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Is it honestly different, how?

I believe there is a difference between a lucid dream and an OOBE but they take place in the same exact place. That place is our consciousness. I could even make the argument that this reality is all in our minds since we interpret what we see here through our consciousness. I view this physical life as a room with four walls, a ceiling and a floor. My goal is to reach the ceiling eventually but I can't in this lifetime. I wish to avoid the floor at all costs. My walls are this reality, a dream, a lucid dream, and OOBE's. They have different windows and doors through which I can exit the room and see the "world". What I learn, can help me to reach the ceiling. If someone believes that we die and the game is over, then that's fine. They choose to be locked in a room.

To me, a lucid dream is just a "dream", but much more fun since I can take control. But I have never had a lucid dream that changed me profoundly. I distinguish a difference between the two because I have had regular dreams in which I have gained my awareness and made them better because I became lucid but I always operate within the narrative in which I "entered". It is when the narrative changes without my conscious intent, that I personally denote it to be an OOBE. At that point, I interact with beings in places that I have not created , at least not to my conscious understanding. I believe myself to be a sound mind. I do not suffer from any delusions. Some may say that to believe that all these experiences are real and not just "dreams" is delusional. But remember, we are trying to understand these experiences and why we can have them while we have physical bodies. The very fact that we are aware of the opposing logic excludes delusion in my mind.


What is your belief on where OBEs APs and LDs stand in reality?
See above.

How do you personally initiate OBEs?
I have had success with all different kinds of methods but they are generally the same when you distill them down. Relax, and shift focus away from the physical.

What is the best way "overall" to initiate OBE during slight SP / full SP?
I have my most vivid experiences after SP. Since I can induce SP intentionally, I can then phase out. Phasing is, I believe, the term used when you have an OOBE without any loss of awareness from the physical until you reach the non physical. When I focus back to the physical from the non physical without losing my awareness at anytime, I classify that experience as an OOBE. If I end up falling asleep, it could have very well been an OOBE, but objectively I can't disprove it to myself that it wasn't just a lucid dream. But these are definitions I impose on the experience personally. 

What is a test to see if it was actually an OBE, have you tested this, results?
In the beginning, this was important to me. Until I realized during an OOBE, that I wanted to try and prove "all this" to other people and not for myself. The point of "all this" is to grow individually so we can one day grow collectively. Proving "all this" lost it's importance to me when I realized that. I can't recall ever proving anything in the sense that Beedeekin described, but every experience disproves the "it's all just dreams" talk, for me anyhow.

Have you entered OBE from a LD?
"During an LD I decided to fly straight up as fast as I can and with as much energy as I could harness, soon after the dream turned totally black and I started hearing springy/zappy/metallic electric noises which caused me to wake up, I heard the noises for 300 milliseconds after my eyes opened" Maybe???

Had you not woke up in that moment of awareness, you would have most likely made a post similiar to this: Oh my God, I think I'm going carazy, please help me....." What you described is the exact moment that a lucid becomes an OOBE in my definition as well as how it transitions personally for me.

Beedeekin-  It seems we agree wholeheartedly on this matter then. My problem with this concept, is that "spiritual kindness" (pardon my phrase theft) can't be explained with math or even defined with language for that matter.

Mr. Price himself killed himself after he went mad trying to disprove his own work. He "discovered" the theorem when he was an Atheist.

He began contemplating about his own life and how everything came together to bring him to the point where he was at. In other words, he believed that there were far too many coincidences that he believed influenced his life's journey. For example, he had something like 5 serious gf's in a row who had the name "Mary" (I can't remember the real name). Since he was a "love at first sight" kind of guy, he reasoned that he was not attracted to the specific name for some unknown reason since his infatuation for the women would begin before he knew their names.

Anyways he looked at a lot of others things and worked out the individual odds of each coincidence and them looked at the odds of each one coming together. He reasoned that only an outside force or "God" could overcome those odds so he became a believer.

Prince Harry stated that they DO make the controls like a PS controller for the gunships... They shoot up some mosque... then go back to base and play Modern Warfare 3 on the console. It's pretty sick.

I remember reading about that now. It seems like Dirty Harry has a habit of saying what's on his mind. That's a terrible thing to do.

