Messages

I'm sure there is no law that says it has to be this way but I agree with Majour Ka completely. The thing is, a guide will not approach you in any form or manner that will make you have to question it's intent. Always do though.

Thanks for the information!

So, before a projection, do the vibrations usually start out patchy, and then become constant after a few minutes? That's just how people usually describe them, but for me, they start out as internal jolts here and there.

Just remember that vibrations is a term used that many people identify with and use it to discuss a common experience. I personally think of it more as an intense tingling all over. What ever you choose to liken it to can affect what you are expecting to feel.

All the sensations that we feel right before we phase are all due to SP. Everybody goes through them every night naturally but are just usually asleep and not aware of them.

The sensations that you are referring to can come in waves or you can be hit all at once and be in full SP. Not to confuse you even more but you can still phase if you haven't felt any of the associated SP sensations. This will usually happen after you have a few OOBE's and learn to recognize that moment where you have shifted your awareness away from the physical. I never placed any importance in the feelings because I was not aware that they were associated with having an OOBE.

But I understand that it is almost impossible to not view them as milestones once you are.

Here's a tip that can help you bring the vibrations within a few minutes at most. Lay on your back and tense up your stomach muscles. Recognize that feeling. As you exhale bring that feeling back every time.

Don't actually tense your stomach muscles once you begin trying to enter SP. Just do it enough times so you can recognize that feeling. Doing it like this lessens the panicking but will put you into a full SP within ten minutes at most. From that point, it's just a matter of changing your awareness. There's literally a thousand ways to do this, but they are all the same essentially. This has always worked for me but I don't have to use it anymore.

Good luck.

I was just talking to a friend of mine and we both shared times we've seen each other. Both without knowledge. hehe. I've had a few times, but my own fear of being wrong always keeps me from sharing. I know it shouldn't because there is nothing to lose. Because who cares, if I'm wrong, I'm wrong. End of story. It's like, it's right there in my mind, but I am afraid to commit to putting the details into words.

That sums up my thinking as well.

Wow! This would be a hard one to deal with for me.

Did the little girl or her mother at any time ever notice that you were there? If so, you may have been meant to retrieve either one or both of them from this situation.

If not, it may have just been a test. If you were not aware of the idea of what a retrieval is then it probably wasn't. It's just flat out wrong to be thrown into these situations and not have a clue as to what you need to do.

I'm sure you could go back there if you wanted to. It may be different though if they have already been helped by another but it may be the case that you are the one who as the specific insight to help them. I am just too new at the idea of a retrieval to be any more help though.

I'm sure Lionheart or Szaxx can give you some much greater insight.

Good luck. Okay, I'm off to work. I think paying bills and good credit is sooooooooo overrated.

It's not like I tried to experience Third Body... I just read the book and had experiences that seemed to relate. For now, I haven't read much, I am finishing the Journeys as I begin my own journey so to say. I get your point when you relate to physical and non-physical realities as simulations. I am exploring and acquiring my own experience of the OOBE... I will be sure to read experiences from as many different people as possible to get a different overview of the whole thing. Concerning the metaphor of the second, third body, etc. I think it relate to different state of consciounness.

Keep this approach and you'll do just fine.

How are you at taking a life threatening action thats loaded with risk to help?

Not so well at first. The extreme realness of the experience usually overwhelms me at the last sec. It takes a serious threatening feeling to snap me back. Just being scared is not usually enough to end an experience. I know the whole time that I am not in any actual danger of physical harm but I am extremely empathetic to the emotions of others.

If I see someone crying or upset, I immediately want to help them. It doesn't matter if it's my best friend or my worst enemy. I'm not some blubbering baby or a bleeding heart. I just can't stand to see anyone suffering. This is why I am grateful that I do not have any prophetic dreams about disasters and such.

I absolutely believe that these events really occurred. If for no other reason, I hate to imagine what it says about me if they didn't.

My recall in these experiences is greater because of the emotional attachment to the events. Just like in the physical, we have a harder time remembering the so-so stuff. I'm not saying that they are lost forever but I have not attached anything to the event to help me recall it.

*im guessin the one inside has a smaller body---and deeper regret- (my favourite)

That is a good one.

