Can anyone explain reincarnation?

[T.L.]

"What we are talking about has no facts. There is no evidence and no proof of anything. The only thing that we can do is experience for ourselves and try to learn from others experiences."

Yes I know which is why I was wondering why you said this: "We also have to remember that when we astral project all memories are downloaded into our brains immediately upon the return of our consciousness."

  The facts that are available to me [and for that matter to anyone else] on this subject is through their own experience. That being said I will explain my experience on this subject about memories from obe's. I don't know if you have ever noticed [if you are an active projector] that dream memories seem entirely different than obe memories. When you look back on dream [regular not lucid] memories it seems like a past event in which you remember yet it seems out of reach, like you were not really there. Sort of like an experience related to you by another. In an obe you remember being there in real time, a real observer while it was taking place. What I explained above is just to point to the differences in the memories of dreams and obe's. Anyway I have noticed a very peculiar thing in my obe's which tells me that the brain [at least mine] is pulling this information in while I am experiencing it, and somehow the brain is even used to decipher things and even sent back to the non-physical self... all in real time. What lead me to this idea was while out and reading an envelope my wife set down on the counter. I just read the envelope then looked down next to it, then all of a sudden parts of the image pixelated. Like blocks of the image went out of place then back real fast.

   The image was solid still, and the content of the visuals didn't change. It was exactly like watching satellite television while it is raining, the content stays the same but the image becomes disorganized at different times. It seems almost like while separated parts of our minds still remain dependent on our physical brains for interpretation or arrangement of some visuals. Whatever the case it showed me that there is an active signal being sent to and from our brains while out of the body. This doesn't necessarily mean anything regarding the reality of the experience, but shows us that while we are alive physically we need our brain to send messages to and from our non-physical minds, even while out of the body.

[kurtykurt42]

For those of you who don't want to read all of these long posts, the bottom line is:

reincarnation will remain unexplained until you die.

[zareste]

I'm mostly with T.L. on the physics of it.
If I might play Captain Obvious for a moment: A person's beliefs govern what qualifies as 'proof' to them. So when you say 'there is no proof', it's a delusional way of saying 'that conflicts with my beliefs'. Similarly, when you say 'it's unexplained', it's just a delusional 'I don't know'. This is ridiculous. Nobody likes to be wrong or uncertain, but just say 'I don't know' when you don't know.

Anyway I've been studying reincarnation patterns. I'm no expert, but I'm starting to think astrology plays into it. The rotating fields of the Earth and Sun govern bio-rhythms of the body, and most likely impact the way it thinks. So if a soul were introduced to this body, perhaps certain souls are only compatible with bodies born at a certain time of the year.

Odd side-note: Indians say the soul enters a fetus during the third month of pregnancy. Perhaps a person's astrological sign should be established on that month, and not when they're born?

[kurtykurt42]

I'm mostly with T.L. on the physics of it.
If I might play Captain Obvious for a moment: A person's beliefs govern what qualifies as 'proof' to them. So when you say 'there is no proof', it's a delusional way of saying 'that conflicts with my beliefs'. Similarly, when you say 'it's unexplained', it's just a delusional 'I don't know'. This is ridiculous. Nobody likes to be wrong or uncertain, but just say 'I don't know' when you don't know.

I try not to have any beliefs, i am only interested in the truth. To me it doesn't matter if we reincarnate parts or energy, our entire energy or something else. I try to compile as much information as i can about a subject before giving an answer. I then review all of the information and make a logical conclusion using the facts provided.

[zareste]

That's a good way to do it, but all I see is you giving the delusional version of 'I don't know'

[T.L.]

Here's the way I look at reincarnation. From what I can tell it's a necessity, whether an energetic/mental necessity or whatever. Here in the physical it's a necessity that we spend a good portion of our time here in the non-physical (sleep). When we are in the non-physical it becomes a necessity to go back and spend time in the physical. It almost seems like it will be an infinite cycle for most of us. I am sure there are exceptions to the rule, but it sure seems that way. So no matter which state we may be in we have to spend time in the other state for however long. It seems that whatever state you are in the other becomes like a temporary state you need to be in to rest. It's a very odd notion, but it just seems that way from my perspective.

