New Age - The new religion

[goingslow]

quote:Originally posted by timeless

Goingslow, as usual got me thinking.  

New Age ideas started out as a fresh look at old concepts.  These New Age ideas formulated itself into a philosophy and now I feel they are starting to structure and harden themselves into a religion.  

What are your thoughts on this?

My thoughts are that:
(1) Religions have a lot of rituals and rules.  
(2) Rules are like wallpaper or pretty clothing.  
(3) True spirituality is an individual truth that grows with beauty inside and spills out.  I do not see it as rules which followed constrict and mold us into what someone elses image is of God like nature.
(4) Rules have a small place (what we eat, the music we listen to, the clothes we wear etc.) but I see them as fine adjustments on a microscope.  You can have a lot of fine adjusting rules and what is under the microscope will still look fuzzy. Coarse adjustments on self (from within) usually bring greater clarity.
(5) To me New Age philosophy is a large pool of ideas to help us learn about and clearly see ourselves.  It would be sad if it just turned into another religion.

Regards,
timeless

I think you're really onto something here.

Thanks for this post timeless.

[timeless]

[]Thanks for the idea Goingslow.  You were the one who got me thinking.[]

[Nerezza]

The New Age philsophy will be the religion of the future, and I say that as a Christian.

[cainam_nazier]

There are only two things that I see are shaping the New Age Philosophy into a form of religion.

1.  The blind faith aspect that you mentioned.  Someone sees how "we" do things and then tries to emulate that in hopes of becoming more enlightened..[]

2.  I think that this is more of a factor than the first.  There are getting to be more and more ideas that are being considered common truths.  There are two ways that this happens, the first being that enough people have had a certain type of experience and shared it and it becomes accepted as real or possible for everyone.  The second thing that causes this is basically the first one again but because so many people have had the experience and have shared it, there are now people who have not had the experience but accept that it is real based on the facts provided by others.

But isn't that blind faith?  No not really.  I say that because it took a certain amount of convincing.  IE..X amount of people had to have the same experience before it was believed.  Also learning of some thing in this way is not taking the idea of just one or two people but rather taking to the time to listen to several and drawing your own conlusion based on that information.

Unfortunately us "New Agers" as a whole are still in the dark just as everyone else.  This is because although there are several common ideas or truths, there are a hundred times more ideas on the correct path to these truths.  As far as religions go the New Age Philosophy has more varying sects than any or perhaps all other religions combined.  In all actuallity it seems to be very difficult to get more than five "new agers" to agree on a common path to an idea or truth.



On a side note I would just like to mention that I am getting along awsomely with my ego work.  I happen to think that I am perfect and it agrees. []

[timeless]

Dear cainam_nazier,

I really, really like your point number 2.  It strikes a chord with me!

You make a good point about New Agers not agreeing.  This is where the compartmentalization (did I spell that correctly?) comes in.  I see secs or branches forming that are hardening in their beliefs.

Thanks!
timeless[]

P.S. []To the ego work thing.  A good sense of humour goes a long way when dealing with self!

[Nerezza]

Unfortunately us "New Agers" as a whole are still in the dark just as everyone else. This is because although there are several common ideas or truths, there are a hundred times more ideas on the correct path to these truths

I always took new agers as hardcore gnostics.

[timeless]

Dear Nerezza,

I think much of the new age ideas were supposed to be a fresh look at the gnostic ideas.  Perhaps they are not so fresh any more and the bread is growing hard and stale.  Guess we need some wine to dip it in?

Great to see you,[][]
timeless

[Adrian]

Greetings Timeless,

Yes, I agree with you.

New age is certainly not a religion,anything but. A reliegion is usually rigidly imposed upon the congregations, and often reinforced by threats of "hell" and "damnation" etc. to non-believers.

If anything, new age could be considered as more of a philosophy such as much of Hinduism, and even Buddhism to some extent. New age is certainly extremely eclectic and I am sure is having a generally positive effect on Spiritual awareness generally.

Unfortunately, new age is it's own worse enemy at times. Although the general philosophy can be quite accurate and positive, it also draws alot of cynicism and scepticism due to the large numbers of people claiming to channel Archangels and a wide range of other beings. There is even a series of books available under the general title "Conversations with God" where the author claims to have channeled God! They also talk alot about the exalted Ascended Masters such as Master Urgaya, Master Kuthumi, Master El-Morya in rather loose terms.

On balance, new age is certainly in the right direction relative to the path, and I personally believe it will mature into something much more enduring and with a much wider level of acceptance in time. The most important aspect of new age is that is sows the seeds of Spiritual recognition among many people, and who often go onto to set foot upon their own path based upon their own research and experiences. It does not matter how people set foot upon the path; it is the destiny of all mankind to do so sooner or later.

