relationship &magic

Tisha · October 02, 2003, 16:27:19

Ari, I'd like to see you rethink your ideas about relationships. We're always ready for relationships. We're always IN them. Whether they're good or bad, that's another story. Don't use the divorce rate as proof that people can't have relationships. The divorce rate is proof that most of our ideals about marriage are silly! I was married for 10 years. For 10 years the marriage was successful. Now that we're divorced, we're still in a relationship, only a different one!

You can practice becoming ready for a successful, magical love relationship by relating to the rest of the world in a positive, magical way: your parents, your teachers, your siblings and friends, animals, plants, rocks, etc. etc. Don't expect a romance to be the be-all and end-all if you can't pass Basic Friendship 101! When your life is ripe and full of successful, long-term friendhships, that's when you will know you are ready for a good, long-term love relationship. Also, if you want a powerful love relationship, don't go for shallow things like looks, paycheck, or even personality characteristics; rather, learn how to "see" properly (i.e., magically) and go for the MAGICAL CHEMISTRY. And then go for it!

Don't worry about whether or not a relationship will last forever; forever is not really the point. Nothing lasts forever.

WalkerInTheWoods · October 03, 2003, 17:43:49

Sex is just a tool, it is what you make of it. It can be bonding or not, depending on the people involved. It can be a very powerful tool. "The need to be pure before doing anything of the sort...or isn't it black magic?" I really do not understand what you mean by pure. You get out what you put in. If you are mean, hateful, lustful you will increase such things by combining them with sexual energy. If you are loving and seeking closer communication then you will get this. If you use sexual energy for other things then so be it. Who is to say that one use is better than another? It is up to those involved.

quote:
It makes sense to say that very few people are ever ready for relationships, by simply looking at divorce rate.

But you can look at it another way too. Granted divorce can be a painful thing, but on one had it is the end to one path and the start of another. These people could well have had a great experience and learned much during their marriage, but at some point found that they needed to part ways to best continue their own growth.

n/a · October 07, 2003, 17:56:58

Ari, let me guess-you are a woman.
you think lika woman,
you are confused as an average woman,
but WHO said when you were young-that you are a woman?
who said that you HAVE TO think as a woman?
do I have to think as a man?

if you understood this, you will see that your whole life is just happening by itself.
(without you)[

!]

beavis · October 07, 2003, 18:32:31

It makes sense to say that very few people are ever ready for relationships, by simply looking at divorce rate.

People change. You (as you are now) can be ready for a relationship with somebody as they are now, but not like them later.

Nagual · October 08, 2003, 02:34:55

Maybe you will think that I am... hum... weird/retrograd but, for me, the only purpose of sex is to create a new life. As so, it should not be abused as it is right now. The fact that sex gives pleasure is "good" and "bad". It is "good" in making sure that the species will survive because pleasure will push people/animals to do it, and it is "bad" because humans/animals are following the "good" aspect too much and abusing it... [|)]

Tisha · October 08, 2003, 06:00:10

Nagual, there are so many more things to create than babies. Harness that creative force and create ANYTHING!

But I agree with one part: Don't just fritter your sex-power away on dog-like F**cking. It's like taking your gifts and flushing them down the toilet.

WalkerInTheWoods · October 08, 2003, 06:20:17

quote:
Originally posted by beavis

It makes sense to say that very few people are ever ready for relationships, by simply looking at divorce rate.

People change. You (as you are now) can be ready for a relationship with somebody as they are now, but not like them later.

So true. I think that if you want a relationship to last both need to work to change together. Sometimes though as you both change you both realize that you are not right together. So there is no way to know for certain that a relationship will last a lifetime. Just live in the now, for that is all that you have.

Nagual, I respect your view and it may be the right path for you. But my views are not the same as yours. As I have stated, sex is what you make of it, it is a tool and a powerful one at that. Kept physical, then it is much as you say. But sex can be very spiritual as well and I have used it many times to help me connect with the spirit. I have used it help in energy work, love, self healing and exploration, and more. So from experience sex can be much more than what you imply. So yes you are weird. [

] Not really, infact I find most people do not wish to explore any kind of sexual magic, so I am the weird one.

