Does bad karma affect AP?

NecroGod · November 28, 2003, 08:16:29

Seeing as how you make a Simpsons reference I'm obligated to respond [

].
Well, the good news and short answer to your question is a resounding "NO!"... bad 'karma' will not interfere with your AP/OBE experiments. But, thinking that it will make a negative influence will cause it to do so. Basically, all you have to do is 'forgive yourself' for the things you thought were 'bad'. A good start (and without putting too much religious idealism into it) is to realize we all do dumb things sometimes, no one is perfect, and I can almost guarantee you that there are people OBEing out there who have done worse than you. Just don't sweat it and you'll do fine.

xander · November 28, 2003, 11:51:47

quote:
Originally posted by Tolvor

I'm wondering whether the concept of bad karma can affect AP/OBE training?

It'd be nice to think the crap you did in some past life is the reason why you have trouble in this one. It's a very attractive notion for it gives you a twisted sense of control.

If we look at Hinduism from which the idea of Karma originated we have to look at the 3 caste systems. The last caste, known as untouchables are told that their sickly, homeless, and starving because of crimes commited in a past life thus the upper castes are not obligated to feed, house, or heal them. Karma is a wonderful tool for avoiding social responsibility.

Karma is also a wonderful excuse for avoiding personal responsibility, I had a freind who got assaulted. The guy tried to rape her and told her "you brought it on yourself" and "its your karma, dont fight it".

I do beleive in past lives but I refuse to believe in something as fickle and poorly understood by westerners as karma.

You mentioned lots of little things which add up. often the only reason they are important is due to the importance you place upon them. if there is an entity or an energy affecting you, YOU have a RESPOSIBILITY to YOURSELF to get rid of it so as to progress on your spiritual path.

Xander

Nahaz · November 30, 2003, 14:34:10

My understanding of karma is it is the link of causality. By your actions you start a causal link, which leads to the effects, or manifestations of that original movement.

There is an apparent delay between cause and effect for good reason. If you can see the line of causality, then you can understand your own "karma". When you embrace and "own" the original causes, then you empower yourself and become a little more whole. You might choose to become conscious of all your actions now, thus be conscious of the effects down the causal line.

Tolvor · November 30, 2003, 15:49:08

Actaully when I used the word 'karma' I used it in the casual sense, not with the full implications of past lives. I used karma because bad karma 'sticks', and must be balanced by good karma. I would agree that karma links to the future, and it is that link which I'm questioning.

Basically the question boils down to whether AP/OBE is a restricted members club. Are the evil barred from there? The insane? The mundane?

The question would have been clearer had I left out the reference to karma, esp as I'm Catholic and don't hold to karmic obligation in principle (its a nice analogy though). Had I tried to explain the problem without the karma word, I would have had to use the s*n word, which gets people riled quickly (as does the word Catholic). It made for a shorter post but added to the confusion.

Nahaz · November 30, 2003, 16:05:30

If you expect to have your experiences limited by an outside agency, then it is quite likely you will get exactly what you expect.

That may go for everything, including religion. All religions are true, as are all non-religious beliefs. Every imagined experience is real. Some magicians have created such rediculous realities for themselves, yet they are real.

WalkerInTheWoods · December 01, 2003, 04:25:06

Learn to forgive yourself. Learn to be more positive and ignore the negative. Evil is a relative term. Everyone can and does project, except Catholics. [

] Just kidding. But do realize that what you expect to see can effect what you do see and experience. Your emotions will effect the experience as well, so learn to get over this guilt thing. Though being Catholic I am not sure that is possible.

Tayesin · December 01, 2003, 05:54:53

Bad Karma ? Cause and effect are basic mechanics of our existence. Our cause beckons a naturally flowing response from the Universe, and we know it works well. The mistake we do make however is to judge it as either 'Good' or 'Bad'. It cannot be either, it is only what it is, mechanics of existence. And is certainly not subject to our human judgements.

As said by others in this thread, if you believe what you wrote to be true, then that is what you will experience. Change that belief and you will change what you are creating.

When we choose our next life here, we do the choosing because we know what it is we need to experience, and so we choose accordingly. That is how Karma works, we are such great spirits that we eagerly choose to succeed at our tasks, even the ones we may have failed already. No one is there telling you that you were a bad boy in the 1600's so you have to get a crap set of choices. No way, we are making the choices. So Karma is only mechanics, not some terrible fate for naughty souls.