[Panthau]

ok but why (if we are more then we think we are) do we forget
everything on our next reincarnation and begin from scratch?

[T.L.]

"ok but why (if we are more then we think we are) do we forget
everything on our next reincarnation and begin from scratch?"

  I'll explain it from my point of view, just keep an open mind. Memories/thoughts..etc are non-physical things. Most people think that somehow memories are stored physically in the brain, but as non-physical things that is not how it works. Our brains somehow mark reference points to memories and through these connections draws the memories from the non-physical somehow. I would not begin to pretend to know how our brains as physical objects could access non-physical things like memories, or how our mind/soul or whatever you would want to call it interacts/connects to the brain. Although I do believe electricity probably has a lot to do with it. Anyway in this way our brains could be compared to a hard drive.

   A hard drive stores reference points to files. When you are looking at an icon that you use for whatever program, you are not really looking at the file itself but the reference point. So when you delete a file you are not really deleting the file itself but the reference point it has saved to the file located elsewhere on the disk. The difference being is the file itself is actually there on the hard drive but never the less, the comparison is the best I can make. So our brains mark reference points to these non-physical memories and our minds work in conjunction with the brain in using these to access the actual memories. I believe one day science will catch onto this. Anyway the reason why we can not remember past lives or "start from scratch" is our brains can only access memories that have it's corresponding reference points. So the events for those memories would have to have been experienced by us/our brains to have those reference points to those memories.  Obviously each time we are born we start with a new brain, a clean slate there are no reference points to past memories so it becomes impossible to access those memories from the physical brain. However there is a way around this, and that is to retrieve those memories while in an altered state in which you are in the non-physical, you can examine a memory for an event that took place in a past life while your awareness is centered in the non-physical.

   Then cement the memory into place upon bringing back your awareness to the physical, and your brain will create a reference point for that memory for recall later. This is exactly the reason why obe memories are so fleeting and it takes a person to reexamine their experience and writing it down so the brain will make a reference point for it. Otherwise the memories are completely discarded as in no reference point is created for it, so your brain will not be able to recall it later.  Well hopefully I explained it well enough and didn't make it sound like a really convoluted notion.

[zareste]

I think past lives are hard to access because they exist on a different 'thought stream'. It's something I learned from telepathy. When I go into a trance, I become unaware of my waking self and waking memories because I've dropped out of my waking thought stream. From there, I can attach to new thought streams - for example I can view someone's memories from a thousand years ago as though they're my own memories. I see what they saw and I understand what they understood, because the stream becomes an extension of my own mind.

You do the same when you fall asleep. In your dreams, you understand what's going on as though you've always lived in that dream, but you can't seem to recall being awake. Different streams

That's how past lives become hidden, I figure. When you're caught in your waking thought stream, you can't change streams (unless you're really skilled), so you have to be asleep or in a trance to recall past lives

It's a bit like TL said, except your old lives are kept on old hard drives

[T.L.]

"You do the same when you fall asleep. In your dreams, you understand what's going on as though you've always lived in that dream, but you can't seem to recall being awake. Different streams"

There are some commonalities when it comes to how dreams work, and some aspects of experiences between dreamers. But for the most part people's experiences varies greatly. For instance in a lucid dream, and in OBE's I have recall of my physical life. I even compare things I'm experiencing to previous ideas or notions I came up with while in the physical. It just takes practice to bring through your entire waking self into the experience.

  Once you do it a few times it just becomes as common as the experience itself. There are also exercises you can do while out or in a lucid dream. For instance one thing that a lot of people are missing when they go out of body, or into a lucid dream state is their logical/analytical part of the self. So one thing to do to be absolutely sure you are 'all there' is to solve math problems. It sounds easy right? Give it a try. You want to start out with something simple then expand then you'll notice a difference once you do it.

"It's a bit like TL said, except your old lives are kept on old hard drives"

I'm not sure you got what I was trying to say. In no way do I mean that those past life memories are gone or don't exist. They do in the non-physical part of yourself [mind]. However your brain [physical brain] would have had to been along for the ride to create a reference point for that memory. However since it is a memory from the past life, it does not have a reference point for that memory. Each time/life we start with a new brain, no reference points, blank slate. However your mind, the non physical self has all those past memories. You just have to work backwards to get at them, your awareness has to be centered in the non-physical. Once it is then you have to have some direction as to which life (as most of us most likely has had many)... so for instance tell yourself you want to experience the end of the most current previous life... something along those lines. Being centered in the non-physical allows your mind to experience that memory while it's not centered on the physical. Then it's just a matter of bringing your awareness back to the physical and replay that memory in your mind, go over it and write it down.

