Messages

I'm not surprised at all that what some people call the ''globalists'' commanded those attacks. I was surprised to hear that they possibly blew those buildings also. But by reading what they had to say; I understand now why many of them doubt the official version. Those building fell just too perfectly like a castle made out of cards... The best example we can have is if we look at this WTC7 video and compare it to a failed implosion:

WTC7:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aL0zYx-FQ3Y


Nice implosion in Dallas (not even as good as WTC7 clearly...):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sIOgpxyzqq4&mode=related&search=

And a not so good one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uzUUU5zarzM


In the WTC7 video, we can clearly observe the puffs of air going out (look top right side of the building) and a much better implosion (if it is the case...) also. Since when buildings falls entirely on their own weight like that so perfectly? Are they so cheaply built! Those where made with a steel frame! Even implosion with dynamites placed everywhere in the building can't match the ''accident'' collapse of the WTC7 it seems... Look at the last video again for a good example. A lot less of air puffs coming out of the building clearly... And a failed attempt also.

When we compare those videos, I think it is clear to understand why some people doubt what happened.

Yo Frank!! Just come drop a line!!

There ya go!! :notworthy:  That's much much nicer and more fun to read.

I have searched on the university website to find out if they have posted the research (they usually do so)  and what they want to do basically since they do not really clarify for what purpose this study is being done when you take this survey... Every study have an hypothesis behind it and the one they have will not surprise you of course....  

But this person running the research should come discuss on such boards and  
he will probably realize that more ''questions'' needs to be answered....

Take a look at it:

The title of the article is: 'Out-of-body' experiences may come from within (23 August, 2005)

Take care,

I wonder what they want to prove with that.

Title: ''Body percpetions'' of people who do or do not have OBEs.

What is the study about?

The aim of this study is to explore patterns of body experience by people who have and have not had an out-of-body experience. (...)

So this means that they already accept the fact that OBEs are real? or they want to associate the possibility that it is related to some kind of some characteristics of the brain which may be the result of what is causing these so-called OBEs? It is clear that the psychological academic discipline did not accept the fact that OBEs are genuine so it is probably some kind of correlation study they are making here to find out what ''kind'' of person might have the (what they will say) ''so-called OBEs''. And like Telos and Beth said, it is not surprising that they will try to make some correlation with mental illnesses.... But it may bring interesting results if they are open-minded like they say, we won't be surprised if the conclusions are like the other ones we saw before of course (ex: OBEs are only related with certain characteristic of the brain, etc.)  but we have nothing to loose on this....

"I really should stop telling so many lies"

Why are they asking that!


Anyway, I hope they will show their results at least....

Take care,

Download and Hear this important easily decodeable message.

Ricky Gervais- The 11 0'clock Show WW2 Skit.

Decode yourself!

What is that and who's that funky dude!    
(a dumy trying to understand.....   ).

Take care, (I look at me and say nothing....).

The problem with believing that only one person -- or only a precious few -- can do these 'miraculous things' only serves to separate us from the very spiritual awareness that we all need (at least I presume we all need it.)

This John guy may well be able to do these things, but as the biblical narrative states: "These things I do you can do also---and much, much more!"

I think everyone should be their own Savior...

Peace,
Beth

I agree 100% with you on that principle; I do not think Jesus's goal is to make such a hierarchical type of view of every humans on the planet. Some people that possess nothing as ''psychic talents'' whatsoever might accomplish much more than someone who might possess some but  do not have the compassionate heart that goes with it. A gifted psychic may not be more ''evolved'' of course since many can do bad things with it (''Neg'' can be some kind of example that might fit this criteria....). As living in a human body, being Jesus or anybody else, we are all at the same ''level'' somehow because we all have to go to the bathroom and wipe our azz after.... Jesus's approach of the resurrection principle is and in many other aspects also such as your quotation ''these things I do you can do also---and much, much more!" (this is my personal opinion here) mostly want to tell us that there is much more to what we may experience with our physical body; to come back after being crucified is a really good example of course. This means there is more than this physical body. And beware to some that use the two extremist principles mix together (scientific materialism and biblical literalism) and state that when it is written in the bible that we will be ''resurrected'' at the end of days it means that ''science'' will now be able to ''resurrect'' us (of course they associate this process with cloning....). As a matter of fact, cloning may be one totally logical type of association but it is so contradictory with the rest of the bible and so many other principle in relation with spirituality. Anyway.... I hope that people will not start to make this kind of association too much in the future....

