Time.. a perception?

[SirMike]

Now, it has gone to my attention that some people think that time is a perception
I am not against anyone that thinks that, but the reason I disagree with this theory is because

If time is a perception in our heads, that means length has to be a perception also but that cannot be possible,
because if it were possible than we could travel great distances with just one footstep!

Also, time and length are technically artificial, in a way.. because we "made" time and we "made" length, now; some people
confuse are time (like 12:37 PM) with REAL TIME (live things occurring all at once, love, hatred, and so on.)
So that being said, that means that most things would have to be a perception, for instance: math

A universal language that anyone can/should understand; one pencil is still ONE pencil in other languages, it wont be 324 pencils, it would still be 1 pencil.

So we cannot say that is a perception either, because its not something in your head, a pencil is right in front of you and its still ONE pencil.

Length: we measure it in ft, cm , mm, m and many different sort of categories for length, if things are a perception in our head than explain to me why is it that when I take one step forward, I don't travel across the ocean and only travel IN FRONT of where I was originally stationed.

Everyone can believe what they want  but if time can be a perception in our head.. well than we "control" physics.. which we are not even capable of doing.. (yet  )

Again, as I mentioned before, I am not against anyone who believes  that time is a perception, I am just explain my theory on why I think it is not.

Have a good day! 

[NoY]

when your in shock like in an accident it all goes in slow motion it doesn't change the amount of time it takes for the earth to go around the sun but it is perception.


:NoY:

[Xanth]

LoL

Dude...
You're going all over the place. 

The best "description" of what time is that I've heard comes from Tom Campbell.
Time is a property of this reality frame.  It's required for "things" (actions) to occur in sequence.  You can't have a sequence without time.
Time is measured in delta-T's... the smallest delta-T within this reality frame being equal to one unit of time.  Each reality frame has it's own unique delta-T.

The way humans "measure" time is a creation/invention... hours, minutes, second, etc...
Time itself is a property of our reality frame and has to exist, as I mentioned above, for a sequence of events to occur.
Time is only a "perception in your head (or consciousness?)" in as much as our consciousness is interpreting what it's experiencing through the sequence of events occurring due to each tick of that delta-T.

Now, onto your next thought... about perception.
You're talking mostly in semantics and definitions.

As for your connection of Perception to Length...
Our "one step" is only equal to "one length of a step we can take" because of the rules governing this physical reality.  Rules state that if we want to from "here" to "there" we need to move our physical bodies accordingly.
In some reality frames, this isn't the case... and movement is as simple as a thought... and at the speed of a thought.  UNLESS you've imposed the belief that to get from A to B you have to "move your body there somehow".

I wonder if any of that made any sense.  ROFL

[Orion-]

Time is a complicated thing. Our concept of time is based around the earth rotating around the sun, and other natural cycles. What time really is is the change or movement of matter. The essential part is, how, if you look at the concept in a purely physical way, you can't reverse it. Time can't go backwards.

In the astral, "time travel" exists. Because you can choose in what "time" you are, there really is no time. Only duration, and duration is purely perception.

The only reason we think time exists is because in this physical, time doesn't usually go back, and you don't usually physically go back in time.

That's my idea about it anyway

[SirMike]

LoL

Dude...
You're going all over the place. 

The best "description" of what time is that I've heard comes from Tom Campbell.
Time is a property of this reality frame.  It's required for "things" (actions) to occur in sequence.  You can't have a sequence without time.
Time is measured in delta-T's... the smallest delta-T within this reality frame being equal to one unit of time.  Each reality frame has it's own unique delta-T.

The way humans "measure" time is a creation/invention... hours, minutes, second, etc...
Time itself is a property of our reality frame and has to exist, as I mentioned above, for a sequence of events to occur.
Time is only a "perception in your head (or consciousness?)" in as much as our consciousness is interpreting what it's experiencing through the sequence of events occurring due to each tick of that delta-T.

Now, onto your next thought... about perception.
You're talking mostly in semantics and definitions.

As for your connection of Perception to Length...
Our "one step" is only equal to "one length of a step we can take" because of the rules governing this physical reality.  Rules state that if we want to from "here" to "there" we need to move our physical bodies accordingly.
In some reality frames, this isn't the case... and movement is as simple as a thought... and at the speed of a thought.  UNLESS you've imposed the belief that to get from A to B you have to "move your body there somehow".

I wonder if any of that made any sense.  ROFL

I understand the part about the length, you lost me after delta-T lol

[SirMike]

Time is a complicated thing. Our concept of time is based around the earth rotating around the sun, and other natural cycles. What time really is is the change or movement of matter. The essential part is, how, if you look at the concept in a purely physical way, you can't reverse it. Time can't go backwards.

In the astral, "time travel" exists. Because you can choose in what "time" you are, there really is no time. Only duration, and duration is purely perception.

The only reason we think time exists is because in this physical, time doesn't usually go back, and you don't usually physically go back in time.