  The brain will then create a reference point for it. So in no way are past life memories gone, they are just not accessible through your physical brain directly. Even this compares well to the hard drive. For instance if you have a 'file' that you delete the icon for on your pc. Then you realize it's irreplaceable and must get it back, what do you do? You have a file on your disk drive, yet no reference point for it anymore. It's still there just inaccessible to you without a reference point. A long time ago when there were not any programs to do it automagically for you, you would have to work backwards through the bits and rebuild file manually, which was entirely possible. Anyway I hope this may help some people gain some sort of understanding about it. It's an interesting subject to explore and think about.

[zareste]

right, some people have lucid dreams - a little skill allows you to make streams interact.

[T.L.]

"right, some people have lucid dreams - a little skill allows you to make streams interact."

well even in my dreams where I'm not lucid I still compare things, remember things in my physical life and somehow relate that to the dream. For instance a dream where I found myself driving my car in my hometown. I happened upon a friend from my past. We decided to walk so I parked my car. Out of no where he gets jumped by two people. I remember how this happened when we were 15 and what I did when it happened. It's never like two separate lives [at least for me] like you suggest when it comes to unconscious dreams and physical life. I'm sure it can seem that way to some though, as experiences can vary greatly.

[zareste]

I notice how lost memories sometimes fork off into their own personalities, and even develop on their own without your waking self knowing about them. They really do take on a life of their own sometimes.

I was kinda beating around the bush when I was talking about the mind earlier. I, personally, think the brain has no significant sentience at all. When your spirit leaves your body, your brain remains intact, yet it cannot do any thinking beyond handling bodily functions and conveying messages to the spirit. It's only there for coordination and idle processes. Meanwhile your spirit retains every memory and thinks independently.

Then there's the biological evidence. People have lost half their brain but didn't lose any memories. An ant with a brain 1/1000 the size of a human's can contemplate a situation about as well as any of us. I think it's just a myth that the brain does any cognitive thinking.

When people first discovered the brain, they merely assumed it's the center of intelligence because it's a clearly visible organ that reacts to thoughts, but that was a long time ago. The actual mind - from what I've gathered - is a system of harmonic data and not a collection of cells. Not an organ you can visibly see.

Of course, you might be right about the brain indexing memories. My understanding is that your entire sentience takes place in organized data fields, to which you can attach new data streams and sometimes lose them.

[T.L.]

"Of course, you might be right about the brain indexing memories."

   Well when I came up with the model of how the brain interacts with memories..etc I was also taking into account of what we see with alzheimers as well. When certain functionalities of the brain are temporarily or even permanently blocked what ever reference points that the brain would not have access too those memories are temporarily lost, not to the non-physical mind but to the physical brain so the person would temporarily lose those memories.

   Of course I'm not saying that we think because of our brains, that is just certainly not true. The brain is just the way we as non-physical beings interact and manipulate with the physical environment. It would be no more than just a middleman between our non-physical selves and the physical world. You are right though about some people losing portions of their brains yet retaining almost all their memories.

   My wife's sister has a father that was involved in a car accident. He wrecked into a tree and either part of a branch or something else went through his windshield and into his head. He was missing almost 1/3rd of his brain from what I am told about it. He is still alive and has almost all his memories, I believe some blanks from what I was told had to be filled in for him. My idea about the brain wouldn't necessarily mean that these memory reference points would take a large area.

    The way I look at it is that they could take up such a small part of the brain it would seem insignificant in the amount of space it would use. Because no real heavy data would be on the brain physically just a marker for memories no matter how huge they are, the part of the brain with the references would and could all still be the same size. Looking at it this way just shows that you could lose a good chunk of the brain just depending on which chunk and where I suppose. No matter which way you look at it, it's a really interesting topic to ponder on.

[zareste]

oho, I like the way you think.