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Your best bet is to just use straight up baking soda to brush with and leave the products alone.

I didn't see this line at the first time. So you have tried this? What is your expereince with it, if I may ask?

Hi Chase!

First, I wanted to say that there is a lot of misinformation out there surrounding fluoride and the pineal gland.  All of the info you read is pure conjecture.  There are no facts out there regarding this.  So take EVERYTHING you read with a grain of salt.  Don't fall I to the pit of fear which others have ingrained themselves in.

You are not entirely correct. Well, you are, if you are talking only about pineal gland. But there is plenty of info about the effects of fluorides on humans.
A few examples, many are actually backed up by mainstream-type research:

http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/ben/cst/2007/00000002/00000003/art00003
http://www.amazon.com/The-Fluoride-Deception-Christopher-Bryson/dp/1583227008
http://www.psychiatriepropraxi.cz/artkey/psy-200705-0004.php
http://www.benthamscience.com/ebooks/Sample/9781608051960-sample.pdf
http://www.amazon.com/The-Case-against-Fluoride-Hazardous/dp/1603582878

Maybe we all should try this (I don't have personal experience with this yet, but I am planning to try it someday). http://www.healingteethnaturally.com/dr-hulda-clark-non-toxic-brushing-mouthwash.html

This a very interesting topic. These stories, used to totally freak me out. They were, among others, one of the reasons that prevented me from trying AP out of fear.

Now this is intersting. Maybe just a few months ago, I would be scared by this. Just like I was after watching this particular movie: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1161864/ quite a while ago. But now I find it just interesting. I guess this a good sign I am doing great conquering my fears towards projection (if I haven't already conquered them).

But to the point: You guys (Lionheart, Xanth, Szaxx etc., sorry for forgetting the others ) seem to be in agreement with teachings of Tom Campbell (btw. he is really good, thank you for introducing him to me). And part of what he says, if I remember correctly, is that there is little chance you will come across something nasty in wider reality that can hurt you. Yet there is just a small one (I think he related it to the danger while driving a car, yet people are not scared of driving it).

But it seems to me you are not acknowledging this part, since it doesn't fit into your belief-system where demons etc. don't exist (if I may use your own terms against you ). I agree with you that many demons, demonic possesions... are just thoughts-created. But what if not all of them? How can you rule it out just because you have never encountered a real demonic entity? Maybe this only-a-little-chance of being hurt that Cambell mentions and some of these cases are connected?

Thank you for your thoughts and sorry if I got you wrong.

Reminds me of my experience.  One night, Rangers were going to play Penguins. That night I dreamt about Rangers winning 5-2. In the morning I thought: please, let it be 5-2. It was! Except for Penguins won 5-2. LOL

Thanks for sharing that experience. It's not the first time that I've heard reports about dream premonitions. Without getting off topic here, do you believe in a fatalist universe, our paths are already predetermined? Or that our current actions might shape the possible future events, just like many possible threads?

I am not into the fate stuff. If our fate is already determined, what is the point of being here? Aside from watch-movie-like experience, which is I believe not that valuable.

You do have a good point.   I was lucky that I had a number of aps so I had some knowledge.   I was able to separate what was sensible and the ridiculous things.   If I knew nothing then that might have been different.   I could have fallen for it.  I was very lucky.

You are indeed very lucky. I hadn't had  sufficient experience so I did fall for it. And it stopped me from attempting AP for a few years. I wonder how much would have been different, had I only found this site on top of the google search. I did find it eventually couple of months ago but it was because of my inner voice telling me I really should try to learn to AP and to overcome my fear by doing more research. And this forum was the key factor in it. but then, I can imagine many people stopped trying AP for the rest of their lives, not only couple of years, because of these fear-mongers.

So... this leads me to an question: Don't you guys have some spare money you would like to invest on behalf of this site so it would always pop up at the first place on google? Please note: I don't.

[what the secret is to cure cancer.]

I have often pondered what the secret of time travel is and perhaps what the secret is to cure cancer.

It is a bit off topic but can't help it. You don't need to AP in order to find out what pharmaceutical industry is hiding from you.
Watch this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWLrfNJICeM

and read something about Dr. Hulda Clark and Zapper. Don't know for sure if the cures above work, but I with a certainty I can say that zapper does. Also note that Wikipedia would not be the righ source as it again didn't disappoint with its bias.

