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It's never worked for me when I click on the address fro your signature.

I think most of them come from Hollywood but some of the more powerful ones got their first break in early literature and folklore.

I was serious about that but what I can tell you is that I have not ever ran into anything that was meaner than a grumpy old man, they might try to take on the form of an intimidating entity but if you don't believe in what they are trying to represent, you will see them for what they are, wasted potential and nothing more. I've seen some heinous stuff in the NPR but just like this reality, they were always consciousness's that still related to their human form. If you don't entertain the idea of demons and such, you don't have to worry about them existing to you. Let the other guy worry about his own demons if they refuse to listen and you'll be just fine.

I'm not exactly sure what you are referring to but it sounds like you are content and happy. That's probably the most we can ask for.

I always wonder why do the guides need us human that travels in the astral to retrieve?  I have not personally done any retrievals.  Any thoughts?

I'm not sure who get's helped the most during a retrieval, the retriever or the retrieved. I can tell you that a successful retrieval can be a very rewarding experience that can only be felt as strongly as the low of failing. But you can and will go back until you get it right. The emotional impact depends on what you see and have to do. When the time is right, you will be presented with one.

All those long nights and frustration were finally worth it, weren't they? Those little doubts that creep in should be totally erased, if not, they soon will be. It's hard to imagine but they will get more "real" than "real" sometimes. Especially when you get a validation from one in this PMR.

I think ton's of research can hold some people back because of all the conflicting stories and interpretations but they will be way ahead of the game when they do succeed. It's a trade off, that's for sure, but we can only take the path to our first intentional OOBE once. I'm interested to know why you were denied a guide.

Anyways, congrats and I'm sure someone here will bump into you in the Astral at some point. The key is to know it and to remember. Have fun exploring.

As to where you go when you die , where do you want to go ? 

Direct, yet so elegant. Nicely put.

[usually]

Welcome. This sounds like an amazing night.

I'm gonna be matter of fact, and understand that I am not telling you what to believe, that's all for you to decide and no one else.

I am 100% certain that you did not cause the things to move around while returning to your body because you never went anywhere. The reason why I say this is for another discussion. With that said, are you familiar with poltergeists? This is when phenomena occurs and is usually attributed to a teenage girl dealing with her own overwhelming emotions. She causes things to move unknowingly through her untapped physic abilities while trying to deal with her emotions.

Like I said, this is usually how it is explained but a few instances have been documented where it involves males and they tend to be older. Is it possible that this OOBE felt so real to you that poltergeist phenomenon could be the explanation? Doubtful but who knows.

Most likely, nothing moved. You woke up in a state of sleep paralysis and heard things moving. Read the following threads and decide for yourself if this satisfies you.

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_out_of_body_experiences/sleep_paralysis_the_intruder_or_presence-t40033.0.html

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_out_of_body_experiences/sleep_paralysis_auditory_hallucinations-t40020.0.html

If not, we need to nip something in the bud now before you convince yourself of something. No evil entity followed you back and moved your things. Many people whom I respect deeply disagree with me on this but I can only speak from my own perspective.

Did you have an oobe? Yes, absolutely. Did you perceive evil? Yes but it doesn't really exist. Did you leave your body? No, there's nowhere to go.

Don't be confused if you can't understand the paradox of what I said. It will take some more OOBE for you to come to understand what I believe to be true. But you may never believe it as I do. I hope that is every ones' truth.

Good luck and I hope you get your answers.

I don't really have much fear to be honest. I realize that nothing can really harm me. So far, I've had a few "entities" try to scare me, but it didn't work for them. I say "entities" because they were probably manifestations of my own thoughts. The last time I had an OBE and a dark hooded "something" was walking into my room but I didn't let it bother me and it disappeared.

Sorry fuzzywuzzy, I was directing that at myself actually because I am a prime example of how fear and preformed beliefs can stunt your growth while having OOBEs, even for years.

There are plenty of miserable entities but none have the "power" to affect you unless you let them, which you seem to already no this. The really bad scary ones are always from ourselves.

You can only prove it to yourself. There are incredible theories that can neatly square most ideas away but you still have to do the personal work. And even then, it is just a theory. I am confident enough to say that I know what is "next" but I am smart enough to know I can't prove it to anyone.

Xanth and Szaxx said it all. I assumed the original request meant spirituality and not actual combat but I chuckled when I read the first replies because that is of course what a warrior is usually engaged in.

Maybe the rules change after we no longer have a physical body but right now there is nothing to do to defend yourself against negs because a). they don't objectively exist in the sense that makes most people fear them b) the subjective negs can only be dealt with from within and not some external force.

I'm not trying to cover my ears and cry la la la la in an attempt to fool myself. Look within.

Sometimes we don't get enough out of the experience to know in the moment what is actually happening but there is no such thing as a useless OOBE. Each one teaches you something new or just plain builds confidence. And who knows, the story may not be over and you will be returning. Maybe not today and may be not tomorrow.........

Man, an unmentionable punishment for possession of parsley and running, that's harsh.

[without fear]

Give it 10 years of regular experiences and see what your capable of knowing.
Things progress...
It gets very interesting indeed.
One step at a time.