Take care,

Hey all,

Has anyone considered that 'miracles' such as those in the Bible and even in the Quran are metaphorical?  For example, in the NT we read of certain 'healings' such as 'making the blind see', and  'making the lame walk'.  These particular narrative stories could also be read as parables, in that, 'opening ones spiritual eyes' is the cessation of 'spiritual blindness' and likewise, 'healing ones physical walk through life' is helping them to begin to 'walk their spiritual path' --  "Pick up your pallet and sin no more."

I thought about this possibility many years ago and long before I studied these texts academically.  There are of course other options but, these are the most commonly quoted.  Even the initial post that got this thread started is showing where the Quranic verses are metaphorical or symbolic of later scientific discoveries.  

Both of these books are amazing canons of literature.  It is too bad that people want to make them so much more than that by risking 'Reason' to justify them as their God's holy writ--and to use them to 'misuse' their own power (yes, as a tool of prejudice, intolerance, oppression and sometimes even as a 'weapon of mass destruction'.)

Peace,
Beth

Yeah this is also a logical explanation, the problem is that some people observe miracles performed today so they also associate the notion that probably such a man could do it also in the past. We see nowadays people that seems to heal like Jesus was doing, is it a fraud? good question.... (but rarely we will see someone walk on water of course). I encountered in another forum someone talking about this dude that was an extremely powerful healer. Anyway.... Take a look at this and tell me what ya think folks.... It's an interesting story.

John of God

Take care,

I think to reach toward spiritual guides that may really help you may be a more pleasant experience but if you really want to see those shadowy type of people, that's your personal choice (many will probably tell you to be careful of course....) but this is not something I would first do if I was a good astral traveler....

Take care,

[quote="Ybom] What I'm getting at is I believe one to be naive to dismiss the idea of the Bible being a conspiracy to control a large mass of people through fear and self-oppression. I hope this theory is bogus and I like to disbelieve it, but totally avoiding it is just ignorant. Again, I would never ask anyone to accept it simply due to the sheer negativity of it, but I would whole heartedly ask everyone to realize that there is this big risk in supporting it.

[/quote]

I also encountered some of these perspective in relation with the conspiracy theories (one example of it is David Icke) and, as a matter of fact, it is a possibility. I do believe that the Christian religion as been used as repressive tool but I do not necessarily think that it was entirely conceptualized to primarily use it in such a way; maybe it was borrowed and shaped by different individuals.... This is hard to tell

[quote="Ybom]
Patapouf,
I promise we're not trying to gang up on you! You made a good point about this being open to many interpretations, but you really did drop your defenses to anyone who reads fictional works based on real places.
[/quote]

When I first read I laughed because I realized my mistake. I mostly associate legends with many long lasting or ''old'' cultures that we can find around the world. Many of them (ex: Indians) use legends to remind them of many important cultural notions they want to pass on to the next generations. Contrary to the fictious kind of story that our mother or father used to read to us before we went to sleep, many of those legends contains such important cultural concepts that they want to pass on and to recite it into such a metaphorical way is the best way to remember it and ''spread the word''. Some anthropologists will attempt to demystify it because they do or might contain some historical events that happened and affected this particular culture some times ago  and it also contains many relevant cultural information. But the informants will also have different views on what it means, how it happened, etc. Usually, legends can be told and not only read.

Again, what or how the bible has been conceptualized; I don't have a clue and I don't want to get lost too much on all those theories.... I assume that it was written in such a similar fashion but this is a personal hypothesis here but I can not really say if it is the case of course and I know that there are many possible scenarios. The topic is on the Q'ran....
Oops.    