You still don't understand. Science already has. Paranormal phenomena have been proven in lab settings and in the field by scientists (with a degree!) e.g. parapsychologists, physicists, medical doctors etc. without doubt. For decades now. There is a vast amount of literature on this. This result is getting suppressed and ridiculed due to fear and dogma. 

And I can't help it but to add this favourite quote of mine:
Scientists from the Harvard University have found out that people believe everything that scientists from the Harvard University find out.

Why next thing you'll be saying S.Hawking doesn't believe. He can't even if he wanted to. He's a scientist and bound by the money payers wants.

I agree.
And BTW: Who is/was a greater scientist? Hawking or Einstein? I think it doesn't really matter but in addition to those scientists=atheists there are scientists, who believe that science actually proves the existence of God/wider reality/whatever else you wanna call it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_views_of_Albert_Einstein

But beliefs in general, no matter how strong, suck. So do things that come from the mouth of people around you. They might be true but you can't know for sure, unless you have seen the proof for yourself. This is the only reliable way: go find out on your own. Don't believe me, don't believe Szaxx, don't believe Einstein, don't believe Hawking, don't believe Randi, don't believe your atheist friend, don't believe television, not even Mickey Mouse. Believe yourself!

For example, if you are dubious about AP validations, learn the art, if you have the dedication, and do one on your own. Then you will know and not just guess, assume, believe, be inclined to think... just based on what others told you.  These assumptions have no value! Knowing has! And until you do know, keep your eyes open and accept all possibilities. I hope you see what I mean. So Mr. Depressed, stop being depressed (what is the point of feeling depressed anyway?) and go ahead. Good luck.

At first you might be vexed to act on your own. After all, we humans are sometimes very lazy creatures and want to keep things easy and simple. But eventually yo will discover how good it feels to really know. I myself have been told many times: "You have to find you own way, see for yourself etc." On this forum, too. But people who say this have the right of it.

And in regards to that Randi thing and "No one has ever won the challenge." Well, how can you be so sure?  That guy is either a hypocrite or an extremely close-minded person. Even if he had the proof about afterlife etc. in his hands, he would surely find some feeble excuse and never accept it. And all his likes (hello guys from Metabunk.org, in case you are reading this, which you are probably not ) would never question him. That is my opinion, anyway.

Why do you state that your friend "proved" sth to you? Fact is: He didn't. He is just giving his false and shallow materialist "reasoning" or opinion. And you fell for it.

You fell into the pseudo-skeptics trap, don't be ashamed because many do unfortunately. The Randi prize is a scam all-out. It is not intended to prove paranormal phenomena. It is there to uphold the materialist world-view which is nothing but another religious BELIEF.

Yep, exactly

Do you think that. science will ever be able to prove this? Or is there some natural law to the universe that says that this can never be made believable by atheist standards of massive mainstream of acceptance?

By proving, you probably mean an utter-proof. The answer is probably no. But then, at court the judge (or the jury, depending on which country you are  living in) is sometimes presented with less strong proofs. And it is up to him to make the verdict. And should the judge be corrupted, he would even twist such a proof as a videotape, convicting the criminal of the crime he is committing on that recording.

Here it is basically the same thing. There is good evidence, there is evidence that is not so good but it is always up to the judgment of the person looking at it. And if a close-minded sceptic looks at this evidence... guess what?

I also have that kind of involuntary twitching. Thanks for the tips, especially the one about relaxing muscles seems like spot-on for me.

I have never seen these "reptilians" you talk about. In fact, this is the first time I hear of such a thing, and perhaps that's precisely why I have encountered none. See where I'm going with this?

And by the way, I'm an atheist. You don't need to believe deities (or a deity) exist in order to believe reality extends further, specially if faith has nothing to do with it, but rather first-hand evidence. But in any case, what is a god anyway?

Yeah, I see your point

If you go with the exact definition of who an atheist is, then you are indeed one. Like you I don't think God is a person/diety or something like that. But atheist is also a commonly used label for person who denies the existence of any other reality than the physical one he or she is living in. And that is what I ceased to be.

Yeah and I used to be an atheist before my first (and so far the last , but hopefully not for long ) OOBE. It totally rocked my view on the life and opened my mind to things I would haveconsidered crazy before. But you might have already read that in another thread.

