Absolute truth!!!

[WalkerInTheWoods]

I think that there is an absolute truth, but I do not know what it is. If we all follow the same path, then we will all find the same truth. But how do we know that it is the absolute truth for one path leads to one destination. If we all follow different paths and everyone finds the same truth, then it is much more likely that it is a solid and absolute truth since it was tested by many different means, ideas, and people. So we each need to follow our own path to do our own tests to do our own part in seeing what is the absolute truth.

[beavis]

Mustardseed "Absolute truth. It seems to me that there has to be such a thing. If not there would be Chaos, and there ins no chaos in the physical or the spiritual."

I dont think absolute truth exists. There is lots of chaos. A star has some order because it is made of atoms, but their movement and nuclear destruction and creation is chaotic. Flip a coin. You will get chaotic results in small sets of flips. There is some order because they average to 50%, but you said there is NO chaos and there is SOME chaos.

There can be ALMOST absolute truth and some chaos. Everybody will see the same thing slightly different, even if they use the same measuring tool and it (theoretically) had infinite accuracy.


"There is a tendancy in the forum and among people in new age circles in general, to think that the physical world and the spiritual/astral plane is ONLY a product of your own beliefs. According to this school of thought varying spiritual entities you might meet are a product of your own belief in them, or the sum of your fears, soo...if you choose to disbelieve they should then disappear!!"

The one that appeared most real and gave me real pain: I stopped resisting his pain and chose to not believe he existed. That made him disappear.

"This is a big mistake, as there are Demons there are Angels and there is a God and there is a Devil. Certain truths are absolute......think about that."

That isnt an absolute truth. Its dogma... unless... Tell me what god and satan looked like when you saw them.

"Some even take that to the physical plane and say there is no such thing as sickness its all in your mind. This also happens in Christian circles where people claim to be healed when they are not."

Sickness does exist. Healing also exists. I've done it a small amount to myself.

"Many are suffering spiritual battles in the astral because they have gotten involved with spiritual entities they thought they could handle, thinking them to be only a fiction of their imagination only to find they were in way over their head."

What makes you say they are in over their heads? They're still here to tell you about it.

"The "biggie" and the most important thing we should all learn or that would be a very useful thing, is to learn to differentiate between the real and the imagined."

I differentiated that completely until last year, but then I learned that "real" is a SUBSET of imagined. If enough entities imagine the same thing, it becomes real.

"people in this forum become so ...openminded that they choose to believe things that are entirely wrong, listening to voices that decieve and following paths that lead only to pain and suffering, and not the bliss full astral worlds they had hoped for."

There is nothing wrong with being openminded by thinking what you hear MIGHT be true. Blind faith (which the church loves) you accuse us of is stupid. I dont do it.

[goingslow]

I cant think of any truth that I can point to that is absolute.. the reason being it is always conceivable someplace else it isnt truth.  Maybe the only absolute truth has to do with the universe.. something like that.  this bothers people who want something to show them the truth.. ie the bible.  But unfortunately as you really think about this stuff and throw out dogma and religious beliefs and actually expand your perspective most see this.

And it has nothing to do with age.

[Soulfire]

I believe there is an absolute "truth", but that none of us is able to perceive it accurately unless we are in complete CONSCIOUS alignment with all-that-is.  

Consider the possibility that there are an infinite number of dimensions, or at least more dimensions than any other being besides one in conscious alignment with all-that-is is capable of perceiving clearly.  If you cannot accurately perceive the "totality" of something from every possible "angle", your perception or understanding of its nature is flawed and incomplete.  For example a pyramid will look exactly like a triangle from a certain point of view.  You can even argue that it IS a triangle, the person seeing it as a triangle could mathmatically PROVE it is a triangle, but is that ALL it is?

It is equally important to understand that life experience is subjective and what that means in the grand scheme of things:  It means the "absolute truth" of the man standing and looking at the pyramid but seeing only a triangle includes not only the "truth" about the nature of the pyramid, but also the truth about the nature of the man observing it.  All of that...everything...is also absolutely "true".

I believe the closest we can get to perceiving absolute truth is to recognice that "now I am here perceiving a limited aspect of the totality of what it truly IS...".  It is human nature to label and categorize and judge, but to the extent that you believe any of those things, or fail to take into account how your presence affects the totality of "absolute truth", you also fail to perceive the "absolute truth"...