Sometimes a little reminder is enough to deter some people. After all, if a suicidal bomber believes that the act of blowing up innocents in the name of his faith is a guaranteed trip to the heavens, it could do some good in reminding them that we have the ability of cancelling that "free pass" with a little pig slop.

My problem with the theorem is that I believe we are only here to grow "spiritually", or however you prefer. But I believe we still exist in some form after this life. If this life is it, and the show is over, then I can see how every act of kindness would be selfish. Since surely being nice to others will promote others to be nice to you and your offspring, therefore increasing their chances of survival. Even if you gave away everything you had to the point that it actually hurt you, it could still benefit your offspring.

It is an afterlife that disproves this theorem to me. But I can't prove that with math.

I edited my post. Thanks, as it made no sense.

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If one is kind because of empathy and compassion then it is selfless. - "I will give you this because I understand what it's like to be starving and to go without"

I personally believe that there can be true selfless kindness but the theorem supposedly proves otherwise. It says that no matter what, altruism is an evolutionary trait and therefore all acts of kindness are self serving. Empathy and compassion are emotions that may drive one to do good for others. IF it makes the person feel good after they help, then it is selfish. If they feel no better for doing good afterwards, then it is still a supposed selfish act, and the math supposedly proves that. But I can't see how in cases like that.

I emailed a professor from the University of Texas at Austin. She is a sociologist and has a PhD. in some sciences that I can't even pronounce. She has replied to me before in the past. If she does so again this time, I will post her reply if anyone is interested. Thanks.

Why do you think nobody speaks about violence in video games anymore? Can you say "military training grounds"? Have you seen these new games?

They're not even trying to lie about that. There was an article on cnn sometime last year in which some colonel said that if we had the drone capability thirty years ago, it would take at least a year for the remote operator to master the hand eye coordination needed. But now, they have gamers come in and have it mastered in a couple of weeks. There is even talk about making the controls the same as the x-box and playstation. They have no qualms about desensitizing kids to violence and war.

This link had the most pics. Like I said, it looks fake to me but I don't know jack.

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2013/02/08/irans-newest-warplane-something-from-gi-joe/?iref=allsearch

I think there is some truth to a lot of AJ's theories. He needs to change his delivery if he ever wants to make a real difference. But I'd probably get upset too if no one was paying attention.

Beedeekin- Have you seen the pics of Iran's new jet. Experts claim it is a mock up and a bad one at that. It looks fake to me but only because I was easily swayed by their opinions. If they had all said that this jet this was flying death, I'd probably believe that as well. I just don't know enough. I'm sure you're not an aviation's expert but you probably know a prop when you see one.

[thousand]

I got curious so I looked up the lethal dose of acetaminophen. A lethal dose usually occurs betwenn 40-50 thousand mg. That's over ten times the amount in 8 vicoden. Although, the lethal dose can be substantially less if you have a damaged liver. This is no get out of jail free card since that has to be way past the lethal dose of the actual pain med. Right?

I know that number seems high but I verified it from two web sources.

Can anyone decipher what might have happened for me?

That's an easy one to answer. You messed around with something that you didn't understand, yet you put a lot of belief into it. Whether or not these beings are real matters little. What matters is that they are real to you. And that is powerful enough. Believe that none of it can hurt you and that will be true. Are you hesitant to take the jobs because you think they come with strings attached? If so, I believe you are right but they are your own strings. I'm curious as to why you continued making the deal with this being even when you were losing your awareness. Did you even consider that this entity may have intended or even caused your lack of awareness? If you didn't, you should consider it, . It can't hurt you physically but once you believe it can cause you bad luck, you will in turn cause your own bad luck.

Good luck in all of this. You may need all you can get if you give this too much belief. I'm sorry. I'm just hate demon talk. I don't believe in them anymore and it keeps to many people from trying to learn the truth. There are negative entities but you can escape their influence anytime you like and none of them can drag you into any type of hell that you can't simply leave from.

Lion-That was the understatement of the millennium.

Beedeekin-Does Allah despise swine that much? If the Muslims are that extreme in their beliefs, I think you make an interesting point. I will take this to Obama ASAP. Don't worry though, I'll give you the credit for the idea. Whether or not he does, well... that's a different story.