Vallk · October 08, 2003, 06:32:04

Hi Nagual,

Yes I am surprised to hear you say this. Don't you have pleasure when you have sex? What gives you real pleasure in life brings you closer to who you are. Sex is a healthy pleasure, a wonderful way to mix your energy with someone you love.

You are talking about the extremes : too much sex with too many people (abusing) and not considering our basic needs (only for procereation). Well I believe there is a middle that is totally healthy and that does not reject the pleasure of the act.

Making love is sharing! There is no shame to share love! Sex is not a bad thing!

Well, this is how I see it and feel it.

Val

Nagual · October 08, 2003, 10:28:57

quote:
there are so many more things to create than babies. Harness that creative force and create ANYTHING!
sex can be very spiritual as well and I have used it many times to help me connect with the spirit.
sex is what you make of it

All these are exceptions and not the norm among humans; not many people can do what you do; and I believe it is a very tricky path with lots of pitfalls... I met too many people who were "hidding" their naughty activities behind a spiritual practice... Not saying any of you do that. Anyway, I wish you to succeed! [|)]

quote:
Don't you have pleasure when you have sex?

Yes, and I talked about the pleasure side effect of sex in my post...
Here's an extreme comparison (don't mind it too much [

]): Some people get pleasure in killing other people or making them suffer; some people get pleasure from drugs; some people get pleasure in enslaving others; etc... I know I'm pushing a bit, but you get the idea... Pleasure should not be at the expense of other people/things. Again, I think pleasure is a side effect and not the goal of sex... Each time you have sex, you are in the process of creating a new life. The energy released by both partners is supposed to go to this new life...

Anyway, nature has allowed it, so... enjoy it naughty boys and girls!!! [

] and don't pay too much attention to me... [|)]

Nagual · October 08, 2003, 11:40:49

But don't get me wrong; I am not the type of guy who says that sex/flesh is evil... Believe me, if sex was just pleasure without the life creation energetical aspect, I would be a real bunny!!! if you see what I mean... [

]

, I can't find a good analogy...

shadowdancer · October 08, 2003, 13:34:51

Namaste,
here is a thought...the clitoris is the only human organ who's function is specifcally to bring sensory pleasure!! hmmmmm.....

Tisha · October 08, 2003, 14:41:44

AMEN !!!!

or is it "ahhhh, men?"

<ahem> [

]

Nagual · October 09, 2003, 00:52:36

quote:
here is a thought...the clitoris is the only human organ who's function is specifcally to bring sensory pleasure!! hmmmmm.....

I would agree if the clitoris was located on your fronthead... [

]
But it is part of the sexual organs...

WalkerInTheWoods · October 09, 2003, 05:22:04

I think that was his point. The clitoris is a sex organ whose only function is pleasure.

quote:
Believe me, if sex was just pleasure without the life creation energetical aspect, I would be a real bunny!!!

But it is those energies that are the basis for sexual magic. You just use them to create what you want, be it another life or whatever.

WalkerInTheWoods · October 09, 2003, 06:10:55

Studies have shown that sex has far more benefits than just increasing the population. Just something to think about. [

]
(Of coarse these studies are done with Western science, but it does show the physical benefits of the physical aspect of sex.)

"Other studies (some rigorous, some less so) purport to show that having sex even a few times a week has an associative or causal relationship with the following:

- Improved sense of smell: After sex, production of the hormone prolactin surges. This in turn causes stem cells in the brain to develop new neurons in the brain's olfactory bulb, its smell center.

- Reduced risk of heart disease: In a 2001 follow-on to the Queens University study mentioned above, researchers focused on cardiovascular health. Their finding? That by having sex three or more times a week, men reduced their risk of heart attack or stroke by half. In reporting these results, the co-author of the study, Shah Ebrahim, Ph.D., displayed the well-loved British gift for understatement: "The relationship found between frequency of sexual intercourse and mortality is of considerable public interest."