Take care,

[edit]
P.S.
Jeez Ybom, Gotta be quick around here! Patapouf is going to feel like we're ganging up on him now!

 You ''interpreted'' how I would possibly react!! But it is totally the opposite James! Do not worry.... I do not feel like being attacked or anything. This is an argumentative discussion, if you can say things that contradict what I'm saying, you better do it! Thanks for letting me know that I might wrongly interpret what you said here. But it did not even come close to my mind and I was surprised of your reactions. Good point you made about Dan Brown and there are probably other examples also (of course, how many movies can we see using this approach!). My argumentative approach was with the ''interpretative perspective''. I do not know shlit about what happened during those days and only gave my opinion on the subject (what I thought basically), and, as you could see, was extremely vague. But I do not think that the bible was made to be an entertainment read like Dan Brown's, I do not think that writing such complicated novel was being done like we do nowadays( this is an opinion again, feel free to say what you think on it!!). The problem is that it is extremely hard to conclude for ''how true'' the bible is since there is so many possibilities.... Anyway, feel free to argument on the subject!  And please both Beth and Berserck should continue a constructive argumentation, it might be interesting since they studied in the same type of discipline (it seems....).

Take care,

The notion that the bible is all fiction is as interpretative as the one who says that the bible is entirely historical. What is the real approach? Good question! I studied in cultural anthropology and anthropologists can not even get the same results with the study of the same cultures with the same informants (this is done in the present time!). This made one really great realization that both historians and anthropologists came with just recently: it is highly interpretative. And if we deal with analyzing past cultures that dates back 2000 years ago, you have to deal with the notion that your theories are even more interpretative folks..... And now if you deal with a legends which is a metaphor that relates to ''an image'' and this imagery can mean a thousand words.... Well, you have thousands of different interpretations of course. Now wheter it is true or not is still as interpretative (also depending on the type of analysis you are doing and the hypothesis you might have). To be open to different possibilities is essential....

As a personal opinion, I do not think the bible is entirely a fictious work, why use so many geographical regions that can be clearly identified with only fictious characters? This is not logical it seems.  But I do not know how true or what may have happened; again, like I've said, it is open to many interpretations!!    

Take care,

That's a really cool thing to try. I wonder what type of setting you might use to do that (ex: low light level, etc.). Also, why they never really tried that type of experiment in laboratories.... It is so logical to do that it seems. The hypothsesis is that if ghosts could appear on cameras, well....the same if I have an OBE usually! Continue with this experiement since it may bring interesting results someday.

Take care,

I realized that i may had gone off topic a little, but as for criticizing a religious organizations, I totally agree with you folks; it is clear that many do not necessarily realize that they have fallen into those fundamentalist kind of institutions due to the fact that they have been raised into this particular kind of thinking. It is so important, from whatever background we are from, that we have an open-mind kind of approach at all time; this permits much more opportunities to resolve differences. I sometimes do fall into this trap ( we all do sometimes), I'm not perfect of course, and I try to be open-minded to different views (it is so important dammit) and if I do fall into such traps; I might be grateful to have a kick on the butt to remind me to do so.... Remember that a person that possess an extremist kind of view will perceive others as ''not normal'' to themselves because of their closed-minded approach that just blinds them; basically, they do not see themselves as ''extremists'' and those manipulative people will always remind them not to be open-minded of course, but to follow their guidelines like if their destiny was depending on it.  But by stating ''The End of Faith'', it is some kind of an extremist approach that think that they will resolve many problems if it could happen.... And I can just imagine some people trying to pass laws against ''religious beliefs'' to ''resolve the problems''. Next they will say that cultural differences is causing even more problems so we need to fix it and they will propose the theory of a global culture? Yeah right.... what and who will say ''what we should do and how we should live''? I can just imagine the debate.... I have dealt a lot with such problems in cultural anthropology, it is such a complicated thing.... As a personal opinion, the ''End of Faith'' is a little too far fetch, the ''End of blinded-faith'' more realistic maybe but the end of the ''close-minded kind of approach'' is definitively one of the most important thing we need in this world right now!