That's my idea about it anyway

Well "time travel" isn't necessarily time travel without going to the past.. which isn't possible..  in a way, by that I mean that you can go back in time/relive a memory but you can't change anything in it.. I think (its anyone's guess) I have posted this before:

If you got a C on a test but wanted a A+
but you didn't want to wait for the next test, and you go back in time to fix that C,
you tell yourself the answers to the test and then you go back to the future..

Everything mentioned in bold cannot be possible, even for the astral realm, why? because if you went back in time to fix something
then that means that in the future there was nothing to fix!
So you went back in time for nothing!

If you don't understand.. tell me I will make a more simple story 

Well it might be possible.. if you have a car that runs on plutonium and your friends with a crazy scientist

(back to the future anyone ?)

[Orion-]

T is a physical unit of time.

Delta is usually used for change. So for example delta T would be T end - T begin. See it like a timeframe, a period of time.

[Orion-]

Well "time travel" isn't necessarily time travel without going to the past.. which isn't possible..  in a way, by that I mean that you can go back in time/relive a memory but you can't change anything in it.. I think (its anyone's guess) I have posted this before:

If you got a C on a test but wanted a A+
but you didn't want to wait for the next test, and you go back in time to fix that C,
you tell yourself the answers to the test and then you go back to the future..

Everything mentioned in bold cannot be possible, even for the astral realm, why? because if you went back in time to fix something
then that means that in the future there was nothing to fix!
So you went back in time for nothing!

If you don't understand.. tell me I will make a more simple story 

Well, see it like this. If I go back in time to tell myself something, did I change time? Or was what I did always meant to happen?

And I do believe "time travel" is possible in the astral, because like I said, there's not really time. Only duration.

[SirMike]

A period of time?

A duration in time?

You said duration is purely a perception in our head, that being said - how can a period in time be real because if a duration in time supposedly isn't real.. lol I see a paradox forming o_O

It would seem as if you contradicted yourself there, buddy..   

Any minute now a black hole will suck earth into it because we made a paradox RUN!!

T is a physical unit of time.

Delta is usually used for change. So for example delta T would be T end - T begin. See it like a timeframe, a period of time.

[SirMike]

Well, see it like this. If I go back in time to tell myself something, did I change time? Or was what I did always meant to happen?

And I do believe "time travel" is possible in the astral, because like I said, there's not really time. Only duration.

Well it all depends on what you told yourself, if you tell yourself how he will die, and your warning him.. well than that's a WHOLE different story o.O

[NoY]

a man loads a gun, and then goes back in time and shoots himself before he loads the gun

so the question is how did he shoot himself with an unloaded gun,
the only answer is parallel universes

:NoY:

[Orion-]

A period of time?

A duration in time?

You said duration is purely a perception in our head, that being said - how can a period in time be real because if a duration in time supposedly isn't real.. lol I see a paradox forming o_O

It would seem as if you contradicted yourself there, buddy..   

Any minute now a black hole will suck earth into it because we made a paradox RUN!!

We can measure duration with computers, or by looking at the sun, moon, etc. This is done by measuring a change of the position of matter. If we use a stopwatch to measure the 100m athletics competition, then it will give the same time as a different stopwatch. However, the duration of time is a perception. The devices will give the same measurements, but for us it isn't the same. Imagine something boring, like waiting for the bus. It takes 15 minutes, but feels like a lot more. Or imagine kissing the one you love for the first time, it will feel like time stopped. Or imagine playing a computer game for those 15 minutes, instead of waiting on the bus. It will be over in no time.

Well it all depends on what you told yourself, if you tell yourself how he will die, and your warning him.. well than that's a WHOLE different story o.O

But if I tell myself how I will die, then I will avoid it and I won't die. This means that I was supposed to prevent my death, which would mean that I didn't die.

[Orion-]

a man loads a gun, and then goes back in time and shoots himself before he loads the gun

so the question is how did he shoot himself with an unloaded gun,
the only answer is parallel universes

:NoY:

I don't really believe in parallel universes, but I guess we can't know. If there are none, then doing this will not be possible. It wouldn't happen.

[CFTraveler]

I don't know if anything can go back in time at the macro level (I think y'all have described the Fermi paradox and the Grandfather paradox, so I'll skip over it) but my understanding is that Quantum Entanglement can be explained by retrocausality, possibly showing that at the quantum scale, particles do go back in time.  Or something like that.

[Summerlander]

What if time really is just perception?  For example, two days ago I entered the phase and thought I was there for longer than what I had actually been.  When I returned to wakefulness I looked at the clock and relived the entire experience.  I posted my results on OBE4u counting exits and re-entries.  I had been in the phase just under a minute.  Perception of time there is different it seems.  The phase reality seems to be more congruent with "quantum logic" than human logic and physical laws anyway...

[HiRes]

Time is a perception.. Technically, anyone with enough practice, could use their Merkaba to teleport anywhere in the universe instantly..

[Xanth]

Time is a perception.. Technically, anyone with enough practice, could use their Merkaba to teleport anywhere in the universe instantly..