--Soulfire

[James S]

IMO there is no absolute truth. Truth is subjective, and is all a matter of perspective.

Even something as fundamental as the laws of gravity and the speed of light cannot always be considered absolute.

James.

[WalkerInTheWoods]

quote:Originally posted by James S

IMO there is no absolute truth. Truth is subjective, and is all a matter of perspective.

Even something as fundamental as the laws of gravity and the speed of light cannot always be considered absolute.

James.

I do not think that humans can know the abosolute truth because we are not capable of perceiving all things from all angles. I think that is how one can know absolute truth, by perceiving all things from all angles. Humans will always only be able to see a few sides and not the whole picture. If there is no absolute truth, then is that not the absolute truth?

[beavis]

There are some things that are absolute, like math. Only abstract things can have absolute truth, because they dont really exist. When you apply math to what really exists, you add relativism and it is no longer absolute truth.

[Links Shadow]

quote:Originally posted by beavis
There is lots of chaos. A star has some order because it is made of atoms, but their movement and nuclear destruction and creation is chaotic. Flip a coin. You will get chaotic results in small sets of flips. There is some order because they average to 50%, but you said there is NO chaos and there is SOME chaos.

Is it not possible the what we think of as chao is just a form of organization so complex that we can not yet understand it.  We know so little about the structure of atoms, so how could we accurately say that there is not an orderly system by which they work.

Has anyone ever continued to flip a coin for eternity and look to see if it repeats itself or even monitored all flipped coins all the time to see if there is a pattern, NO.  Therefore we have not analyzed all possibilites and therefore we can not say with 100% certainty that chaos even exists.

I refer back to my favorite quote, "To know that you know nothing, makes you wise."  There is still SO much that we don't know and understand, and because of that who are we to say that something is not possible.  Until we have analyzed all possiblities it is not possible for us to say anything that is 100% certain, the problem comes in that we will never be able to analyze all possibilities because finding an answer always leads to more questions.

Respectfully,
Link's Shadow

[beavis]

"To know that you know nothing, makes you wise."

Nobody knows nothing. They know limited information about the small part of the universe they're in. I know almost nothing. Is that wise enough?

[Mustardseed]

Well since I am staying on here in the forum I might as well make some comments Ha. I had a funny experience this morning while meditating. I have been thinking about ......Absolute truth. It seems to me that there has to be such a thing. If not there would be Chaos, and there ins no chaos in the physical or the spiritual. While meditating on this the following thoughts came to me. It was a bit like a "muddle of thoughts" but sort of became clear as I allowed them acces.

There is a tendancy in the forum and among people in new age circles in general, to think that the physical world and the spiritual/astral plane is ONLY a product of your own beliefs. According to this school of thought varying spiritual entities you might meet are a product of your own belief in them, or the sum of your fears, soo...if you choose to disbelieve they should then disappear!! This is a big mistake, as there are Demons there are Angels and there is a God and there is a Devil. Certain truths are absolute......think about that. Some even take that to the physical plane and say there is no such thing as sickness its all in your mind. This also happens in Christian circles where people claim to be healed when they are not. My first wife threw away her glasses and walked around blind as a bat believing herself to be healed and "holding on" as she called it. This is just plain and simple spiritual pride, thinking more highly about yourself , your faith or abilities than you should. Many are suffering spiritual battles in the astral because they have gotten involved with spiritual entities they thought they could handle, thinking them to be only a fiction of their imagination only to find they were in way over their head. I think it is important we all realise we and the way we see things are not the center of the universe. There was a time when people believed the earth was the center of the physical world, only to later be proven wrong. The sun does not orbit the earth. The "biggie" and the most important thing we should all learn or that would be a very useful thing, is to learn to differentiate between the real and the imagined. This is true in the astral, the physical as well as in our own personal lives. We who are older know all to sure how youth think themselves to be immortal and live lives of extreme danger only sometimes to realise that they are not. Youth beware. Christians live under the notion that they are so close to God that they are always right about everything so loving and as a result become intolerable condesending and push people away from their faith, and people in this forum become so ...openminded that they choose to believe things that are entirely wrong, listening to voices that decieve and following paths that lead only to pain and suffering, and not the bliss full astral worlds they had hoped for. What do you all think??