Take care,

To make wars or violent act from distorted religious principles is just one of the many ''ideological playing cards'' that manipulative persons are using. Human rights is now being and has been used also as a tool to create terrible things because there are so much shadowy definitions that can be easily manipulated to one's benefits (like religions). If you search you will find many.... Such as China using human rights to ''protect themselves'' from the ''terrible religious Tibetans'' or Shell shooting down Africans in the name of human rights to supposedly protect there territories, etc, etc. But this do not mean that we have to stop ''believing'' in human rights because it created problems also! We have to use some common sense here and not fall into an anarchist kind of thinking that if something is creating some problem, we have to destroy it completely; we may change for the better and this is what will probably happen. It is not because a knife may kill people that we should stop using it since the meaning of its conception wasn't meant to kill people, and the same for religions and human rights principles if we think about it; it is only us, again, that falls into this trap that some are making for us. And later, what we will see, is that people will have different views of what a ''reasonable'' act may be, and there we go again.... Falling into shadowy definitions and the possibility of manipulations for one persons benefits.

Take care,

That's a totally unfair statement. These people are brought up brainwashed no less than those for the so-called "War on Terror" are here. The main difference is that when those people are brainwashed, they're brainwashed so that they may blow themselves up, etc., rather than just letting their government do it for them.

Exactly, this is why every cultures and nations around the world have to watch out to not fall into this trap because the consequences are like a snow ball going down a mountain: ''you pinch me I'll pinch you back''.


As for the ''war of terror'', it is impossible to militarily fight that, the only way they will be able to control this is to use a really strict global surveillance (exactly what those war mongers wants) that would be closely similar to the ''Big Brother'' scenario. Without any surprise, the conflict will escalate in the future creating a lot of stress to many around the world and they will easily put more ''liberties and freedom'' with  rigid laws that will help to prevent war and terror; but again watch out, there is two sides to a coin. Since the society will be in a state of anomie and disorder, the people will think that those rigid ''laws'' will bring them back their old comfortable life, they will accept them immediately without even questioning them.

As for dictators, just analyze how Nicaragua's population tried to get rid of a powerful dictator (not a lot of people heard about that due to the disinformation process) but, since this dictator was a good friend to the Western world, the ''intelligent agencies'' (if we can call them that....) where paying contras (terrorists basically) to put fear on the general population and put them in misery so that they will vote a ''Western represntative''; this is just one story.... We, the Western world, are far from being clean and right like we think we may be.... People have to open their eyes a little.

Again, they probably had weapons of mass destruction in Iraq because we sold it to him but not to find one just divide people even more since they will argue against one another (like we do right now)and this is what they want; we only talk but do not do anything constructive.

As for Ben Laden, it is sad to say that we, again, helped with the CIA to let him become as powerful as he is right now, they purposely moved Al Qaeida to the Afghanistan to make an underground war with the Russians, they funded him and the terrorists group for some period of time.... The war mongers knew that their good old friend Ben Laden was, like it is presented in the media, a huge anti-westerner (ex: 1994 World Trade Center missed terrorist attack) but they have waited, just like Pearl Harbor, to be ''pinched first'' so that the population will get shocked so they have a good reason to go in war.... And also, they have clearly shown that the war in Iraq was planned before 9/11....

Chess masters, war mongers..... They can pretend to be communist, capitalist, human rightist, religious extremist, any kind of ideologies masked in the name of what is ''right and the truth'' but always manipulating the little sheeps to play their little games. Destroy to build again to destroy later and rebuild again to.... a cycle that we have to get out of quickly. And this have to be done by every people around the world; only one not doing it may bring down everybody else: when are we going to learn? We have to learn to discuss in a constructive manner instead of pulling out the guns; this is even more important in this new millennium due to the terrible weapons we have built.... How sad it would be to see nuclear weapons being launch to one another; but with how things are going, nobody will be surprised if somebody launch one in the future time to come.... They are like sleeping logs that are waiting to be burned.... We have to really do something folks.