If that was supported by our ruleset, which it doesn't look to be. 

[SirMike]

We can measure duration with computers, or by looking at the sun, moon, etc. This is done by measuring a change of the position of matter. If we use a stopwatch to measure the 100m athletics competition, then it will give the same time as a different stopwatch. However, the duration of time is a perception. The devices will give the same measurements, but for us it isn't the same. Imagine something boring, like waiting for the bus. It takes 15 minutes, but feels like a lot more. Or imagine kissing the one you love for the first time, it will feel like time stopped. Or imagine playing a computer game for those 15 minutes, instead of waiting on the bus. It will be over in no time.

But if I tell myself how I will die, then I will avoid it and I won't die. This means that I was supposed to prevent my death, which would mean that I didn't die.

But if you didn't die explain to me why would you go back to the past and tell yourself you will die ? Because if you tell yourself how you are going to die you will avoid death so then why go back to the past and change it if it never happend.. see what I did there 

[light487]

Hrmm.. if there was no perception of any events happening in ANY order (backward, forwads, sideways.. whatever) then there would be no need to know what "time" is..  "Time" is a label for a phenomenon that allows us to perceive events. It is not dictated by perception but without perception there isn't any need to "label" it so it ceases to exist as far as we are concerned. Time only exists when we perceive it and ceases to exist when we don't. It's not a tangible thing. The clock that ticks the seconds, minutes and hours (perceivable events) is tangible yes.. but even though we can perceive the events of the clock, we can still not perceive time itself.

Time is an attribute of causality but is not causality itself.

[SirMike]

Hrmm.. if there was no perception of any events happening in ANY order (backward, forwads, sideways.. whatever) then there would be no need to know what "time" is..  "Time" is a label for a phenomenon that allows us to perceive events. It is not dictated by perception but without perception there isn't any need to "label" it so it ceases to exist as far as we are concerned. Time only exists when we perceive it and ceases to exist when we don't. It's not a tangible thing. The clock that ticks the seconds, minutes and hours (perceivable events) is tangible yes.. but even though we can perceive the events of the clock, we can still not perceive time itself.

Time is an attribute of causality but is not causality itself.

Are you saying that time does not exist at all?
Because if that being said, segments would be happening simultaneously (like someone dieing even though they are alive, someone inventing the light bulb even though its invented, and so on)

You did mention this in your post, so I'm just trying to understand it.. time is one complex mofo 

[Athymari]

I beleive our own personal time is perception.

Though on a wider basis I beleve it would be stationery/frozen.

Look around you.. nothing is moving its all lumps of immovable matter in various shapes and sizes that can be knocked around. Though 'it' doesnt move.

[Stookie_]

There is more than one way of perceiving things. At one level, time is definite and measurable. At another level, it may not exist at all. Both can be right.

On a fictional level, I like how in the Dark Tower series time speeds up and slows down as the world slowly falls apart.

[CFTraveler]

Well, Einstein proved er, demonstrated that time slows down and speeds up depending on how fast you're going (and later on experiments backed him up on it)- the experiment of the airplane going at different altitudes and the experiment of the cosmic particles hitting the surface of the earth come to mind- so I wouldn't say it's a matter of perception, unless you consider matter to be also perception.  I would say that time is a property of matter/energy, and a measurement of such.  I don't know that means it's something, but if it can be bent...

[HiRes]

If that was supported by our ruleset, which it doesn't look to be. 

our own rule set? o.o; whats that mean..


ADHD people are faster in their thoughts, so technically time is slowed down to them.. but it seems like they are sped up to us
That could be an example of perception

[Summerlander]

ADHD people are faster in their thoughts, so technically time is slowed down to them.. but it seems like they are sped up to us
That could be an example of perception

There appears to be a reason for this too as I have pointed out previously in the lottery thread:

"Here is some curious conclusions that professors at Harvard and Boston universities recently arrived at:

When humans started to move out of Africa to explore the rest of the world, evolution mutated and held on to a gene associated with risk-taking and the will to be adventurous - the DRD4 gene. Evidence shows that the distribution of the two main alleles (versions) of the gene and the ancient migration patterns appear to be congruent. The mutations that followed do not seem random at all and seem to have purpose...

Each allele appear to mark specific personality traits in people. While a 4R allele is linked to prudent individuals, the 7R and 2R ones seem to indicate more impulsive behaviour in others. It is believed that individuals that possess the latter versions coped with dangerous situations a lot better and were more capable of surviving and reproducing under more challenging conditions.

Thus it was concluded that mass migration can influence our genetic make-up and specifically modify it in the evolutionary scale. Apparently, the 7R allele arose as a rare mutation 50,000 years ago after we left our home continent and spread throughout the world. Later, the 2R modified version emerged in Asia.

More interestingly, those that have been diagnosed with ADHD are twice as likely to have the 7R allele. Perhaps some of the symptoms that we think indicate a "disorder" - such as quick movements and rapid shifts in focus - are actually survival traits from natural selection."