But it was more complicated than that. I come from a family where my dad doesn't believe in anything after death and my mother is a christian and her parents are into it even more. They often made me go to church with them and pray before sleep, bought my children Bibles... when I was a small kid. So I automatically became a christianity-follower too. But as I grew a bit older and started developing my own sense, I began to question the palpable absurdity of christian dogmas and the belief itself. Back then I knew nothing but the different approaches of my parents so when I found myself disagreeing with my mother's I figured my father's must be correct. I also became interested in science... so here we go (doesn't mean I am not anymore, just have a more open-minded view).

From that moment on I was an atheist and never gave much thought to this area. It never occured to me there might be some othere "truth" than a rigid religious belief-system and atheist nonbelief-system (no less rigid by the way , but we all now this). Until that OOBE I had. So yes, this experience changed me a lot and to better, I think. And what a coincidence it was, I never meant to consciously AP. But we all, including Master Yoda , know that "There is no such a thing as coincidence, only the Force."

Hey, that is great discussion, I couldn't be agreeing more.

To the initial post of Astral-Tea, though: Maybe I have got something new for you. There is this guy I know and I was talking with him about dreams and stuff and then we got to OOBEs. He told me about his experiences (from what he described I am pretty sure it was an OOBE: vibrations, then floating in his bedroom etc.) and then went on explaining how he had found how to perform this "self-hypnosis" on the internet and how it was just a work of the brain and nothing more. When I told him about my views and my experience, he accepted my POV but told me he didn't believe in this spiritual stuff.

So here you have your answer. Also atheists can AP. But there was probably no cognitive dissonance to it, that is true. He believed in his ability to do it, just didn't share our views on what it really was.

Reptilians, ROFL.
You may find some giant snakes if youre lucky. Reptilian Star-trek type characters must avoid me if they're as common as reported about.
Unless Im one and badass too.
There's another good reason to learn the art, a new game, spot the reptilian.

I shall see for myself. I have been getting closer with my practise lately (I am going to write about that in the Destynee plan topic in a few days and some feedback would be helpful ) and I am looking forward to explore about the nature of reality. I thought it might be intersting to look into this dubious yet intersting theory as well (but surely I am no die hard fan of this and it wouldn't be the first thing I would do). But you make a very good point. If indeed they are so common, then you or some other member of this forum who is an experienced traveller, would be likely to encounter them. It seems like none of you have, though.

Unless you are indeed in league with them and just feeding me disinfo. Shame on you, nasty lizzards.

Which actually makes sense considering the nature of the Global System.  It doesn't matter who's in "power" or who wins what war.  The System will still be the System. 

Yes, it actually supports, but certainly not confirms, that we are living in a matrix. 

[NO]

Well, I have already written about my OBE experience here, but I guess I might +write sth here too.

I used to be an atheist before my first OBE who thought that evyrithing spiritual, paranormal etc. was a bunch of crap. My experience changed me. I am quite certain many of these things are real (for instance, I have seen the proof of energy healing for myself) and I am certainly no atheist anymore: I am convinced about the existence of soul, afterlife etc. On the other hand, I am member of NO church or religious group since these thing have nothing in common with God but much in common with manipulating people and making money (just my opinion). The only religion I find intriguing and valuable is buddhism, which is pretty much no religion but philosophy and way of living.

After my first OBE experience (see the thread in OBE section) I was afraid to atempt. But recently I began to feel like being up to learning it so here I am. This is the largest community of intelligent people (at least most of you seem to be, judging by your posts   ) doing these things. So I wanted to join in, share and learn here. It seems like a good place for it.

I am a sportsman, I do judo. That's my  hobby and maybe the source of me being influenced by eastern philosophies.

That is about  everything. So hello everyone and thank you all for providing me a place to talk about things that are considered crazy by most of the people I know.

Hi BranStark, welcome to the Pulse.
Destinys' plan is the best place to learn at present and I see you have joined in.
Your fears must be confronted and removed, this is one of the first things to sort.
The reptilians and more will be something you'll soon find out about if you have the dedication required.
You will have your own answers and the truth first hand.
Exciting stuff...

I can already see that I am not so fearful toward AP anymore, partially thanks to this forum . But I guess I can get rid of it absolutely only while finally being there.

I just hope no reptilians noticed this thread who could silence me before I confirm their existence in AP and reveal it to the world... just kidding, really.

I hope you decide to work through this fear and see for yourself.

That is exactly what I am intending to do.