With best regards,

Adrian.

[Nerezza]

New age is certainly not a religion,anything but. A reliegion is usually rigidly imposed upon the congregations, and often reinforced by threats of "hell" and "damnation" etc. to non-believers.

I must be the only person on earth who's priest hasn't told him he's going to hell. I feel left out.[]

But as for the new age not being a religion, well, not quite yet. Give it two hundred years and it will be called Adrianism.[8D]

[timeless]

Dear Nerezza,

I agree with you.  My minister never threatened hell over me...not even close.  Adrian might have grown up under a very strict, stern priest, who totally turned him off.

I see religion more as something that has calcified over the ages.  However!  What others have made of a religion (their hardening of it) is not what you or I have to make of it.  If you can pump new blood and provide wine for the hardened bread perhaps church attendence will improve.  

Respectfully,
timeless[]

[Adrian]

Greetings Timeless,

quote:Originally posted by timeless
I agree with you.  My minister never threatened hell over me...not even close.  Adrian might have grown up under a very strict, stern priest, who totally turned him off.

I didn't actually grow up under any priest [] I rejected religion at the age of 7 years much to the horror of the religious education teacher who was also the village priest. I have never formally been to church in my life except for formal situations like marriages etc..

I think it is true to say though that certain sectors of of the christian church, notably catholicism do most strenuously make that threat, overtly or otherwise. I have certainly seen cases where catholics have attacked non-religious people saying they will burn for all eternity in hell and so on.

The irony is, people with such strongly held religions beliefs are much more likely to find themselves in a belief system territory in the Astral when they pass on, which can seem like "hells" in their own right.

I see the dogma of the churches weakening at an ever increasing rate as the consciousness of mankind expands and realises dogmatic religion for what it really is. Even now the churches are struggling against metaphysics and many Spiritual people and organisations who are able to put forward the truth supported by the facts. One of the biggest threats to the church is quantum physics; people respect science even if they are wary of mystics.

With best regards,

Adrian.

[goingslow]

It will be a beautiful and glorious day for mankind when dogmatic religion will be switched over to dogmatic new ageism.

[Nerezza]

I think it is true to say though that certain sectors of of the christian church, notably catholicism do most strenuously make that threat, overtly or otherwise. I have certainly seen cases where catholics have attacked non-religious people saying they will burn for all eternity in hell and so on.

Im a Catholic and the only time a figure of the church yelled at me was when I hid behind a statue of Mary and a nun was praying in front of it. I jumped out and she screamed and said she would tell my Grandmother(who was head of some church group). As far as I know she never did tell but 12 years later I still fear the day when my Grandmother finally does get that message and unleashes whatever
divine punishment there is for hiding behind Mary while a nun prays
to her.

It will be a beautiful and glorious day for mankind when dogmatic religion will be switched over to dogmatic new ageism.

The lesser of two evils?

[timeless]

Yes Nerezza but I have yet to meet a stern Newfie.  Are there any?  Newfoundland has to be the friendliest place on the face of this plant.  On top of all that, Newfies always seem to be able to laugh at themselves.  The best Newfie jokes I ever heard, where told by a Newfoundlander.[]

Perhaps attitude is everything when it comes to spiritual matters?  

Much Love,
timeless[]

[James S]

On occasions I will wander through a 'new-age' type shop full of things like crystals in various settings, dream-catchers, tarot cards, books on witchcraft or books with pictures of the Dalai-Lama on the front, assorded candles and incense.....you get the picture. Other times I might go to a nearby 'Mind Body & Spirit' expo.

What I most often see is people wandering around like their brains have already ascended ahead of the rest of their bodies, doing the same things with the same objects because 'that is the way it is done', asking the same questions, and buying the same products manufactured by companies who don't give a toss about spiritual progress, they just want to sell the gear and make a ton of cash.

So... not a religion? Sorry, can't see the difference!

Ok, I know this sounds cynical of me, and maybe it is.
I'd just got out from under the doctrines and dogmas of the christian church when I started exploring possibilities with crystals. I'd go into shops and meet with people, and all I saw were people worshipping crystals. Just a different doctrine and dogma. Just a different religion.

Why I think this - religions tend to be composed of people who find it is much easier just to believe than to think. They follow a way because other people are doing it and it kinda feels good.

The only difference in the 'new-age' beliefs is that the scope is much wider, but there are still more than enough people acting like ministers who will do their best to tell you that this is the way to do it and you're wrong if you don't do it this way.

James.

[cainam_nazier]

Well said James.

