Are We Living Within A Virtual Reality?

[Wi11iam]

Hi

Wondering about life the universe and everything, I wrote this.  Your thoughtful comments are most welcome.

Are We Living Within A Virtual Reality?

Real Universe?


If we think about the TRON movie - when inside the computer the consciousness is the thing doing the experiencing and might think of where it came from as 'the real universe'.


Yet in the Matrix movie, the 'real universe' is not where Neo came from, but where he woke up in - plugged into the machine.


Which universe is 'real'? - How would consciousness know except to say that wherever it finds itself occupied and experiencing, THAT is the real universe, because the only real thing is Consciousness.


Lets say that this universe we are occupied within now - the physical one - life on Earth is a simulation.


Lets say that there are two main teams of entities.  They are playing a game.
These entities are us, playing a game.


But not 'us' as we think of ourselves in this universe.


The object of the game is to outwit the opposition in order to win the  game - one team is trying to get its humans to build a paradise for themselves on the planet - (which is the game field) the other team is trying to get the humans to build a prison for themselves on the same 'battle' field. (Earth)


In 'the real world' of the game players neither team are actually enemies.  They are simply playing a game.


The rules of the game say that the team which is trying to get the 'humans' to create a prison for themselves are allowed to lie, cheat, disrupt, infiltrate...you name it...in order to achieve the goal.


The goal is not only to get the prison built, but to secure it completely so that the other team has no moves left and End Game.


The other thing about the game is that the teams playing are doing so from two perspectives - a part of their consciousness is actually being within the game played.  Within the life forms - specifically the human life forms (the played).


The greater part of the players consciousness is in their real world.


Another aspect of the game is that the played - the humans - also have a say in what happens in the game being played.
In order for this to happen, the humans have to connect with the player - think of a SIM - you observe the SIM going about his/her normal business within the game completely unaware they are even in a game.


Then your SIM starts to piece together clues which lead it to behavior which allows for the possibility of connection and communication with you - the player.


The process of connection - SIM to Game-Player is rare and can aid the player toward another goal.


Players have to align their game play depending on what their humans choose.


This means that should a players human choose to work for building paradise on the game field and the player was on the build a prison team - then the player aligns its game play support to the 'build a paradise' team and vice versa.


Earth is not even the only level of the Game - the human eventually dies and goes to the next level, which is even more complex - so there are a number of goals the players are trying to achieve with their human SIMS - remembering that each human is an aspect of the player - literally part of the players consciousness.


To add to the complexity - the consciousness of the player within the game-piece of the human is normally like a silent observer - experiencing the human's life but not being that human.  Sometime a player (regardless of what team it is on) will subtly manipulate the human piece in certain directions if the human is 'sensitive' to that process.


The player – in placing an aspect of its consciousness into the human piece to 'power it up' causes something to be created which is called "Ego" which is used by the human to make sense of his existence and the ego exists precisely because the player remains largely a silent observer - the human does not know that he/she is  actually a player with an entirely different existence - the human is born and other egos which were formed before it was born explain to it what it is and why it exists and thus the ego is shaped or reproduced by those egos already existing.


If the individual ego follows a path which has it questioning its existence, the things it has been taught by other egos etc...that ego has a better chance of connecting with that silent observer - the game player - and if that occurs then the game changes - not the whole game, but that egos part in the game.


As mentioned, upon death of the human form, depending on its level of understanding and belief systems and other factors, that conscious ego continues in the new game level.


The next level (after death) is a continuation from the first level.  It is still part of the simulation but the game field has changed.


The extended object of this whole game is to get all the players on the same team.



This means that in order to do so, the human ego has to understand fully what it is and where it originates - that it is not just the product of the egos which came before it and educated it but it is way more than this...when this is fully achieved, the human 'wakes up' as the player.  But not just as the player...but as a player who has gone through the process of being within the game and from within the game came to the realization that it is not just the ego but is the player...like the two merge and are one - so the player has - by playing the game - become something else through that process.


So if we (humans/egos) assume that we live in a simulated universe could relativity be false in the real universe?


The 'real universe' from the player's perspective is outside the game being played.  It is the highest level achievable within the game context because when the object is achieved, that player has won the game and can leave the game.