Now I'm curious about all this you know what business?

I think Szaxx was commenting about the form with wings that you sometimes take on in your dreams. This form would be enough for anybody to reconsider their indecent ideas.

I have no idea what Dark was commenting on.

Lion- If you view the Catholic church as a corporation then you can see how this priest was not willing to go out on a limb and speak of a belief that does not jive with the company line. Though it no longer makes any difference to me, a new Pope can bring new hope.

The Catholic church is so powerful and influential that it can't be ignored. The Vatican is it's own country for crying out loud.

If the next Pope is open to accepting certain truths, this will have a huge ripple effect in everything.

Beedeekin- It is small things like this doc that compel me to believe in some conspiracies.

Chops- Ouch! Does your husband wake up with unexplained bruises? It makes me laugh picturing you act out a dream and punching him in the face.

Maybe they're scared of taking a bath.

I just need to share that I read "tomatoes" not "tornadoes". It had me wondering for a good couple of seconds...

But anyways... I don't live anywhere near tornadoes, but they scare the crap out of me too. I've always forced myself awake when I've seen them.

The rn looks like an m. lol.

I admit that I have some strange ideas but give me some credit.

I do not want to go to work this morning so this thread allow me to further procrastinate.

I think Beedeekin's new avatar is worthy of it's own thread. For some strange reason it has affected me.

Every time I come across it, I think of something new.

They are in no particular order:

* Wow
* Mommy, I'm scared
* That is a really large chin
* Wait a sec, Is that another head
* Is he swallowing his own head or emerging from one
* Two heads is better than one
* I want to do this with my own pic
* I don't want to do this with my own pic
* If he ever turns into a zombie, he will be a double threat
* Maybe he is a zombie

The list goes on.

Anyways, I like it.

What I consider phasing is when I have an OOBE intentionally with no loss of my awareness from start to finish. Otherwise, I call it projecting, like from a dream.

I may be using these terms differently than others but this is how I make sense of what I am trying to express.

I also consider phasing to be the same as having an OOBE from meditating. I know that many people feel that this can take years to do. Luckily I did not know that some believed this was supposed to take a long time and so I was able to achieve my first intentional OOBE through phasing within the first month of trying. I was not even aware of the term phasing then.

The only difference that I see from the experiences of phasing and projecting is that the ones from phasing are much harder to dismiss as just dreams and really validate the objective existence of the NPR. Once you can do both, it is easier to see that there is no difference.

I was so caught up in my former belief system that I couldn't even call it astral projecting because of the belief centric connotations of the astral itself. By simply calling it an OOBE, I was able to rationalize this as not being offensive to my restrictive beliefs.

I can see how believing in chakras can help some people but this belief would have limited my experience or even the ability to have an OOBE. I am interested in the chakra discussion but as of now, they do not square with my belief of what our purpose is.

I hope this doesn't sound preachy.

I consider telekinesis to just be another extension of the non physical reality. Many people believe that eating meat affects their experiences so it does in effect, matter to them. I never entertained the idea that it would make a difference for me, so it doesn't.

I hope this gives you some insight and welcome by the way.

What I meant is that I have stopped labeling my experiences as negative all together. I create plenty of negs in my experiences but the only thing that scares me currently are dang tornadoes. They bring me back to the physical every time without fail. I know it's silly but it's as if I am refusing to face them as much as I talk about others not willing to face their own demons.

I don't consider the tornadoes negative because facing down my fear of them will only be positive. Though I hope I never have to do this in the physical.

I remember some of your posts in which you speak about anxiety and questioning your sanity. The anxiety I understand but I see nothing of the other.

I almost made myself into a basket case over my anxiety and panic attacks. I still have the experience that others call a panic attack but I haven't panicked over one in years if that makes sense.

For what ever reason, they haven't gone away but they no longer worry me at all and they last for only a sliver of the time that they used to.

I had to give up my beloved Xanax because I could no longer justify taking them. Being able to explore the NPR has become way more important to me than any temporary relief that a drug can provide. Xanax stopped my OOBE's cold in their tracks.