- Weight loss, overall fitness: Sex, if nothing else, is exercise. A vigorous bout burns some 200 calories--about the same as running 15 minutes on a treadmill or playing a spirited game of squash. The pulse rate, in a person aroused, rises from about 70 beats per minute to 150, the same as that of an athlete putting forth maximum effort. British researchers have determined that the equivalent of six Big Macs can be worked off by having sex three times a week for a year. Muscular contractions during intercourse work the pelvis, thighs, buttocks, arms, neck and thorax. Sex also boosts production of testosterone, which leads to stronger bones and muscles. Men's Health magazine has gone so far as to call the bed the single greatest piece of exercise equipment ever invented.

- Reduced depression: Such was the implication of a 2002 study of 293 women. American psychologist Gordon Gallup reported that sexually active participants whose male partners did not use condoms were less subject to depression than those whose partners did. One theory of causality: Prostoglandin, a hormone found only in semen, may be absorbed in the female genital tract, thus modulating female hormones.

- Pain-relief: Immediately before orgasm, levels of the hormone oxytocin surge to five times their normal level. This in turn releases endorphins, which alleviate the pain of everything from headache to arthritis to even migraine. In women, sex also prompts production of estrogen, which can reduce the pain of PMS.

- Less-frequent colds and flu: Wilkes University in Pennsylvania says individuals who have sex once or twice a week show 30% higher levels of an antibody called immunoglobulin A, which is known to boost the immune system.

- Better teeth: Seminal plasma contains zinc, calcium and other minerals shown to retard tooth decay. Since this is a family Web site, we will omit discussion of the mineral delivery system. Suffice it to say that it could be a far richer, more complex and more satisfying experience than squeezing a tube of Crest--even Tartar Control Crest. Researchers have noted, parenthetically, that sexual etiquette usually demands the brushing of one's teeth before and/or after intimacy, which, by itself, would help promote better oral hygiene.

- A happier prostate? Some urologists believe they see a relationship between infrequency of ejaculation and cancer of the prostate."...

Source: http://www.forbes.com/2003/10/08/cz_af_1008health_print.html

Nagual · October 09, 2003, 08:22:00

quote:
The clitoris is a sex organ whose only function is pleasure.

Maybe... And I said that pleasure was a very effective way to be sure that people/animals will have sex and so perpetuate life... So, I still think pleasure is a (very nice) side effect, but not the goal. It's like using your car's engine to fry eggs... it works, but it's not the purpose of the engine... Hum, a more "dirty" example: when you go to the toilet... you can feel some pleasure too...

quote:
But it is those energies that are the basis for sexual magic. You just use them to create what you want, be it another life or whatever.

I still have a problem how to express my thoughts but... when you say "you just use them", it's a bit like hijaking the powers that create life for your own personal gain... Another of my crazy comparisons would be to take your best books from your bookshelves and making a campfire... Sure, books will burn very well; but it's nothing compared to the knowledge they contained...

Your sex benefits list is nice and I am sure accurate but, it does not change anything to the fact that these are side-effects... You can tell me that sex increase intelligence by 1000x, will make me look like a top model, will bring me luck, will make me immortal, etc... it does not change the fact that you are abusing the creation of life process...

shadowdancer · October 09, 2003, 12:38:42

Namaste,
hmmm...have you heard of mantak chia or taoist yoga? ie-the transmutation of semen and other sexual fluids into psycho-spiritual energy. i feel this bypasses many traps that surround the ideas about sexual union.

Nagual · October 09, 2003, 15:08:49

Yes, I talked to one of his senior instructor... and, believe it or not, I've been told that... nevermind. [

]

quote:
i feel this bypasses many traps

Again, i am sure some people are able to "transcend" sexual energy... but it is far from the norm from what I heard.

shadowdancer · October 09, 2003, 15:46:36

Namaste,
no, not transcend. a concept i personally find relatively meaningless. but transmute. like lead into gold.

WalkerInTheWoods · October 09, 2003, 17:52:38

Anyone can learn to cultivate, or transmutate, their sexual energy to turn it into more refined energy. It is a question as to if a person actually wants to do this or not. Changing one's view of sex and over coming the "got to get off" mentality is not really an easy thing. It is not impossible, but it depends on if one truly wishes to work to attain it or not. The rewards are very well worth the effort.