In every belief system there will always be a "hard liner".  Even if thier belief is accepting of others and what others believe they do there best to change how people think to be more in line with what they say is so.  They may be accepting but the still believe that thier path is the true one and every one else must fall in line or be left behind.

[Nerezza]

Yes Nerezza but I have yet to meet a stern Newfie. Are there any? Newfoundland has to be the friendliest place on the face of this plant. On top of all that, Newfies always seem to be able to laugh at themselves. The best Newfie jokes I ever heard, where told by a Newfoundlander

Angry newfies do exist, but it's usually because they were thrown out of a pub.

Have you been here Timeless?

[clandestino]

Hi James S !
i'm not sure i agree that new-ageism is a religion... Because a religion is organised and has constraints. i.e. you can't be a catholic priest if you marry someone; you can't profess to be both catholic and believe in re-incarnation.

Whereas this doesn't exist within the new-age movement. An individual is free to take on board whatever beliefs they wish. In fact I bet you couldn't find 2 "new agers" who subscribe to an identical belief system !

I agree that there are a lot of people who find it easier to "believe" rather than "think"....in both religion and new-ageism. But within the new age movement, people do have the freedom to think, if they choose not to blindly follow beliefs.

kind regards
Mark

[kromeknight]

Hello
My feeling on your post extends from James.
I thought new age meant finding your own path not following others rules, practises which is basically the definition of religion.
My opinion is that the ppl of this world are opening to truth as we experience it in person and not by example. New age to me must mean something  much different to you. I feel it is beyong and above dogma restriction, religion.
I see many boats on the river of spiritual progress, all call to me saying come board it's the only way.
I smile and walk upon the water they see me not as I am.

[timeless]

Dear Nerezza,

Have I been to the Rock! You bet you.  I visited Stevensville.  Had to visit the mill there. Shh! You know the mill...don't give away my secrets[].  Anywho, when walking through the mill I even met someone related to me.  A wacky goofy guy, who was a real card.   The 'hills' are nice but I call them hills because I lived near the Rockies for a while.  Everything looks like hills after that.  

I even went to a pub BUT only during the day. I guess Newfies only get kicked out in the night time[] cause I didn't see any angry Newfies. Good people with big hearts.

Best Regards,
timeless[]


Dear James,

I totally agree with you.  Some people get so entrenched.  They forget that what works for person A might not suit person B at all.  Diet is my biggest gripe.  There was a 'special vegetarian spiritual diet' out there ten years ago that some people went on.  I saw some people do fine on it because of their particular physiology....BUT there was one lady who it almost killed and she was too pigheaded to see it.  She tried to convince me it was good to be puking up 'toxins' once every day or so.  I could see almost every vein on her arms and she just looked sick....really sick.  It totally freaked me.  This is about the most extreme case I can think of but is an excellent example of what works for one does not necessarily work for another.  We have to use commonsense and do what feels right not worship things or follow doctrines.  

Best Regards,
timeless[]

[Adrian]

Greetings everyone,

Perhaps one of the biggest problems with new age is the label "new age" itself. Like any label, it tends to become sterotyped and eventually people shy away from it altogether. New age tends to bring to the mind of the average person a bunch of "love and light" type people burning incense surrounded by crystals while channeling Archangel Michael or making contact with an Ascended Master on the appropriate ray []

Now we all know Unconditional Love really is the most powerful force in the Universe, without which nothing could exist. We also know the value of crystals, herbs and so on for a multitude of purposes. The problem is, mention these to the average uninformed person and they immediately see you as a "new age" ecentric of some description.

New age, like some religions has its good aspects and not so good aspects. For example, I personally do not believe that it is possible to channel an Archangel or any Angel for that matter. These chanellers might be channeling some entity, probably even a well meaning one with useful information, but not an Archangel.

So what is the answer? I am not sure. We are indeed entering a new and pivotally important era for all of mankind without question. The next decade is critical and an expansion of consciousness has to take place. This in turn means propagating Spiritual awareness far and wide to the extent that people question existing creed and dogma and proceed to seek their own path for themselves. There are numerous resources on the Internet and in books as well as from other people where people can gather knowledge and make their own decisions.

The cliche "new age" is here to stay, and I guess all we can do for now is to hope it matures into someting more acceptable to more people.

I am worried about other valuable practices which are in danger of becoming stereotyed. I believe Reiki is one of these. Reiki is a valuable healing practice originating in Japan. But nowadays everyone seems to be a "Reiki master" a good many of which call themselves "new age" []

With best regards,

Adrian.

[timeless]

In the Spiritual Development forum we have a thread going with profound spiritual statements.  I loved Tisha's so much I could not resist adding it to this thread.  Hope you don't mind Tisha.[:I]

"God wants spiritual fruits, not religious nuts!"