As mentioned, we all OBE most nights, it is completely natural because we are spirit. Your experience of it will relate directly to what you chose to know and experience this time, so the only other thing that could stop you being successful with OBE while aware is what you believe. So maybe have a little fun with it and not worry about Karma, you will sort it out when you need to.

Love Always.[

]

holy reality · December 01, 2003, 15:19:15

I've started wondering about karma myself...

See, for like an year or two in a row, 95% of my lucid dreams consist of well... SEX, and lots of it.

Sometimes the people are like, totally zombie like and not moving, sometimes they resist....

Yet that never bothered me because, well, IT'S A DREAM, they aren't real, right?

But what if they are? What if the ones that seem semi intelligent are real people and I've stepped into their dream pools?

I hadn't thought about that at all before, because it would seem ludicrous... but as of the past month or two well I've been on the receiving end of that... entities and peoples doing things to me that I don't want done while I'm powerless and mindless to stop it.... just like those people in my dreams were.

I don't know if it's karma or what... I mean I have been cutting down on my sexual deviancy (as realising the pointlessness of it) whilst lucid dreaming lately, before the whole me being harrassed by entities thing started... so maybe I'm just trying to cleanse myself and the demons and such and people and beings are like the undesirable parts of my consciousness that I want to destroy.

?

At any rate, I tend to ask people before I do things to them now, be they real or not... they tend to say yes or can be easily persuaded to say yes though, so it's all good.

But it's still counter productive and doesn't accomplish anything.... damn my human-ness.

Aphex-twin · December 02, 2003, 00:44:34

If you kill somebody and program yourself to think and know that it is right will you be punished for it or is your punishment created by your morals and if you have non there is no punishment

WalkerInTheWoods · December 02, 2003, 04:31:44

That is a good question, Aphex-twin. You can probably get as many different answers as there are members here.

Here is how I see it. There is no punishment, only things that you may perceive as punishment or something negative or maybe you bring it on yourself because you want punishment. There are only lessons to learn. I do not see how one can be "programmed" to be happy and blissful while inflicting pain and destruction. I am not saying that one could not get some kind of joy out of it, because clearly there are people that do. But their actions will not give them the content, blissful, spiritual high, happiness and they will ultimately be unhappy. In their search for that happiness they may continue into the act of killing for the weird joy they get, but happiness will always elude them. That is the lesson they are to learn, or you could view it as punishment. But the punishment is self inflicted because they continue doing what is hurting them and refuse to learn.

I hope this makes sense as it is early. [|)]

WalkerInTheWoods · December 02, 2003, 04:37:15

holy reality, do you have some kind of issues with sex? You don't have to answer because it is not important that I know. What is important is that you explore why you dream of sex and feel guilty about it. Do you have issues about control, you being in control of others and/or others being in control over you? Look within, meditate, and explore yourself. Try not to be judgemental about what you experience, but examine with a passive curiousity as to why you dream such things.

holy reality · December 02, 2003, 14:20:19

quote:
Originally posted by fallnangel77

holy reality, do you have some kind of issues with sex? You don't have to answer because it is not important that I know. What is important is that you explore why you dream of sex and feel guilty about it. Do you have issues about control, you being in control of others and/or others being in control over you? Look within, meditate, and explore yourself. Try not to be judgemental about what you experience, but examine with a passive curiousity as to why you dream such things.

that's just it... the only issue i have with sex is that i haven't had it and well, desire to...

but yes i do have issues with feeling powerless and invaded and violated.... fear of the government and oppression and negativity of things i want to do and things i think by society (my "religious" views and my views on drugs mainly) and then my parents spying on me.

That could play a large role in it, in that what is more powerless and violating than being raped? In fact that may completely be it. I'm not sure.

Tolvor · November 27, 2003, 16:47:25

I'm wondering whether the concept of bad karma can affect AP/OBE training? The reason I ask is that since I started I've come much closer to lucid dreaming, and my dream recall is increasing to 3-5 a night (it needs to be 10). The dreams indicate that I still feel guilty and regret over mistakes in my past. I'm not talking about earth-shattering crimes here (or even petty ones), just the little acts that added up. In addition many people describe sleep paralysis as being joyful, pleasant, and uplifting. Sleep paralysis for me has always been terrifying, pursued, evil presence, and entirely negative. I'm wondering if that the higher powers are blocking me from AP and giving me a sign saying 'No Homers allowed'. (You'd have to have seen the correct episode of 'The Simpson's' to understand the reference, but I think you get the point)

News:

Does bad karma affect AP?

Tayesin