement and motivation is the potential. It's like being on a permanent high because there's a possibility of something amazing happening.

[Lumaza]

Phew! You certainly have a lot of patience!

If you want to talk to someone with a lot of patience, talk to "Xanth". In the past, he said here that it took him 10 years before he had his first successful consciously aware experience.    That takes a lot of patience and I commend him for that!

 The problem that I had earlier in my own practice was that I programmed my mind so much to "notice", that any time I closed my eyes, my mind would instantly click into noticing, even when I wanted to actually go to sleep.

 I find the bed the hardest place to practice. All your life you have programmed your mind that "bed is for sleeping". It's hard to re-wire that instinct. To be successful on a regular basis, there is a lot of re-wiring needed. By changing or altering your mindset, you are also changing and altering your reality!

[Traveler_2649]

Lumaza,

When you talk about acute pain in limbs, how long does it last?

I've done lengthy yoga nidra meditations before, and on multiple occasions I've had excruciating pain in my dominant wrist. On a scale of 1-10, it's all least a 9. It feels like my wrist is being stabbed and crushed at the same time.

I injured it about 6 years ago and it's progressively grown worse over time. I've tried to tough it out, but it just gets worse until I can't ignore it anymore and it disrupts the whole meditation.

Any suggestions?

[Lumaza]

Lumaza,

When you talk about acute pain in limbs, how long does it last?

I've done lengthy yoga nidra meditations before, and on multiple occasions I've had excruciating pain in my dominant wrist. On a scale of 1-10, it's all least a 9. It feels like my wrist is being stabbed and crushed at the same time.

I injured it about 6 years ago and it's progressively grown worse over time. I've tried to tough it out, but it just gets worse until I can't ignore it anymore and it disrupts the whole meditation.

Any suggestions?

I know it sounds weird, but put all of your focus on your big toe. You can also cycle up and down your toes, kind of like counting. For me, the pain stops almost immediately, but I have learned how to keep my focus laser sharp on whatever target I wish to. Another great focus target is about 6 inches in front your toes. What you don't want to do is focus on the area that hurts. That seems to intensify the pain.

 I think you might find Robert Bruce's NEW (new energy ways) useful. Before he passed, he created a version 2.
https://archive.org/details/robert-bruce-new-energy-ways/page/n1/mode/2up

 I have Degenerative Disc Disease (born with it) and Trigeminal Neuralgia (about 10 years now). They are not allowed to hurt me when I am working. I have learned to make a deal with my pain that it cannot interrupt my shows, but afterwards, it can do what it wishes. The day after a show, I feel it though. When it gets too intense, I go into my focusing on my big toe. If that doesn't work, I start using some of the NEW techniques. The only pill I take is Gabapentin. I don't take anything for pain anymore. My body does not allow it. I always get bad reactions, even to Tylenol.

[Kodemaster]

Welcome back!

[Beethoven2024]

Thanks Kodemaster.

I'm just finding my way around.