Oh, one of the reasons the Pentagon approved this is to make up for the void created from punk-men who are ineligible for service. Chubs, addicts, and all around felons.

I'm sure many of you are aware that the US has finally allowed women to be in combat oriented missions. I know that women in the US military have already been in combat but they weren't allowed to be a part of any forward mission in which one of it's directives is seek and engage contact with the enemy. Since the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan do not have front-lines in the classic sense, the reality is that this could not always be prevented.

But the times that women did have to engage the enemy, they were pulled out as soon as possible. I have to say that I am against this. For me, this is not a question of courage. Women have already proven that they are just as capable of stepping up to the plate as much as men. Considering that women are not naturally as aggressive as men, their heroics really stand out. And we didn't need a war to know this. It's also interesting as to how this change came about.

An Army General (not sure who) told the pentagon why he changed his own personal opinion on this matter. He described a mission back in the first year or two of the war in Iraq. He was part of a convoy that was protecting him as he made his way through Baghdad. On their route, they were ambushed and fought their way out. Once they reached relative safety, the General called the soldiers together to thank them for their courage. Every body left their post as they were told to listen to the General. All did except from one. The General walked up to a Humvee to address a soldier who had not climbed down and was still manning the .50 cal. Impressed with the soldiers sense of duty, he asked him what his name was. The soldier looked down at the General and told him Rebecca.

At present, the physical requirements are not as tough for the women as they are for the men. So long as the women meet the same requirements, I suppose that shouldn't be a problem. But I hope that the standards for the men are not lowered so as to accommodate the women. I know that there are many female athletes today that are as tough and strong as some men. But I do not believe that this carries over into the general population at large.

I just don't see anything wrong with a society that does not want it's mothers and daughters fighting in combat.

You missed the part where I said that the current state of humanity isn't ready for a one-world government. 

Humanity has A LOT of growing up to do before this can occur with Love.

Any government (or anything for that matter, concept, idea, etc...) born out of fear, will always succumb to the lowest common denominator.

I didn't. But if you don't mind, I am still interested in your ideas. We must help each other to overcome our ignorance.

Just realized I dived into the topic talking about zombie stuff without giving its_all_bad credit for his first post.

Well thank you. I did not mean it imply that I discount the power of religion or that I am enlightened and others aren't. The main reason I wrote it is because I have changed so much since I found this forum. I know it is a drastic "transformation" for one to have seemingly made in only one month. So much so, that it would almost appear as if I was just trolling. The truth is that the change in my spiritual beliefs was not over night nor did it come easily. I have only accepted it and felt good about it because of the help that I received from the pulse. Of course I haven't yet found all the pieces to the puzzle but I have started connecting the ones I have.

I too suffered from panic attacks for the better part of ten years. I know they are horrible and no matter how many times you have one, fear will always grip you. But eventually you will regain your composure faster and faster.


edit: ignore everything after "...part of ten years." and just reread what Beedeekin wrote.

Just tell me to go and crap on my own face if I seem to be getting antsy or confrontational. I never want to really come across that way.

Are you saying that your head is up your arse? If so, can you project from that position?lol

What gives? Why would you want to leave the pulse? I for one have gained much insight from your posts. As well as the others.

Is this intuition you have negative as in you think something bad may happen?

Regardless, sometimes these 'gut feelings" are hard to ignore and that in and of itself is a good reason to pay attention. Remember that any prophecies or premonitions are not set in stone. Whether the future event is negative or positive, the actual future is always subject to change and any predictions is just one possible outcome.

I heard a good analogy recently. Consider your arm to be the path your life has taken. Your actual hand is the present day. Your fingers are the different paths that are your possible futures.

For example if you think you will be in a car wreck, there are too many variables that are out of your control or influence. You can't prevent other drivers from causing the accident that you think you may be in.  What you can do, is to look at your own driving habits and see what you are able to control. For instance, do you speed or maybe tend to run red lights when you think it's safe. If you do, then you can change these habits and decrease your chances of being in an accident.

My limited understanding in all this tells me that you shouldn't worry yourself sick over this feeling you have but you shouldn't ignore it either. I know I didn't say anything here that you didn't already know or think but it can't help to have someone else hope the best for you. So missym, I'm putting it out there in the universe that I hope the best for you. Good luck and have faith that things will work out for the best.

