How can you prove that OBE isn't just some kind of dream?

[Lost soul]

Hi guys
i am a prison who's very interested in OBE and i am stell a very beginner in this kind of arts and still didn't make any kind of progress

But i have few questions that need to be answerd about OBE just to be Certain

first i was just wondering if anyone one can prove that OBE isn't just some kind of lucid dreaming

for example did some people could have find out about his future and helped him to change something bad could happen to him?
our prevent someone dear to him from dying in the future?

our even spy on top secrets of his country?

who do these country's needs a real spy's Risking there lives instead of using somebody who can go through OBE to spy on them?

also another question if I got throe OBE dose that means i can know whats there in the after life?
our can I even talk to god?

I really hope that i get answers for these questions and I would really appreciate that

[Lost soul]

Also i have another Question in behalf of a friend of mine who asked this:

"Hello, i come from Germany, and please apologys my bad Englisch.

I have a really Bad disease, schizophrenia.

I read very much about OBEs, Time Travels, and Body Switch.

I want go during a OBE back to my old Body, before i sicken, and want go in this old Body, anywhere know what i mean ?

I know its a difficult, but i read some People can Switch the Body, or go to the past time.

Anywhere think its Possible ?"

[Xanth]

First, tell me what a dream is.

[Lost soul]

As far as I know the dreams are nothing but Imagination during sleeping
But the OBE is exploring something real that we can't see it by our physical eyes
am I correct?

[desert-rat]

There is a story of a British M.P. that was sick in bed , but apeared in his astral body to cast his vote in house of commons ( late 1800, or early 1900 some where ) I have yet to have a conscious o.b.e. but I did will my self to give my phone # to any one  that I met while out of body during sleep , I did get some out of state phone calls where no one spoke .  If some one had told me that they got my number from what they thought was a ghost , that would offer a great deal of proof . 

[Xanth]

As far as I know the dreams are nothing but Imagination during sleeping
But the OBE is exploring something real that we can't see it by our physical eyes
am I correct?

Well, you're neither right nor wrong.

See, when you begin to research "dreams", you quickly run into the wall that humans actually have absolutely NO IDEA what a dream is or why we have them.  They have theories and ideas, but nobody REALLY KNOWS.  So as you can see, there is a problem when you use attempt to compare an experience to a "dream".  You're effectively comparing it to something with no fixed definition.

What if I told you that dreams are as "real" as any experience you can have in this physical reality while "awake"?

[Lost soul]

Thank you Desert - rat its an interesting story

As for what you said Xanth
I do believe that dreams only some times has meanings and some people call lucid dreams are low level OF OBE

I had a dream once of one of my brothers calling me in my cell phone
then suddenly my phone in the real world ranged and it woke me up and when i looked at the phone i saw the same brother was calling me in the real world and I had no idea that was going to happen

I just hoped that experts would also tell me more intrusting stores about information they get from the astral world that helped them dealing with there physical life problems

imagine someone is jerk and stubborn who doesn't believe in the existence of the souls and ask for a prove that OBE is not just some kind of hallucination and Imagination - what would you tell him??     

[Volgerle]

imagine someone is jerk and stubborn who doesn't believe in the existence of the souls and ask for a prove that OBE is not just some kind of hallucination and Imagination - what would you tell him?? 

I'd show him this website:

http://da-lai.lima-city.de/OBE/index.html

[Lost soul]

I'd show him this website:

http://da-lai.lima-city.de/OBE/index.html

WOW now that's interesting
now i feel satisfied

anyway i am working very hard these days on getting WILD lucid dreams
if I succeed i well start working on astral projecting

wish me lack everyone

And i really appreciate if anybody would also answer my friend's question
i also have a similar question

i had a beautiful childhood days , so well i be able to live throw these days again if I astral project?

[Szaxx]

Some of the experiences will be so good you'll not want to leave.
Nothing physical comes close to the feel of it.

[LightBeam]

i had a beautiful childhood days , so well i be able to live throw these days again if I astral project?

You most definitely will. I feel the same way about my childhood. I often say that if I can get stuck somehow in my childhood years, I will be very happy. And this was one of my first goals when I succeeded in AP. Since then, I have all kinds of great memories revisited and I am telling you these experiences are so much more enhanced and euphoric, because you are reliving them with the knowledge and appreciation you have now. And confirming that past events are not gone forever, as many people think and grieve over, it gives you great comfort.

[Lost soul]

You most definitely will. I feel the same way about my childhood. I often say that if I can get stuck somehow in my childhood years, I will be very happy. And this was one of my first goals when I succeeded in AP. Since then, I have all kinds of great memories revisited and I am telling you these experiences are so much more enhanced and euphoric, because you are reliving them with the knowledge and appreciation you have now. And confirming that past events are not gone forever, as many people think and grieve over, it gives you great comfort.

I do believe that you can create you're own reality throw living the past days again and change what you need of the past of my reality without being able to effect what happened in the real time line
I hope am correct in this
did you got my point?

[Lost soul]

Some of the experiences will be so good you'll not want to leave.
Nothing physical comes close to the feel of it.

I am really excited to astral project and the first step to this is to succeed getting WILD lucid dreams

[LightBeam]

I do believe that you can create you're own reality throw living the past days again and change what you need of the past of my reality without being able to effect what happened in the real time line
I hope am correct in this
did you got my point?

