Trapped in my own visualizations?

[DASH Project]

I've been projecting on and off since 2006, but have never done it regularly enough to get super-good at it. When I do project, though, my body has to be "in the right space" to project, and it rarely is. But I have projected at least twelve times since I started, which isn't a lot but bear in mind I'm hella ADHD about sitting down and focusing, and it takes me everything to just lie down, relax and form my astral body.

However, I've came to the realization that maybe I'm not doing it right, and never have. All my times I've projected it's just felt like a very complex, very in-depth visualization all up in my head, more akin to some forms of meditation than an actual projection. But I could be mistaken. Basically I get these extremely hard-to-control images starting when I form my astral body, just a big whirl of imagery that may or may not be random, and that I can control some of it, but other parts I cannot control. My projections basically feel like I'm thinking everything up in my head, as opposed to actually heading out into the spirit world and going on adventures.

But I could be wrong, since at least some of what I see when I "project" appears to show up totally out of nowhere, like I haven't "planned" it at all, so I might be projecting with at least a bit of success. I remember a year or two ago when I projected and imagined myself visiting my friend's house (of course my mental image of what his house and street looked like probably looked nothing like how it really did,) and imagined myself looking in at him. My friend later told me he felt as if someone was watching over him, which made me feel extremely confident in my astral abilities. He did mention he felt it at a toally different time of day than when I projected, however, but it was close enough, and I'd imagine that in the astral, time of day means nothing, so he may very well have felt my presence watching over him!

What I'm trying to ask here is basically, I'm wondering if my so-called "projections" are just me going off on wild mental trips without any form of genuine astral travel whatsoever, because if that's the case then I'm worried everything I know about projection is wrong. I recall reading something in my astral projection book about how the first few times will feel imagined and fake, but don't let that get you down and keep trying. Maybe the reason why my projections persistently feel imagined is because I don't practice enough. What do you think?

[CFTraveler]

If you look at life a certain way, you will see that all of your existence is self created.  But the energy is there already.
But I'm digressing a bit.
Yes, it sounds like you are actually projecting.  If you are trying to visualize something specific and then you see it, it is your own construct.  But if you have random places/people/things come at you, then you are projecting.

[DASH Project]

If you look at life a certain way, you will see that all of your existence is self created.  But the energy is there already.
But I'm digressing a bit.

Whoa really? That's kind of a mind-screw, though I could definitely see it that way.

Yes, it sounds like you are actually projecting.  If you are trying to visualize something specific and then you see it, it is your own construct.  But if you have random places/people/things come at you, then you are projecting.

But it's a mix of the two, seamlessly fused together, and I'm really not sure how much of it is visualized and how much of it is projected. Like for instance I might visualize something, only to have it take many seemingly-random forms before I decide on one and modify that one.

Basically my process is something like this:

Request >> Random Forms >> Picking a Form >> Modifying that Form >> Final Construct

Anyways it feels like I am presented with a person/place/situation in the astral, seemingly at random or perhaps because I requested for something similar, which I will then tend to "go with" and modify until it's recognizable to me. Because if I don't modify/construct what I see, then it is all just completely random and indecipherable, and I don't know what to make of anything. I really hope I'm saying it right and capturing my process correctly, because the way my mind works in the astral is just so hard to describe!

[Astral316]

Do your projections feel like a virtual reality simulation or like you're watching a movie screen? If they don't, and your experiences are basically imagination driven scenarios conjured up behind the blackness of your eyelids then you're probably just daydreaming. Between having to question your projections and the way you describe them, this may be the case.

[DASH Project]

Do your projections feel like a virtual reality simulation or like you're watching a movie screen? If they don't, and your experiences are basically imagination driven scenarios conjured up behind the blackness of your eyelids then you're probably just daydreaming. Between having to question your projections and the way you describe them, this may be the case.

Yeah it's really discouraging, and I don't even know where to begin projecting "for real." I mean I've "projected" before and had it feeling at least somewhat real, or at least I want to think so, but I just need to face that I'm an astral n00b. I followed the instructions in my astral projection book as closely as I could, even back then, and all I get is this. I've heard fancy and complicated tricks described to me like "go to bed early, then wake up for ten minutes, then go back to bed and project, it's super easy lolololol" and so and so. I can get that it may be easy for some people, but I doubt I could pull off fancy tricks perfectly like that, especially when the result isn't even guaranteed.

Worst of all, my mind is constantly racing with thoughts, visions, sounds and voices and even sitting down to meditate or astral project is extremely difficult as I observe a bit of a "shell" of racing thoughts that I get caught up with on the surface, and that prevents me from getting deeper down to where I can actually focus on my visualizations, meditation, etc. So half the time I can't even quiet my mind to perform even the mental visualizations that this may be! I hate myself!

This is hitting me extremely hard, especially for someone who wants to see the afterlife before he actually dies!

[Astral316]

The "wake up early morning" technique isn't really tricky or complicated... the point is to attempt when your body is tired and your brain isn't active.

Of course, you need to overcome the racing thoughts to get good at meditation, since that is how you advance in this subject. Try just concentrating on your breathing and relax, meditation should be a pleasant experience even if you don't project during it.

If all else fails, pot seems to still my mind relatively easily. 

[DASH Project]

The "wake up early morning" technique isn't really tricky or complicated... the point is to attempt when your body is tired and your brain isn't active.

Of course, you need to overcome the racing thoughts to get good at meditation, since that is how you advance in this subject. Try just concentrating on your breathing and relax, meditation should be a pleasant experience even if you don't project during it.