P.S.  I changed the wands to wants (Thinking a lot about wands are we?)[]

[timeless]

Dear James,

This ties in nicely with what you were saying about religion and mindlessness.  I think what cheapens religious prayer is that people seem to pray from wrote instead of really meaning it.  The same goes for New Age.  There are people mindlessly following instructions or saying ritualistic words not really understanding that word are totally useless without meaning and intent. And that tools are just aids we outgrow.  The driver must (not a word I use much) be in the drivers seat.  We have to be thinking!  Not only that but we need to have control over our own thoughts and ourselves and never give that control over to any idea, anyone, anything else.  

Another problem...and I think you feel as I do...are the books out there on New Age topics.  I think the problem is that books must sound authoritative, otherwise they will not sell and the message will not go out.  I mean who is going to read a book by someone like me, saying my perception, my thoughts on this are, perhaps blah blah, my guide indicated this but could be wrong.  No! People want authority because it seems clearer.  It seems like the definitive TRUTH.  In my opinion, we each must find our own truth with help but never heavy influence or control given to those around us.

My other gripe is short crash courses promising instant spirituality. Short cuts seem silly to me.  To take an analogy lets look at Miracle Grow.  It really works, doesn't it?  The plants grow faster, look nice superficially...BUT...they are lacking micronutrients (copper, magnesium etc.) and when adversity hits it's the other plants in the garden that survive and do well.  AND Lord knows there is one heck of a lot of diversity in this world.  

Very Respectfully,
timeless[]

[goingslow]

Another issue I see with the dogmatic "do's and don'ts" of New ageism is they're based on "Masters" who have been recognized as enlightened people.  Like you said, timeless, some people look at their lives and feel they need to mimic their habits and ways of acting in order to be advanced.  I really like the idea there are many roads to enlightenment, and we dont fully understand what it is like to be "enlightened".

If a person comes into this world and carries out their "task".. maybe they touch a lot of lives arent they doing exactly what theyre supposed to be doing?  What if a person is enlightened but their role is meant to be a different one than that of spiritual teacher?  

What Im trying to say is we only get our examples and New Agers only get their examples from people who wrote books and/or chose the role of teacher.  But couldnt they only have become examples because we already have a set image of what it is to be enlightened?  So since they fit the image they sort of set the rules.. and anyone who had weird quirks or ideas such as crowley kinda set the "don'ts". Since they dont fit the perception (rules) of what it is to be enlightened?

So if they chose not to eat meat its assumed an enlightened person must not eat meat.  If they lived a poor humble life then you must not have much money. etc..

To me it seems plausable there were very "advanced" people out there who did exactly what they were supposed to do.. only their role wasn't teacher.  So there really are many paths.. we just follow those of the people who's path happened to be teacher.  Maybe they did have money. etc

Does it follow a person who is "advanced" does have the role to teach others?  This is the question I am trying to figure out.  Or do they only get recognized as being advanced BECAUSE they are teachers and get their names out there.

This isnt a theory of any type just a random thought.

[Osiris]

Greetings,

I always seen master as someone who can guide one progress with advice, but certainly not to dictate student what to do.The word guru literally means light in the dark, so teacher role is to give you knowlege(light) that will help in you spiritual grow.  

To me New Age never been a label as such. I saw it as a chance for people to advance spiritually in a way of harmony. It is true that there might be slight disagreement between people. Yet when I read the New Age books writen by different authors, they all express the more less same ideas.

The spiritweb.com was a nice website to look at different opinion people might have. In a middle of all New Age turmoil some very valuable ideas were born[]

Some people would view New Age as something that is not sound scientifically or else. Yet some things need one faith before they can be experienced. Of course the application of common sense is needed when conducting experiments and the inner voice will often warn you when you are on the wrong path.

It`s interesting that many teaching that was passed only from master to student was made avaible in USA and Europe starting from 1970 or around this time. Many teachers when asked why you decided to take a risk and spread the knowlege among the masses, where answering that they where feeling it was neeeded to be done.

Many people did misinterpret the issues or have a different view as here on Astral Pulse or in the outside world. Yet the numbers of people who are advancing spiritually are growing.

As Adrian was saying

quote:. The next decade is critical and an expansion of consciousness has to take place. This in turn means propagating Spiritual awareness far and wide to the extent that people question existing creed and dogma and proceed to seek their own path for themselves

I can only agree with him. The time for person going into the desert to meditate and ascent is gone. Synergie is a a way to contribute and benefit from the changes that are manifesting right now.
And been firmly centered in your true self will help a lot.


With love,

Osiris.