I was referring to the fact that when we are in the Astral that our thoughts seem to run away from us and manifest. We think, therefor it happens...

I actually used the term 'demon like spirit'. What would be a more appropriate way to describe an evil laughing horned black being with hoofs? Would it be more politically correct to say the prior instead of 'demon like'?

IDK, a mean goat with bronchitis?    Like, I said my post was not directed at you. I believe "demon like spirit" clearly conveys what you intended it to.

Though I believe that is is the goal of some elitists, I can't possibly imagine how it could happen. Even extreme power grabs with brutal force seem unlikely to succeed post ww2. We've seen some brutal regimes come and go since but the Nazi's were the best and I believe the last at world domination. And I see plenty to fear from that example.

To be remotely possible, genocides would have to occur on an apocalyptic level, otherwise forget about a utopian one world gov. Bitterness will grow and grow from one gen to the next unless all historical references were erased forever. In other words, the people will have to be kept completely ignorant in order to instill a conformist ideology in them. The negatives completely outweigh the few "positives" that I can see. And it's a real stretch to call them positive in any real sense.

I really am interested in hearing Xanth's opinion on how this could be positive. My motivation in any discussion is never to change someone's opinion. In contrast, I'm always looking to see if I am ignorant to something and if I agree I will research it further or at the very least be more open minded.

You should love it Ellis. For me it sets the gold standard. Brooks will never wow you with his prose but he's not trying to either. It's about the most believable style so far to give a real feel to something that is great fun but utter non sense. It's creepier that way. Let us know what you think.

As far as the movie goes, we'll have to wait and see but right now I'm wishing Leonardo Dicaprio (sp?) would have won the rights to make the movie.

Some serious critics said that if the movie followed the book, the question of whether or not a zombie movie could win an academy award for writing or acting would be answered. lol

Interesting. Ignorance is another tantalizing possibility to entertain my zombie possibilities.

"The Walking Dead" mid-season premiere is tonight.

On a different thread you asked me if I had read "World War Z"? The better question would be to ask how many times have I read it.

It's by far the best in the genre IMO. Brooks approaches it from a pragmatic stance. He doesn't give them any enhanced abilities yet he doesn't automatically strip them of their physical abilities. Instead, he lets them deteriorate as we might think it would happen. The interview tactic makes for a quick read yet it can be put down and picked back up at any time and start anywhere in the book and not be lost with few exceptions.

I am disappointed in the super zombies that the trailers imply but only because they are using the WWZ title. Though I am at heart a zombie purist, the zombie concept that I consider pure is actually a modern change. So how's that for contradiction.

I think the zombie has to change with the times to keep it's relevance in horror fiction. It has to reflect our current fears and anxieties in a society to be appealing. It's interesting to look back ans see how the zombie is explained to be reanimated.

Cold war zombies were reanimated by radiation and chemical weapons due to the prevailing fear of nukes.

Modern zombies are now actually infected through viruses since bird flu and all that started the media rounds.

Many universities in the states are using the zombie phenom to teach philosophical classes. It's effective to assimilate pop culture with studies that many people otherwise would not have been excited to learn about.

We can not discount the Wider Zombie Reality.

Answer: When you can. It doesn't matter if many people have more success at certain times. If you have a practical reason that prevents you from doing the same, the only solution is to practice when you can.

Don't stop trying a certain technique until you give it at least a couple of weeks. A month is even better probably but I know how impatient we can be. After you have tried several different techniques without success, try combining some or simplify them in your own way.

Remember that many of us were introduced to this without knowing it was even possible. So it is suffice to say that no technique is needed. However, that approach won't benefit us on a consistent basis.

I just wanted to illustrate the point that this is easy but no one ever realizes that until after they have put in a lot of hard work. Irony.

The real key to success is never giving up.

I read that menu and you're right. Me loves it.

I think the most unconventional animals from which I received nourishment from are: octopus, rattlesnake, iguana, armadillo, raccoon, and raw hornet larvae. There's more but I don't want people to think I can't be trusted around their pets. And then there is the organs too. This is not my staple diet but when I come across cultures that have a different palate, I embrace it to grow. My stomach does not always agree though.