If all else fails, pot seems to still my mind relatively easily. 

I could try to project early in the morning, but I'm afraid I'd just go right back to sleep and waste my own time! I unfortunately get extremely sluggish in the morning and find it hard to get up, though I have woken up quite early once in awhile, generally either if I have to or if I really desire it. Is it possible to project sitting up, like in a meditation posture? Because if I do it that way I might be able to circumvent my desire to go back to sleep.

I find that when I do overcome my racing thoughts, it's usually when I'm lying down on my back, and after focusing on each different part of my body and "willing" it to relax...it's a technique I learned from my astral projection book that I've had for years now. I rarely can do it, but when I can it feels great to be free of racing thoughts. Really all it takes is time, LOTS of time, and half the time I doubt my own abilities greatly due to past failures and giving into my racing thoughts. The trouble is my mind for some reason wants to think about worldly thoughts and stuff in my physical life, and often debates and problem-solves about worldly things when all I want to do is stop thinking and focus on the visualizations or whatnot!

Ah yes, good old entheogens. I'd smoked weed before but only for fun, I don't want to be dependent on drugs to be able to project successfully. But then again you were probably joking anyways

Bottom line is, I'm curious how to exit my body without overly visualizing it and (hopefully) without just falling back to sleep. I'm kind of desperate to see the afterlife because even though I'm not afraid of death, I am afraid of the big unknown after you die, and I want to get much better at projecting in order to see the place I will go when it's time for me to leave this earth. I'm mostly afraid I'll either go to hell for not following a certain religion or conforming to someone else's moral code, or I'll just disappear forever when I die like how the atheists believe. More so, what if I could somehow feel the fact that I've ceased to exist, imprisoned and derived of all my senses in a nonexistent void forever, which would be just as bad as Hell!

Can you see why I'd want to scout out the afterlife before I die? I know I'm still very young and for the most part wouldn't have to worry constantly about dying, but ever since that earthquake hit Japan I've been thinking a lot about the end of the world, and what if it really does end in 2012? This is definitely not the place to discuss eschatology, and talking about it would probably make me feel even worse, but I just wanted to say that because just in case the world does end, I want to be ready for it by knowing where I'll go when I die, so I don't need to be afraid anymore

[NickisDank]

How long do you find yourself laying there trying to project? Because if it's less than an hour I doubt anything can happen unless your already experienced. I have the same problem with trying to relax as you do. Anytime I try and medidate I conicince myself out of it after just 30-40 minutes, thinking I've been laying for hours.


Takes a lot of mind-taming

[Astral316]

Is it possible to project sitting up, like in a meditation posture? Because if I do it that way I might be able to circumvent my desire to go back to sleep.

Of course.. it's the lotus position. The Buddha became enlightened with it!

Ah yes, good old entheogens. I'd smoked weed before but only for fun, I don't want to be dependent on drugs to be able to project successfully. But then again you were probably joking anyways

Uhh, sure we can say that.  

Regarding all that other stuff, you worry too much... with all this fear it's no wonder you can't relax. Work on letting go of it... what ever happens in the future, it is what it is.

[DASH Project]

How long do you find yourself laying there trying to project? Because if it's less than an hour I doubt anything can happen unless your already experienced. I have the same problem with trying to relax as you do. Anytime I try and medidate I conicince myself out of it after just 30-40 minutes, thinking I've been laying for hours.


Takes a lot of mind-taming

To be honest, not that long. Maybe an hour at the most, with about 15-20 minutes spent trying to relax myself and my body, and another 10-15 minutes for attempting to form my astral body. Should I be spending longer on it?

[NickisDank]

To be honest, not that long. Maybe an hour at the most, with about 15-20 minutes spent trying to relax myself and my body, and another 10-15 minutes for attempting to form my astral body. Should I be spending longer on it?

Time yourself next time, remember the time you lay down and do your best to stay down till something happens or you feel your wasting your time. But if your laying there for at least an hour, your body should be somewhat asleep and could be experiencing some closed eye visuals, vibrations, etc. Im going to try to project tomorrow once i wake up, im going to at least lay there for an hour and 30 minutes to see if i can actually get a conscious projection for once

Like i said theres experienced people on this forums that can probably project in about 30 minutes, but thats because experience

[DASH Project]

Time yourself next time, remember the time you lay down and do your best to stay down till something happens or you feel your wasting your time. But if your laying there for at least an hour, your body should be somewhat asleep and could be experiencing some closed eye visuals, vibrations, etc. Im going to try to project tomorrow once i wake up, im going to at least lay there for an hour and 30 minutes to see if i can actually get a conscious projection for once

Like i said theres experienced people on this forums that can probably project in about 30 minutes, but thats because experience

I will definitely give that a try, timing myself.

Also, my friend told me that he's been having some luck projecting using a technique similar to what I've heard SummerLander tell me a month or so ago. What he does is he wakes up in the morning, but doesn't open his eyes or move his body...that way the body is somehow still asleep but the mind is awake and alert, or something like that. He says he's been able to partially lift out at least, as he says he's been able to wiggle his nonphysical arm without moving his actual arm at all, and believes that it's only a matter of time before he can fully OoB properly.

I meant to try his technique this morning, but I found myself waking up and opening my eyes and moving my body normally...FFFFUUUU-

Ah well, he says it takes definite practice to master. I just hope I'm not going to get all ticked at myself for not being able to master it quickly and just give up. That would not be good. Until I DO master it, I suppose I could always continue trying the method I've always tried, but by lying down much longer for at least an hour like you said.