As to the possibility that once the player leaves the game, is that players reality part of another game being played, the answer is likely 'yes' and the player needed to go through the 'Earth/Astral' game and win it in order to then play the next game.


So individual players can win the game by no longer being part of it due to their bringing the ego human into full consciousness and literally bringing that out of the Earth/Astral game field and into the players own reality.


The other players, who are still working their humans or simply going along with the ride, are still in the game.


If the real win of the game is to bring a human ego out of that game and into full consciousness as to what it is and where it derived then why are the players working to use the humans to either build a paradise or a prison on the game-board? (Earth)



*The answer has to do with a game that is being played at yet another level using the players as pieces by yet another level of game players who created the game players universe (game-board) which those game-players (the ones which created the Earth game and use human game pieces) are unaware of...they too did not realize that they were pieces in another game and thus come to that awareness in much the same way as the human ego comes to that awareness.


The game (paradise or prison) had an unexpected twist...an unlikely possibility.
A possibility which the 'prison' team are allowed to undermine using whatever tricks they are able to come up with.
The prison team whose humans try and connect with them will create the necessary illusions in order that those humans work for the process of prison building.  If those humans see through the illusion and change their alliance then the player shifts its support to the paradise team The human pieces can individually connect with their game players through the common thread of consciousness and in doing so allow the player to realize that there was more to the game than simply trying to get humans to build a paradise or a prison...and through this realization another level opens up to their awareness...*

[Taz]

The game (paradise or prison) had an unexpected twist...an unlikely possibility.
A possibility which the 'prison' team are allowed to undermine using whatever tricks they are able to come up with.
The prison team whose humans try and connect with them will create the necessary illusions in order that those humans work for the process of prison building.  If those humans see through the illusion and change their alliance then the player shifts its support to the paradise team The human pieces can individually connect with their game players through the common thread of consciousness and in doing so allow the player to realize that there was more to the game than simply trying to get humans to build a paradise or a prison...and through this realization another level opens up to their awareness...*
[/i]

WoW - wish we had a 'clap' smilie, wi11iam - brilliantly thought-out! love your 'wonderings' - very similar to what i've been pondering regarding this 'game' experience. thanks for sharing your thoughts!

[Wi11iam]

WoW - wish we had a 'clap' smilie, wi11iam - brilliantly thought-out! love your 'wonderings' - very similar to what i've been pondering regarding this 'game' experience. thanks for sharing your thoughts!

No Probs Taz - spread the word...! 

We are indeed 'the imaginations of our selves'

[Pauli2]

To some part that is what T Campbell is stating. I think the computer game description
is in Volume II of his book (which sadly enough is the most boring part, in my opinion).

What bothers me is that Campbell doesn't provide anything to support his idea, so if
you go OBE or otherwise, please look for any experiences which could prove one
theory or another. Then come back and tell us.

[Stookie_]

Well written Wi11iam

[Szaxx]

Hi,
Looking at the basics of the physical existance. We are in a time flow situation. We hqve only 3 dimensions of space omnipresent. A few anomalities exist and these spell out a fingerprint of being part of a larger system.
There's at present conciousness branded as subjective. If everyone within our 3d space was a shaman then subjectivity would be re-assessed.
Looking at these anomalities will show the bigger picture only if the proposed wider reality is correctly worked out. Its the same if we drop a dimension to 2d which humans can understand. Cast a shadow from a 3d shape, can you guess what it is? Answer most probably.
Back to 3d these anomolies are the shadow of the wider reality so can you now work it out? Answer not a chance. Why? We are in a 3d limited universe and have no conception of more than we can see.
Theres too many points to make for q thread, it would require a book of mwny pages and still not have an accurate answer. One day someone will prove to all the wider reality exists. Lets hope it one of those important scientists. At we may have a voice.

[Wi11iam]

To some part that is what T Campbell is stating. I think the computer game description
is in Volume II of his book (which sadly enough is the most boring part, in my opinion).

What bothers me is that Campbell doesn't provide anything to support his idea, so if
you go OBE or otherwise, please look for any experiences which could prove one
theory or another. Then come back and tell us.