I'm posting from the heart of Europe.

Čech?

If you don't understand, the answer to my question is no.

I have seen "The boy who lived before" documentary. It deals with the same subject. Has anyone seen this too? What do you think: fake or real? Seems real to me.

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/the-boy-who-lived-before/

That would be Dr. Masaru Emoto.
I have tried his Rice experiment (see http://www.positive-thinking-principles.com/positive-thinking-power.html ) but since I didn't want anyone to know what I am doing (I could hear them: "What are you doing here, are you nuts or what?"   ), I hid the containers in a drawer and sealed them so it wouldn't stink. That might be one reason why it didn't work out. The other one is I often forgot to do the speaking to them or whatever it is called. I kind of hid them in that drawer from myself, too.

Has anyone tried this or similar experiment, too?

Thank you for your replies.
Szaxx: I have had a look at the forum you have posted link to and I think it is very kind of you, guys, to help people this way. I am going to join in and will be very grateful for  any answers to my questions. I guess I will just write a similar introduction like here, although I have to set it straight a little bit. In my first post to this forum I  mixed up a lot of different things together which was not very wise, I can see. Therefore, I won't mess things up with Icke and so on in there and instead will focus on the main point I am interested in: self-development through learning to AP. That is why I signed for this forum in the first place, anyway. Apparently, the other forum is better-suited just for that. Do I get it right, Szaxx? And thank you once more for the great job you are doing with this.

As for Mr. Icke: I am fonder of conspiracy theories than most of you here seem to be but I am certainly not any die-hard fan of them. I look into them every now and then to see "the other side of the Moon." I am no sheep and no blind follower of the government (recent cases with Snowden, Manning etc. would have me right) so I always like to see what others (unofficial sources) have to say. It doesn't mean I believe everything anti-mainstream: I always ponder both sides and come to my own opinion from that. I think the truth is worth knowing since the truth is freedom, in a sense. There are theories I am quite sure are true (9/11, Big pharma conspiracy against alternative medicine, spiritual things...) - of tha latter two I have seen a proof for myself (that OBE I have had and also effect of alternative medicine and even energy/reiki healing on myself), otherwise I wouldn't have come to this place, would I? . Then there are theories plausible to me (puppet governments etc.) and others that I think are totally crap (chemtrails for instance, or one of the brand new ones: Paul Walker shot by a drone).

So don't consider me a conspiracy-nutter.

Why did I mention Icke. Well, I came across his work  only recently so the impression is still fresh and, like Volgerle, I was intrigued by his idea of a matrix and perceiving the larger reality. (Unlike you, though, I don't think he is being negative. In my opinion, it is only an missinterpretation of his message. If I listened only to 3 parts of his "Lion sleeps no more" lecture, I would think the same as you. But in the last part, he sets everything into a  very positive light.) So I wanted to know what you think of his reptilian theory: if you have ever seen something, while in astral or in physical reality, that would either support or disclaim it. So have you?

I just did the mistake of writing about it and about my OBE experience, which was the main point, in the same thread, and it might have confused the matter a little bit. Now that it is settled and I will focus on my main questions on that Destynee's plan, I still have this hypothetical question for you (I am just being curious what you think): If I used AP for validating Icke's theory and indeed found a reptilian out there, would I be able tell my imagination from reality? And if it was a real reptilian out there, would I be still safe (since you cannot be harmed in astral) or could they hurt me somehow (maybe even by locating my physical body and afterwards doing something to me)?

I remind you once more: I am rather sceptical about reptilians and my primary focus with learning to AP is self-development, but still... I wanted to look into it one day, I want to be sure what I am doing.

BTW: Thanks for the link, Volgerle, much appreciated.

[Thank you for answering this one, especially.]

Hello everyone,
I discovered your site just a few days ago and I have found it extremely helpful. I wanted to find a bigger community of experienced astral travellers who could help me to fully understand sth I went through (guess what it is ) and it seems like I am on the right place.

Let me share my story and thank you very much for any ideas, tips, recommendations... you might have:

Couple of years ago I read an article about AP somewhere and I thought it was the funniest and most ridiculous thing ever. I also heard about it from my friend who claimed to be able to do it. Poor lad, he must be ill, I thought.  Back then I was rather an atheist and had not experienced anything spiritual, not even a LD (none that I could remember, anyway).

