Is AP only real to you?

[daytona955]

Hi,

I've been on this site for a while now, I don't comment much, but I do like to read the discussions of others. I haven't had any experiences for quite some time now, but I have got to thinking -

How do you really know that you are projecting yourself beyond our physical existence, and not merely experiencing a vivid LD?

I am not attempting to disprove anything here, I would just like to know about other peoples experiences, and more to the point, what it was exactly that convinced them (or rather proved to themselves), that this experience was in fact a manifestation of your consciousness operating independently from your body.

I have had OBE's myself, and they were very interesting experiences. But I cannot say for sure that it was not just a very vivid, and very lucid dream. 

[Stookie_]

The main experience for me that made all the difference was seeing everything physical from a complete outside perspective. Not just actual physical things, but our lives and relationships and experiences as well... it's all just consciousness. It changed my being and perception permanently. I don't care if anyone believes it or not, I could talk about it all day and it doesn't matter. You have to see it for yourself. Even if for some reason it wasn't "real", the change it made in me is no hallucination.

[Volgerle]

How do you really know that you are projecting yourself beyond our physical existence, and not merely experiencing a vivid LD?

You imply here that it 'was not real'. We had these discussions here a lot (difference between LD and OBE and so on). Many users here (like me) also hold the opinion (or even conviction) that there is no real difference. A dream is also a projection - independent of the body. I have received more insights from my higher self from dreams than from AP/OBE-like experiences. Often AP/OBEs change to LDs change to dream-states to and fro. It's a continuum for me. I had validations like many here too of some or other kind. But that's not even the point. ANYthing is a real experience. There is no unreal experience.

Regarding 'proof' in terms of getting validations I recommend the link in my signature below.

[todd421757]

Based upon my experiences, I have discovered some facts.

1) The energy body does exist and can travel at least a short distance away from the body.

2) The energy body can contain "awareness" which also can travel at least a short distance away from the body. I have not yet determined if "consciousness" can or cannot travel away from the body.

3) Any changes to the energy body may directly affect the physical body as a result.

4) Any changes to the energetic plane may directly affect the physical plane as a result.

[kailaurius]

How do you really know that you are projecting yourself beyond our physical existence, and not merely experiencing a vivid LD?

Is there a difference?

Also, there is no separating from the physical body or traveling through anything.  There is no space or time.  Once again, these are concepts formed from from a reality that is extremely dense where energy forms and reforms at an extremely slow rate, giving us the illusion of distance and time.  It is your belief that you are traveling or separating from your physical body, and we most often incorporate these beliefs into our projection experiences.

If you are asking yourself if your projection experiences are real, well...

What is Real?

[daytona955]

Even if for some reason it wasn't "real", the change it made in me is no hallucination.

Thanks Stookie, beautifully put. It has also changed my outlook on things.

Is there a difference?

Kailaurius - I also agree with this concept. I read up on Franks posts, and I must say that I found them very intriguing. I hope someday to have experiences to the sorts of levels that others have had on this site. Cool link by the way, I love the Matrix, thanks.

ANYthing is a real experience. There is no unreal experience.

Regarding 'proof' in terms of getting validations I recommend the link in my signature below.

Volgerle, I understand what you say, and I do take some good from all of my experiences. Thanks for the link, although I couldn't get it to work, sorry.

Based upon my experiences, I have discovered some facts.

3) Any changes to the energy body may directly affect the physical body as a result.

4) Any changes to the energetic plane may directly affect the physical plane as a result.

todd421757 - Very interesting, thanks. Could you expand on the points above please? I would love to know what specific changes you experienced.


I suppose my interest really lies here - I am afraid of dying some day. Like a lot of others, I am seeking some sort of faith or belief that my soul/conciseness will continue to exist beyond death. Hence my interest in validations.

Thanks for your comments.

[todd421757]

todd421757 - Very interesting, thanks. Could you expand on the points above please? I would love to know what specific changes you experienced.

I suppose my interest really lies here - I am afraid of dying some day. Like a lot of others, I am seeking some sort of faith or belief that my soul/conciseness will continue to exist beyond death. Hence my interest in validations.

Hi Daytona955,
These links contain posts by me that expand on the points I made above.

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_out_of_body_experiences/my_girlfriend_saw_me_out_of_body-t36588.0.html

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_metaphysics/physical_reality_quotnonexistentquot_lt_verifications_please-t37748.0.html;msg309527#msg309527

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_out_of_body_experiences/is_obe_been_proved_scientifically-t37667.0.html;msg308883#msg308883

[Volgerle]

Volgerle, I understand what you say, and I do take some good from all of my experiences. Thanks for the link, although I couldn't get it to work, sorry.

hm, that's strange, well, sometimes the site (provider problems) can be down, it's a provider that offers for free and anonymous (and without ads),

normally the link works:

http://reconnection.lima-city.de/OBE-Verification/index.html

you might try again or bookmark it and try later, for me the above link works in several browsers, I cannot imagine that there's any accessibilty issue from different countries? please report if it does not work again/still

[NoY]

it works for me 


:NoY:

[Lucids]

Even if for some reason it wasn't "real", the change it made in me is no hallucination.

I think you hit the nail on the head here +1.