You can view the creative energy of sex not only to create life, but creation in general. The energy is there and if you are not going to use it to create another life, then why not use this creative energy to create something else.

Nagual · October 10, 2003, 02:08:59

quote:
The energy is there and if you are not going to use it to create another life, then why not use this creative energy to create something else.

Sure, you can use your retirement $$$ to buy a ferrari too... It's there, not used... so why not spend it?
You can spend a huge chunk of the Social Security $$$ to reduce Taxes like I think Bush did...
What I am trying to say is that you are using a resource that was meant for something else... abusing life/nature.

Of course, you can say that it's your energy, so you can do whatever you want with it... I guess. But, personaly, I just can't abuse such a "magic"/amazing thing that is life.

11 · October 10, 2003, 02:24:08

quote:
Originally posted by Nagual

quote:
The energy is there and if you are not going to use it to create another life, then why not use this creative energy to create something else.

Sure, you can use your retirement $$$ to buy a ferrari too... It's there, not used... so why not spend it?
You can spend a huge chunk of the Social Security $$$ to reduce Taxes like I think Bush did...
What I am trying to say is that you are using a resource that was meant for something else... abusing life/nature.

Of course, you can say that it's your energy, so you can do whatever you want with it... I guess. But, personaly, I just can't abuse such a "magic"/amazing thing that is life.

I don't see the logic in that.. if you would otherwise lose the energy (through traditional sex/masturbation) why not do something constructive with it instead of just throwing it away? That to me is showing respect toward "such a magic/amazing thing that is life".

WalkerInTheWoods · October 10, 2003, 04:26:34

quote:
Originally posted by Nagual

quote:
The energy is there and if you are not going to use it to create another life, then why not use this creative energy to create something else.

Sure, you can use your retirement $$$ to buy a ferrari too... It's there, not used... so why not spend it?
You can spend a huge chunk of the Social Security $$$ to reduce Taxes like I think Bush did...
What I am trying to say is that you are using a resource that was meant for something else... abusing life/nature.

Of course, you can say that it's your energy, so you can do whatever you want with it... I guess. But, personaly, I just can't abuse such a "magic"/amazing thing that is life.

The two are nothing alike. You can throw away energy if you wish, or you can harness it for your own intent, such as your health. You can get energy whenever and wherever you want, money on the other hand is harder to come by.

I do not view the energy as my own. It is the Universe's I guess. Energy does not belong to any one person. It is there for everyone to use. It is my view that energy has the tendancy to move and flow and be used. Since it is there, and it desires to be used, I should use it effectively for my betterment. This is my view anyway.

Nagual · October 10, 2003, 04:26:54

quote:
I don't see the logic in that.. if you would otherwise lose the energy (through traditional sex/masturbation) why not do something constructive with it instead of just throwing it away?

Of course you don't see it since I never said "traditional" sex was better than any "spiritual sexual energy transmutation/whatever technique". Where did you read that?

From the beginning, I said sex is to create life. Period. "spiritual" and "casual" sex are both "deviations" (sorry, can't find a better word). Now, if you want to know, I would agree that "spiritual" sex is better than "entertainment" sex... But both are still hijaking the life process.

Tisha · October 11, 2003, 07:16:40

My relationship with the World is an expression of my relationship to the DIVINE FORCE. It is the same with you. Once you "get" this basic truth, your relationships will change. You will see sex differently. You will make different sexual choices.

Every sex act is binding. Whether you like this or not, have sex with someone you don't love and you're STUCK with them long after you leave their bed!! Your relationship with them says volumes about your relationship to the Divine Force. Think about the last time you had sex. Did you love it and leave it? Did you abuse a Divine Creation? Or, was making love more like worship? Or was it just buddy-sex? What does this say about your relationship to God/dess?

The sex act generates enormous creative power. I do not agree with Nagual that this creative power is only for the babies. This power will create thoughtforms that you may later use to transform your life in whatever way you see fit. Or, abuse the Force and these thoughtforms can screw you up, big-time! It's up to you.

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relationship &magic

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