I think Puali2 that this type request is most often expressed by skeptics.  Even if anyone were to go and then return and give report of their experience does not constitute evidence which will prove one theory or another.

The thing about the OP is that is embraces all.  It is a parable but its actual focus is upon the individual - the personality experiencing their subjective reality within the framework of the objective or shared reality, which is most often seen as the Physical Universe.
The focus of the OP is also on the Human Potential to create a Paradise rather than a Prison, here on the Earth.
So in that, it is also about understanding the deeper relationship the individual has with their 'other-worldly' experiences and how these experiences relate to and can assist THIS reality for the better.

The subjective experiences which are part of this objective shared reality - these are like maps and when they are shared, they can be placed together much as peers in the science community share their own findings... 

It is not possible to bring evidence of other dimensions/universes back into this one as hard physical evidence which can be measured and understood scientifically.

To the skeptic who say 'prove it' I say 'you will have to do the work yourself, and find the evidence.'

Much as Frank Kepple did in relation to his own skepticism.

[Wi11iam]

Hi,
Looking at the basics of the physical existance. We are in a time flow situation. We hqve only 3 dimensions of space omnipresent. A few anomalities exist and these spell out a fingerprint of being part of a larger system.
There's at present conciousness branded as subjective. If everyone within our 3d space was a shaman then subjectivity would be re-assessed.
Looking at these anomalities will show the bigger picture only if the proposed wider reality is correctly worked out. Its the same if we drop a dimension to 2d which humans can understand. Cast a shadow from a 3d shape, can you guess what it is? Answer most probably.
Back to 3d these anomolies are the shadow of the wider reality so can you now work it out? Answer not a chance. Why? We are in a 3d limited universe and have no conception of more than we can see.
Theres too many points to make for q thread, it would require a book of mwny pages and still not have an accurate answer. One day someone will prove to all the wider reality exists. Lets hope it one of those important scientists. At we may have a voice.

Hi Szaxx

A shadow moves with the shadow caster.  In one sense the shadow is us and the shadow casters are the Players...yet there is that element of individual power which is something which makes the game interesting for all involved.

What is it that makes the shadow possible? - This is the element of the Players Players.  That is what we each can connect with, which allows for the Player to see beyond the focus of the Game it is playing - to outside the game being played.

We can - as pieces, share our maps and together see the picture which is emerging.  While we are here sharing this dominant reality together, there is no reason why we cannot bring our focus on personally aligning with the prospect of creating paradise on this Planet.

We - as a specie are going nowhere else for the time being.  We are obviously most attracted to this experience as we each wake up from sleep/OOBE/lucid dreams/astral etc...but we are yet to connect these together and not simply wake - but awaken and not simple awaken but RISE and SHINE.

[Lionheart]

 After watching Through the Wormhole and some other Science Channel programs I believe we are living in a virtual classroom. It seems that Science today in general is finding all different ways to manipulate the "human" experience. Actually it seems like they are trying to find ways to turn us into Sims that can be controlled. They have been doing research on life longevity, controlling your thoughts, your body, and pretty soon your soul. I used to wish they would do research on Lucid Dreams/Astral Travel. But now I am glad they are not, they would just learn to manipulate this as well.   
 

[NoY]

Mi5 already has very skilled projectors working for them, i have met them


:NoY:

[Szaxx]

Hi,
Try R.R. or Bush. You'll be intercepted. Talk their language and you're in.
Anyone?

[Pauli2]

I think Puali2 that this type request is most often expressed by skeptics.

Not at all.

At one time when Moen asked Monroe about one of the lesser known Focus Levels
(I think it was the Flying Fuzzy Zone), Monroe responded that he didn't know what
it was, then Monroe directed himself to Moen and Monroe said:

"Go find out, then come back and tell me, and we will both know."

Even if anyone were to go and then return and give report of their experience
does not constitute evidence which will prove one theory or another.

I never requested proofs or evidence, I only asked about the experience you got,
which backed up your theory.

[Wi11iam]

Not at all.

At one time when Moen asked Monroe about one of the lesser known Focus Levels
(I think it was the Flying Fuzzy Zone), Monroe responded that he didn't know what
it was, then Monroe directed himself to Moen and Monroe said:

"Go find out, then come back and tell me, and we will both know."