But about 2 years ago (I guess it was about summer 2011) I was sleeping in my bed and suddenly realised I was dreaming. Wow, I thought. Almost instantly that AP article came across my mind (I have no idea how I got to think about it, it just happened). It was only such a brief thought, but still... I found myself rising in that horizontal position I was lying in and floating towards the ceiling. From what I know now, it could have been an awesome experience. But instead it was awful, because I also remembered that friend of mine telling me it was dangerous and that one might not be able to return. Guess what, I panicked. And I panicked so bad. I was afraid to open my eyes (I was not able to see, might be I had the eyelids of my etherical body shut?) so I did not. That is also why I am not 100% sure I was away from my body, just 99%. I really felt like I was hovering at the ceiling and if I had opened my eyes (possibly of the etherical body) I could have seen myself lying in bed. But might it also be that I was only close to being in astral but just not there yet? I am asking because from what I have come to understand about AP, you should always be able to see, no matter what, and even all the directions at once. Or is it not so? Thank you for answering this one, especially. But back to the experience. I wanted to go back into my physical body immediatelly and after a moment (no idea how long it was) I was kind of sinking back into it and I found myself fully awake in my body. That is where it really got awful. My body started to spasm fiercely and although awake, I could not open my eyes. It went on for maybe 20 seconds and first when my body calmed down I opened my eyes and got up.

I am quite sure it was so unpleasant because I became so hysterical while in there. Is it right?

This experience changed me quite profoundly. I became convinced that there is sth more to it. I do not recognise myself as a member of any movement or religion (since religion and especially church has nothing in common with real belief and spirituality but rather with making profit, in my opinion, no offense to anyone ) but I am very intrigued by eastern philosophies, mainly buddhism, and am inclined to believe in reincarnation. I practise judo so that might have influenced me in this area, too.  I also have had couple of LDs but no WILDs and I was not able to control them fully. That is probably because I haven't commited myself to learning LDs properly yet. One of them was quite funny, though. I was dreaming and realised it was so and I woke up, not into reality but into yet another dream and I thought it was the reality already. Dream in a dream. Like in the Inception movie. Does it happen to you, too?

BTW: What do you think de ja vu is? Is it sth one sees in a dream and it happens in real world afterwards? I am asking because when I was writing last paragraph I got very very strong de ja vu feeling. I thought I must have written this already, at this very place, on this very computer. But I am also sure I have never written anything like this. Just a thought. 

Back to the topic: I have also started meditating on regular basis. A few times while meditating I felt like spinning around my axis. Awesome feeling. I have read a few theories what it means but what do you guys think.

Ever since that astral experience of mine I described above (my only one so far) I have been afraid to attempt it intentionally. That is mainly because of lot of crap I read on the internet and stuff that my friend-who-can-do-astral-travel told me. You know, demons, attack by entities, danger of getting stuck there... It even got that far that I was afraid to fall asleep for a couple of nights for I feared I would find myself being there in astral, unable to get back.  I also read that it is safe, I did. But since there were 2 quite opposite opinions on the matter I was not sure what to make of it.

Then I found your site. I just think you guys are doing great job explaining things and it has helped me overcome my fears to a great extent. Now I am planning to get rid of it absolutely and start attempting APs. Thank you so much for assuring me that it cannot be dangerous as long as I stay calm. It seems like you all agree on this. Well, that is very helpful to me so I know now how things really are. Thumbs up!

I also came across the work of David Icke. I got the feeling most of you do not agree with conspiracy theories. Nor do I believe in every single thing I read on the internet. But I have been interested in the stuff even before I knew DI's work, done quite a research and am 100% convinced of couple of things (9/11, Big Pharmas...) so lot of what he says makes sense to me. Even that matrix stuff (since I have had that astral experience, otherwise I would have thought him a complete nutter). What I am intersted in: if I wanted to find out, if it really is true about reptilians etc. (about that, I really am not convinced at all, rather a sceptic but I admit there might be sth to it) through astral and if I saw reptilians there, would I know that I saw them only because I expected to or that they really were there. Could I tell the difference? And could it, in this specific case, indeed be dangerous if I met a true reptilian, alien or whaever?

Do not take me wrong. I do not want to AP just to confirm or debunk conspiracy theories. Spiritual development is my goal (that is why I do meditation, too) but it would be intersting to look into these things in astral, I reckon.

Thumbs up if you managed to read the whole post and thanks for any reply.