Together we stand divided we fall,

And man.... What the world needs now.... Is love.... Sweet love.....

Take care,

Allegory of The Cave

Society of the Spectacle

The Allegory of the Cave setting. Plato's 2500's years old metaphor still represent our ''Modern World'' like never before. In a more modern twist, The Society of the Spectacle can be an analogy to Plato's allegory. Anyway, I'm ''watching the show'' and don't like what I see....

War, what is it good for?

Modern Genocide in Africa:

Sudan (2,000,000 deaths so far)
Ethiopia (1,000,000)
Burundi (475,000)
Congo (2,120,000+)
Uganda (550,000+)
Zimbabwe (20,000)
Equatorial Guinea (50,000)
Nigeria (1,000,000)
Rwanda ( 810,000+)
Somolia (100,000)
Botswana (100+)
Algeria (210,000)
Guinea Bissau (1000+)
Morocco - Western Sahara (1000+)
South Africa (1000+)

Going outside of Africa into other continents, you have...

Americas:

Colombia (upwards of 160,000)
Brazil (upwards of 300,000)
Cuba (1000+)

Asia:

North Korea (2,000,000+)
Burma (115,000+)
India (100,000+)
Nepal (6,000+)
China (35,000,000)
Pakistan (1,561,000)
Indonesia (510,000+)
Philippines (1000+)
Afghanistan (840,000+)
Sri Lanka (1000+)
Cambodia (2,310,000+ to 2,810,000+)
Vietnam (1,110,000+)
Laos (110,000+)

Europe:

Russian-Chechnya (60,000+)
Georgia (100+)

And finally..... the Middle East!

Israel-Palestine (4,000+)
Iraq (190,000 - also continuing to this day)

Kill people and destroy civilizations; no exceptions.

Imagine what are the possible conflicts to come.... It is us, the populace that can change everything but we are stuck in the cave.... The one with the marionnettes (the ''war mongers'') are throwing any kind of manipulative ideologies to make wars, we have the choice to say no (we are the one holding the guns not them) but.... It seems.... we are stuck in there....


Take care,

I briefly heard of Carlos Castaneda in my anthropology classes and he is also some kind ''marginal''  pioneer in the anthropological discipline. He was never totally accepted because of the naive materialistic scientific approach that overshadow the Western world but he still got an impact anyway, which is good. I might continue my study in the similar fashion that he did but not into ''exotic'' cultures like he did; but again, academia is really a pain in the azz and I'm not a good writer also dammit. I always thought that the anthropological discipline should do a cross-cultural analysis of the case of astral projection since it is almost a universal phenomena (we can observe it in many cultures, if not all, over the world). There is a link on Carlos and some of his work:

Carlos Castaneda

Take care,

Yes, the term "phasing" was introduced somewhere in the heading of a section of Ultimate Journey. As such, he deserves the credit for inventing the term as well as the term OBE (together with Charles Tart).

I read a little bit about Charles Tart, he is the first one to have tried a strict laboratory protocol in relation with OBE, the results did not bring any ''empirical results'' (like the scientist might say) but the experiment did bring some hypothesis that there is something going on.... I just hope that they could do more experiments like that, it probably do not cost that much!  Instead of trying to throw a 1 billion$ piece of metal on a planet where nobody lives....

Take care,

Quote:
"People who watch television are not the consumers of television. We are the product. The advertisers are the consumers. They are purchasing access to our attention and our minds. They get more return on their investment if we are not critical and instead absorb what we're watching. It follows, then, that content on television, including the news, will be designed to put us in a mindset where we are not critical."