I never requested proofs or evidence, I only asked about the experience you got,
which backed up your theory.

What experience do you think would qualify as backing up a theory?  It is a parable.  What do you find false or unfitting about it from your own experience and theories formed Pauli2?

[Pauli2]

What experience do you think would qualify as backing up a theory?
It is a parable.  What do you find false or unfitting about it from
your own experience and theories formed Pauli2?

I thought that was obvious, but if you really don't understand it, let me explain.

What qualifies as backing up a theory?

Answer: Observation.
---


Let me take a well known example. The original question is, when someone goes OBE, is that
all happening in her/his mind only, being a mere illusion or is the OBE really happening,
meaning that the person goes OBE _somewhere_ in the physical world?

Observation.

Before OBE, the person places a playing card without seeing its value, faced up on a high shelf.

Once the person is OBE she/he takes a look at the playing card an memorizes the card's value,
say Queen of Hearts.

Once back in the physical that person picks the card from the high shelf and looks at its value.
If she/he does that on several occasions she/he eventually may come to some kind of conclusion
whether what she/he observes while OBE is similar to the real physical world.

That's not any proof at all, doesn't qualify as evidence, and probably is hard to repeat scientifically,
but it's an experience which may back up any theory. Also, the observation doesn't need to be visual.

[Wi11iam]

The content of the OP - what have you to add to the discussion in regard to that Pauli2?

[Wi11iam]

After watching Through the Wormhole and some other Science Channel programs I believe we are living in a virtual classroom. It seems that Science today in general is finding all different ways to manipulate the "human" experience. Actually it seems like they are trying to find ways to turn us into Sims that can be controlled. They have been doing research on life longevity, controlling your thoughts, your body, and pretty soon your soul. I used to wish they would do research on Lucid Dreams/Astral Travel. But now I am glad they are not, they would just learn to manipulate this as well.   
 

Well Lionheart I have been watching the series you mentioned – in the order they appear here:
http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/through-the-wormhole/

So far my impressions are 'wow!  People actually get paid and recognised and occasionally honored for this kind of stuff!
We are in a kind of classroom for sure but in line with the OP what we are being taught is keeping us within the parameters of prison mentality...although I am seriously beginning to rethink this and the re-evaluation would be 'we are in an insane asylum' but either or, prison it certainly is.


Also in line with the OP we each have the aspect of personal choice, even in choosing what to believe, but I think your comments regarding science are not new – the reigns of educational power have simply shifted from the old way of adoring the priesthood shaman guru monk types and these are now manifest in our scientists.  They are the new directors of human consciousness.

Eventually it may work out that Scientists will pay more attention to research of Astral etc...so-called 'paranormal' but the focus is upon escape and rocket propulsion is the first step.  Science will not be looking into 'paranormal' any time soon – at least not secular Science.

The world is getting smaller and the problems are getting larger and escaping this prison island of a planet is one priority, and something that has been invested into the imaginations of the populace since the earliest days of print and the evolution of mass media technological advancement.

It is a pipe dream.

The human body simply isn't designed for prolonged space travel.

That is something which deserves a whole topic to itself.

As far as being 'turned into sims that can be controlled' this is something science will no doubt be looking into as a possible answer to some of the world most pressing problems.
In general human beings are easily led through mob mentality.  The aspect of self control is something which is evidently not overly thought through by the individual to any point where a sense of personal responsibility and an understanding of being part of something which is bigger than one's own self and that self's projected lifestyle requirements.

Such attitude is necessary for the commercial part of this prison system to control those type individuals toward debt and ownership.

The 'have nots' are a serious problem for those who administer the prison systems because these make up the bulk of the population and are dangerous for their known ability to riot.

[Xanth]

Let me ask you this...

If the answer was a definite "YES", that we are living in a virtual reality, would that change how you live?
If the answer was a definite "NO", that we are NOT living in a virtual reality, would that change how you live?