Give it ten years without fear and see what you are capable of knowing.

This is a real game or an OOBE?

Welcome. I like your terminology of how you describe the astral realms. I try not to use any myself, as I find it is a hindrance to my exploration. But I like yours none the less.

The brain is nothing but a filter that is suppressing the non physical reality and it's knowledge so that we can identify with this reality. Hallucinogens do a fantastic job at removing the veil so to speak. With that said, I believe many of the accounts that people report while under their influence but I dismiss them outright as far as any objective evidence. Once OOBE are accepted as objectively real, I believe science will begin to look at the effects of hallucinogens in a different perspective. However, that's probably many more decades away. I don't use them since we can see everything they have to show naturally and without any help.

Please post some more experiences as we all love to read them. Thank you and keep exploring.

I'm also in my mid 20s. How old did you think I was? lol. I started having experiences when I was a kid though. Too bad I didn't know what it was then. Why don't they teach this stuff in school?

OOBE are associated with too many belief systems probably. There's that and the fact that mainstream thinks were all nuts for thinking anything more than just a dream is happening. From my experience, that's usually a good indicator.

You just look up from your central line of vision. I suppose with your eyes in a normal open relaxed position... hold your palm a 2 feet in front of your face with your eyes lined with the centre of your palm shift your gaze to your finger tips.

Saying that... it's not important this eye thing.. but it's very useful and part of many TM methods.

I agree but It's one more thing to overcome and get out of the way.

Wait... are you both rolling your eyes into the top of your head or something?  

I'm pretty sure I am but not drastically. What am I doing wrong here? But I pretty much get a headache from everything.

I need to give Amorda some credit because I never once considered relaxing my eyes while they were open. I don't think I would have ever thought to that.

The biggest difference is that there is nothing to learn objectively from a lucid dream as everything you encounter is entirely from you. The same applies during an OOBE but there are certain things you can't change other than your perception of it. In other words, you changed and nothing else.

I would rather have a "regular dream" or an OOBE. Lucid dreams are fun and everything you learn to manipulate also helps you during an OOBE but other than that, there's not much that I have learned while LDing.

Get some more experiences under your belt and you'll quickly be able to argue your position successfully. But the thing is, you won't care to.

I would take into account too that sometimes in order to get someone to do something, you tell them not too.

I'm sure Beedeekin will also keep in mind that people interested in this "secret" will try to coerce the holder into divulging the info by pretending to remain neutral when it they are anything but. 

I have never been able to project or meditate sitting down either. If I sit too long in one position, my legs start to go numb and then burn. This is from a high fall that required some months in rehab and gave me some permanent nerve damage. I was eight when that happened and I have completely healed except for back pain and that.

Another way to make the eyes want to relax is to look up at a 45 degree angle. This is why hypnotists ask to focus on something above the centre of the eye-line and why many transcendental meditation methods do the same.

Like Amorda, this strains my eyes and gives me a headache. If my eyes won't relax after a minute or so, I give up and wait to project from a dream. It's a problem about a third of the time and nothing so far helps everytime.

Also how would you answer this:

If Data is Consciousness, then what analyses that data?

There seems to be an obvious answer but I think it's misleading. We as individual consciousness's analyze each other personally everyday. In fact, I think that's all we ever do. To do this, we have to separate ourselves from each other and take on personal identities. But I think this is only an illusion that benefits the purpose of a physical and non physical existence. Which appears to be a paradox because we can't imagine another possible form to exist in and maybe there isn't. But if the "astral" didn't come first, that implies that a physical existence did.

I think it's more appropriate to say that the "parts of the astral" we access did not come first though I'm not aware of the data that you say suggest otherwise. But that's not a fruitful debate IMO as I don't think it matters to our identity. At least not as I view it.

The easy answer is that consciousness analyzes everything. We as humans analyze other humans so why wouldn't this be true for consciousness as well? It's misleading though because we are not aware of all aspects of consciousness, as you say and I agree with.

It wasn't until I pestered an old man with too many questions, that he pointed my guide out. He did say that it was following me though. I don't take this to mean that literally but I think a consciousness that evolved can easily handle multiple situations at once with clarity. That is to say that they can "track" us and be aware of us bot not stalking us.

Thank you very much for your encouragement.

I think I understood Roman67. I have not dreamed, I knew I was lying on my bed but I was also aware that in the physical life.

This may be the difference between a lucid dream and obe.

It's hard not to get caught up in what people say are the differences between the two but wait until you have some more experiences before you decide for yourself. Skeptics say that all or our experiences are just regular dreams. There's no such thing IMO.

We all have to decide what makes sense to us personally but I would lean to calling what you just described an OOBE.

The difference for me was when you were aware that you were dreaming and made an active attempt to change your surroundings and it worked! Your dream became lucid while you were driving the truck and then it became an OOBE when you shifted back to your room. This is how I apply my personal standard but you may choose to do so differently. It really makes no difference.

Studies have been done and indicate that our heart is not beating near as fast as we think it is. But the more we dwell on it, the harder it will beat. It has even been documented in some people that their heart rats is actually lower than normal even though they perceive it to be pounding out of control.

But it does begin to race when we start to panic in fear of the unknown.