The part that I highlighted wasn't Freudian but the talk about mothers is. I understand how sensitive that kind of talk is to some because I too am a mommy's boy.

A major foundation of Freud's psychology stems from his belief that everything we do can be interpreted from our childhood relationships with our parents. This is true in many ways but Freud likes to attach sexual connotations to his ideology and that is repulsive.

I hope Beedeekin doesn't see it this way but I was disrespectful for injecting the Freud label on his post. For that, I apologize.

To get back on track, I tested Beedeekin's idea out and it worked. I tried drawing an elephant from a picture and it looked more like a tree with four trunks. I turned it upside down so the picture no longer represented my preconceived idea of what an elephant looks like and it was SO much better.

I then went further and covered most of the elephant up and only drew it's midsection. By doing this, I didn't even have to keep referring to the original picture.

That worked out so well that it gave me goosebumps.

Was this something you learned in an art class or did you realize this on your own? This is just another great example of how our preformed beliefs limit our abilities.

Instead of believing anything somebody tells you is true, see for yourself. Try to abandon every belief centric idea you have about OOBE's and see what makes sense to you. This will not make the idea of a succubus go away instantly but If the next time something happens that you think may be explained by a succubus, ask yourself why you are even considering that.

If you are certain that these ideas exist then you will have to find ways of dealing with them. But just think about how much time you are using to defend yourself against ideas that don't even exist to others.

We all give ourselves some credit for seeing through our cultural and societal beliefs and acknowledging that the NPR exists objectively. I think that is the first major break through in understanding our purpose. We each have to decide what that purpose is on our own. Otherwise, we are just occultists.

I might be completely of the mark but this may all seem more real to you because you are starting to accept it. That's how it is working with me.

When I first started posting here, I felt compelled to put disclaimers on everything because I didn't want to come across as somebody who is gullible and easily influenced.

I still do at times. I'm not completely comfortable speaking about some of my OOBE's because of how real they are and our culture says that only the kooks believe this stuff is more than just a dream. I have said it before and I'm fine with calling all this stuff just a dream. I'm not fine with what many people consider just a dream.

I'm realizing that saying that something makes me uncomfortable is just another way of saying I am scared or I don't understand.

I feel blessed to have experienced being awake on the astral plane, yes.  grin *chokes up*

My sentiments exactly.

I'm amazed at how much more is opening up to me now that I acknowledge what I'm seeing.

I know what people are about to say when they start a conversation. I'm not talking about the gist but the actual words with very few differences. This has happened twice in the last week. I also had a remote viewing that I was able to verify the next day. Too cool.

I'm trying to understand too much at once but this stuff is kind of just flooding me.

The reason why most people can't draw is because they weren't encouraged as a child. Simple.

Why did you ruin a great post with Freudian stuff?  

I don't know but this is interesting. I suck at drawing. My stick figures end up looking like circles. Believe me when I say that I can't overstate my inability to draw anything. But I may look into this as I admire talented people who can.

Sorry, I emphasized the wrong word...

"Why do *YOU* keep running into them?"

Why someone else sees vampires is absolutely no help to you what-so-ever.

Haven't you ever seen something that you were sure you didn't manifest from your consciousness?

I'm not saying I believe there are vamps running around in the astral, but it sounds like lovEnergy does and wants to know what we think.

Sorry Lov but I don't believe in vamps in any way shape or form. But I do believe that your theory holds water. It's a given that we create and manifest our thoughts in the NPR. Who's to say that you aren't running into someone's vamp that they created.

The only negative things I see are always human in the astral. I'm not seeing the vamps because I don't leave that possibility open to me. They may be there but they in effect don't exist to me because I don't allow them the room to exist.

I was the opposite. I was a God fearing Christian until I had my first spontaneous OOBE. That was 12 years ago and I dropped the belief a long time ago but I have only recently admitted it. I no longer believe in a single creator or source but instead that we are all a part of this. Sort of like a joint operation. I'm not saying that we are all Gods only that there is no God in the usual sense.

I think the goal is for every consciousness to continually evolve. There is no single greater power it's just that some are a little better at learning and this can change as well.

In short, I no longer worry about damnation and hellfire silliness. I''m actually happy.