We don't know if events can or can not  be changed in any given probable physical timeline reality. We can only speculate. But through AP you can experience past physical events in the duplicate "next door" frequency reality. The astral is thought responsive, yes, so you can alter the experiences. What I  experience in regards to going back to past events, is the environment, the familiar feelings, my friends and loved ones, certain adventures, etc. But these experiences are not exact replica of what actually happened in the physical. They are actually more enhanced and rich, with very powerful enjoinment at least for me just by knowing what is happening at that moment that I am in the astral realm and it feels even more real and current, never lost and I know that it will always be there.

[Xanth]

I do believe that dreams only some times has meanings and some people call lucid dreams are low level OF OBE

You kind of missed my point entirely... you're trying to use a concept ("dream"), which simply doesn't exist beyond what people "BELIEVE" it means.

When you re-call a Projection to someone and they come back and tell you "Well it was just a dream"... they're stating that they know, for a fact, what a dream is, just as you were doing in your initial post.  Hence, my original question... do you know what a dream is?

What I try to do is get people to begin to question "pseudo-knowledge".
Pseudo-knowledge is information which people try to pass off as fact, when in actuality, they don't know... and in this case it's pseudo-knowledge on a global scale.

Does that make any sense?

[Xanth]

WOW now that's interesting
now i feel satisfied

anyway i am working very hard these days on getting WILD lucid dreams
if I succeed i well start working on astral projecting

If you succeed in having your lucid dreams, then you'll also have succeeded in projecting.
You've got to remove yourself from that extremely narrowly defined box you've placed yourself into.

Continuing to try and do what you've already succeeded in doing is like trying to invent a circle after you've invented the wheel. 

This is the problem with so many new people... they already come fully loaded with information they've "learned" from many other places.
And they read that lucid dreams and astral projections are different things... there's the first big box you've put yourself into. 
Wouldn't it be better to remain open minded about such things until you've had many experiences and can analyze them personally?

[deepspace]

...they read that lucid dreams and astral projections are different things... there's the first big box you've put yourself into.  
Wouldn't it be better to remain open minded about such things until you've had many experiences and can analyze them personally?

There's the key: experience and analyse. When you are actually in that place, that real and separate world and you are aware that you are outside of your of physical-world body. You look around, you touch things, taste things, you decide and do whatever you need to do to be satisfied, evaluating the world you are in like an alien that just landed on another planet. That's when you can decide and you can decide while your there and then commit your experiences to memory.

Once you have what I call the "real deal" then those ideas about trying to prove what happened become irrelevant, not applicable. When you are there, the last thing on your mind is trying to prove you had the experience. You don't need to prove your waking-life experiences to anyone do you?

[Stillwater]

I think Xanth explained my perspective well here. I think they are dreams, but dreams are more significant in some ways than most credit them for. To me, a projection is a dream with high lucidity. Notice that is nearly identical with most people's definition of "Lucid Dream". Projections happen to be a sort of dream where we are primed to receive very special sorts of information in my view.

[Lost soul]

Ok so i got you're points now that lucid dreams are some kind of astral projection experience

[Lost soul]

my original question... do you know what a dream is?

ok i see dreams are something very complicated and mixed up between hallucination and a mind translation of what the human soul experience

[phaseshiftR1111]

I'm not the expert here, but it all boils down to awareness. I think a lot of "dreams" are just very extremely low recall of an astral projection. Some dreams! Maybe all I don't know... We are creators so we can imagine and create some wild stuff. This place is a dream too. That's the way I see it. It's "real" I hate that word... Because you're experiencing this reality system with full awareness. It's just as "real" over there. If not more touchy/feely. It's all just consciousness shifting. That's how I see it!  Not the freaking expert here but yeah!

[Xanth]

Ok so i got you're points now that lucid dreams are some kind of astral projection experience

Well, even that wasn't my point.  hehe

All I wanted you to do was, as you practice Projection (and other metaphysical activities) open your mind and leave your labels and boxes behind. 

[Xanth]

I'm not the expert here, but it all boils down to awareness. I think a lot of "dreams" are just very extremely low recall of an astral projection. Some dreams! Maybe all I don't know... We are creators so we can imagine and create some wild stuff. This place is a dream too. That's the way I see it. It's "real" I hate that word... Because you're experiencing this reality system with full awareness. It's just as "real" over there. If not more touchy/feely. It's all just consciousness shifting. That's how I see it!  Not the freaking expert here but yeah!

http://www.unlimitedboundaries.ca/2013/09/23/everything-is-consciousness-analyzing-lucid-dreaming-and-astral-projection-from-the-perspective-of-consciousness/

Once you REALLY understand that all of consciousness is ONE... and you slowly begin to apply that knowledge to everything you see and do, you'll quickly begin to figure out that there can be no separation in consciousness, with anything.

You're dreaming as much right now as you are at any point that you're physically asleep. 

[deepspace]

IMO, all of our life is projection, just changes dimensions.

[Lost soul]

well except that the Physics dimensions cannot be changed by just thinking it well change
un like the upper dimensions levels were the spirits are more capable of creating what it desire.