Interesting subject folks, one good example, of course, can easily be seen when the Superbowl is occuring; they have to spend 1million $ per second of advertising since there is a big crowd stuck in front of the TV. People just can't wait to see how ''cool'' the ads might be (ex: Budweiser has hit the jackpot with the ''Wazz up'' advertisement some years ago). Anyway, the worst now is that advertisement is trying since a long time to shape the cultural background not for the need of society, but for the needs of those filthy rich corporation; they ''create'' needs, they need us to consume what they have, so they try to do everything to get our attention. You can see ads everywhere nowadays.  Also, it is not surprising nowadays that we are living in a completely disconnected kind of ''corporate culture'' or ''TV culture'' or whatever you want to name it.... Everything is transformed into commoditity now....

Take care,

Patapouf:  Not quite sure on the Dalai Lama saying..I understand it and have done that but come on!  this chick was OUT there..LOL  I'm allowed to complain about her right?  

Nay

Oops!! sorry Nay; this quotation of the Dalai Lama was directed to this vegan girl, not all of you!! Sorry for the misunderstanding. I said that because she was only criticizing others while drinking and smoking cigs. I have seen this too many time since I studied in cultural anthropology; and ethnocentrism is one of the biggest plague in our world today.... The West ''modern world''culturally hegemonizing the rest; people do not realize this important notion: cultural diversity is as important as biodiversity....

Take care,

They must have some documentaries on the subject? I can not believe that they don't!  I will search for some if I have the time and I'll give you some feedback on it.

Take care,

Happy Summer Solstice for those concerned and.... happy Winter Solstice for the others (I hope it is not too cold where ever you are!).... Yeah nice picture SomeBloke,

Take care,

Modern Genocide in Africa:

Sudan (2,000,000 deaths so far)
Ethiopia (1,000,000)
Burundi (475,000)
Congo (2,120,000+)
Uganda (550,000+)
Zimbabwe (20,000)
Equatorial Guinea (50,000)
Nigeria (1,000,000)
Rwanda ( 810,000+)
Somolia (100,000)
Botswana (100+)
Algeria (210,000)
Guinea Bissau (1000+)
Morocco - Western Sahara (1000+)
South Africa (1000+)

Going outside of Africa into other continents, you have...

Americas:

Colombia (upwards of 160,000)
Brazil (upwards of 300,000)
Cuba (1000+)

Asia:

North Korea (2,000,000+)
Burma (115,000+)
India (100,000+)
Nepal (6,000+)
China (35,000,000)
Pakistan (1,561,000)
Indonesia (510,000+)
Philippines (1000+)
Afghanistan (840,000+)
Sri Lanka (1000+)
Cambodia (2,310,000+ to 2,810,000+)
Vietnam (1,110,000+)
Laos (110,000+)

Europe:

Russian-Chechnya (60,000+)
Georgia (100+)

And finally..... the Middle East!

Israel-Palestine (4,000+)
Iraq (190,000 - also continuing to this day)

The number says it all; it's not a question of Republicans, Democrats, Green Party or any other political machine. We are the zombies that let those things happened.... I wonder when we will wake up. On an international level, just don't buy gas for a day and use a bicycle, let's see how ''solid'' this globalized system is: this is where we will realize that ''we'' are the solid foundations under it and that they make us hold this enormous pressure on our backs.

Take care,

I saw that too and wanted to smack her for being so judgemental and how dare she tell those parents that they did a bad job at raising their boy!!?? Heck, if I was that kid, I'd have the same attitude.  How bout when she kept harping on "this is good for your health", etc...yet how many ciggs and glasses of wine did she go thru??  

Now you got me all fired up..lol.  That has been my experience though with alot of vegetarians..they are better than the rest of us..*groan*

I'd love to see Dr. Phil take her on..lol!

Nay

Like the Dalai Lama would say; you can find thousands of bad things on other people but you should find one on yourself instead.... because you know you can change it....

As for this woman, she should have been sent with the Inuits for a good culture shock; and of course, a good reality check resulting from that.... We all know that Inuits can only, basically, eat meat because of the harsh environment they live in (maybe less today, depending on how ''traditional'' some are). Imagine how she might dictate them....  

Take care,