[Lionheart]

 That was an excellent post Wi11iam. My problem with this is the rich will get richer and the poor poorer. They talk on that show quite a bit about using Genes altering to create the perfect human. They aren't going to use the Genes of someone from the hood, they are going to use the Genes of a scholar from Harvard and where will it be used first, of course creating the new super soldiers. They will help us live longer, but then what about overpopulation? They will have the technology to alter your thoughts as well, so if they don't like what you are saying or doing, they can change it. That severely destroys the human experience. Sooner or later they will have weeded out all the meek. The new director's of Human Consciousness will have total control. There is a lot of positives to be found in their research as well, but remember, every yin has a yang!

[Wi11iam]

Let me ask you this...

If the answer was a definite "YES", that we are living in a virtual reality, would that change how you live?
If the answer was a definite "NO", that we are NOT living in a virtual reality, would that change how you live?

I will assume Xanth that you are referring to the OP in relation to the Virtual Reality.

On a personal level it helps me to identify and clarify my place in the scheme of things.
The change has to do with realisation and realignment and the parable points to the fact that we are living in a prison which we are helping to build.
We may not think so – indeed our education is designed to have us think we are 'free' and it is mind rape – and those minds are barely children when the process begins.

So seeing the Human Potential to be able to build a paradise is a step in the better direction.
From recognising the potential we can work on a hypothetical plan which can be shown in principle to be realistic and able to be employed with minimum fuss or disruption.

At the very least such a plan needs to be activated by all the so-called free world as a first primary step.

You could argue – and others have – that instead of my sitting on my arse complaining about the direction science is taking the Human Race, and using a machine developed by science to do so, that I could be working to alleviate say the hungry nations and poor people.

My response is that we are all in this together and that it is going to take ALL of us to change the present course we are on.

If those who understand the human potential were to unplug and pack there bags and head for the poor regions, we are not going to achieve much at all because the poison will continue pouring forth from the rich nations through their education processes and their need to conquer and control.

We have a small window of opportunity and the internet could be used to spread the word – to gather minds willing to invest time and critical thinking into creating a workable plan and once achieved, this can be broadcast and could conceivably gain momentum and popularity which leadership could not ignore.

That is what I say to those who ask me to shut the hey up.  If they have that attitude and work to keep such a thing silent, they are likely administrators of the present system enjoying their particular lifestyles or they are so disgusted with humanity that they only wish the worst and either gave up caring or never got to that point in the first place.

So either way Xanth, the answer to your questions are that step one is to learn to care and see the human potential – the reality is that we each have the choice...and that weather we are in a virtual reality or not really doesn't take that away from us.

The parable is that we don't know – but if it helps the individual to help the whole, then it can't hurt.

Let me ask you this.  If you had a choice here to help build a prison or a paradise, which would you choose?

[Xanth]

Let me ask you this.  If you had a choice here to help build a prison or a paradise, which would you choose?

The obvious answer is obvious.  Paradise.

You already help build one or the other with how you view yourself.

However, prison or paradise... you only help to build your own prison or your own paradise.  Nobody elses. 

[Lionheart]

 This seems fitting to add to the conversation here. http://news.discovery.com/tech/human-immortality-2045-120727.html

[Xanth]

This seems fitting to add to the conversation here. http://news.discovery.com/tech/human-immortality-2045-120727.html

Now *THAT* scares me more than anything else.

I don't want to be here forever.  THAT would be pure and absolute torture.

[Wi11iam]

That was an excellent post Wi11iam. My problem with this is the rich will get richer and the poor poorer. They talk on that show quite a bit about using Genes altering to create the perfect human. They aren't going to use the Genes of someone from the hood, they are going to use the Genes of a scholar from Harvard and where will it be used first, of course creating the new super soldiers. They will help us live longer, but then what about overpopulation? They will have the technology to alter your thoughts as well, so if they don't like what you are saying or doing, they can change it. That severely destroys the human experience. Sooner or later they will have weeded out all the meek. The new director's of Human Consciousness will have total control. There is a lot of positives to be found in their research as well, but remember, every yin has a yang!

Thank you for your reply Lionheart

It is my understanding that very few people are aware of the entire picture.
There is no doubt whatsoever that through the ages and back into the ancient days of tribal lifestyles up to present day that it is the intelligent people who have led the less intelligent to the point we are now at and the problems we are now facing as a species.

This is natural as the intelligent find it easy to manipulate the imaginations of the easily susceptible – whether through fear of god and gods, the promise of reward, the hope of better days to come etc...

Even when led by brute force – by brutal leadership, the intelligent are directors of how that is best accomplished and are relied upon by the leadership.

Then we entered a new era which has brought with it some semblance of civilisation and care – concern – kindness.  It is undeniable that this aspect came through religion – or rather through culture which birthed individuals who found a voice and a following enough to speak of the kinder side of human nature and the need to share together and use intelligence wisely.

Religion is how the intellectuals infiltrated something that disturbed their own agenda and could be shown as a possible threat to 'the order of things'.

Be that as it may, I understand that most human beings are simply interested in living in peace and are contributing to something which has been promising them this thing and rewarding their work with comfortable lifestyles...still at a price of course.

Science is being used by scientists and those investing in that service to find some way of dealing with 'the problems' without losing their stations in life – their right to rule and to own countries.  Sounds like 'conspiracy' but one only has to ask how come powerful countries are in debt and to what are they in debt to?  Certainly not other great countries...then perhaps to corporations and individuals?  It is all a great lie and the trail of destruction can be seen as the path from where this lie travelled – exploration has always been underlined by the agenda of exploitation.

'Discovering' countries which were already peopled – we know the history – even the tampered version of history cannot conceal the poison of the prison makers agenda.

However, we are reaching a critical point for our species.  We have discovered the universe is a vast inhospitable unreachable reality and our small pale blue dot of a dust speck is our prison, all inclusive of those that own it and run it.

The Jetson's universe didn't arrive, nor will it, for reality is a harsh thing unless we can find that way in which to work with it.

I think you will find that the things you say 'they' can do, are most likely rumours rather than realities.  But rumours do have there uses.

At present 'they' are about to attempt to land a robot on Mars.  Why?  For exploration?  Mapping out a possible escape route for the chosen few?

Space is not the final frontier.  It is the un breach able prison wall.  The vainglorious weakness and human folly and its path of destruction and usury – that past is never far from this present.

The intellectual know the predictability of the mob mentality and are well enough prepared to deal with it when it surfaces and as democracy has proven, there is a way to tame it without having to give up ownership and control of it but only as long as it is fed and housed and educated, and for the privilege the democratic will pay whatever is asked as long as they can loan $ to pay for it.

I think scientists could easily create a plan on how to build paradise which could be shown as workable, but they have their heads in the stars or in the dirt sifting bones or wherever else the money is and are not required to do anything else.

But as I say – we have this window of opportunity – perhaps it is up to 'the mob mentality' to get their heads together – to realise that trusting in their leaders is a provable fallacy and come to the realisation that it is actually us who always do the hard labour – the dirty work – it is us who build the infrastructures – we could just as easily be building a paradise for ourselves as we are – in the present – building a prison.

[Wi11iam]

The obvious answer is obvious.  Paradise.

You already help build one or the other with how you view yourself.

However, prison or paradise... you only help to build your own prison or your own paradise.  Nobody elses. 

In relation to the Planet and your place on it - it is prison.  You may have a little piece of paradise where you reside - but the planet it is situated on - your paradise relies upon that planets well being. 
The main problem with your philosophy is in thinking that everyone has the choice to be in prison or paradise and it is through their choices that they have one or the other.

In terms of those who have and those who do not have, those who have, do so because of those who have not.  It is thus a flase paradise.



(Your philosophy would be correct if you were actually an island of your own and that no one and no thing could threaten that sovereignty.)

In terms of sharing this world - this reality - you are not in that situation.
We are all in this together. 

[Xanth]

Your interpretation can't see beyond the ego.   You can't see beyond the "haves"  and the "have nots".

Living isn't about government... It not about wealth or money... Ironically,  it's not about anything physical on this planet.

Living is about consciousness, and treating all with Love.

I speak of spiritual growth.  It's beyond every concept you have posted about.

The only prison is the one you've created for yourself.  It's unfortunate too,  because I can sit here and tell people this time and time again,  however it's not until they realize this on their own that it'll actually sink in.

I know this because I used to be one of those people.