Astral Projection and Crystals....

[David Warner]

Friends,

Well, I finally initialized my crystal in the moonlight using sea salt for the last 3 days. I was lucky enough to have had the crystal a few days before the full moon in which I started.

Anyways, I've noticed in the last few days that my dream recall is getting a little better and experienced my first projection today with holding the crystal in my hand physically.

Never a less, if the crystal is helping cool but if its just a big old stone - its definitely attractive and a talk piece.

Anyone here have conducted any experiments with crystals regarding the effects on astral projection? Also, I've heard that its good to have a crystal that is for grounding and protection.. Can anyone contribute?

Tvos

[Hans Solo]

Well, I finally initialized my crystal in the moonlight using seasalt for the last 3 days. I was lucky enough to have had the crystal a few days before the full moon in which I started.

Let me guess...you've been reading lots of mystical books on AP.  Don't forget to face north under running water during the 5th moon cycle or you'll be toast!  Man, none of this is needed and soon you'll be worried that your crystal isn't charged enough and so you'll fret about this possibility while you are trying to Obe or phase and these thoughts will screw you up.  All this is mumbo jumbo old school mystical junk.  Don't get caught up in all this superstition or you'll just create limiting beliefs.

Never a less, if the crystal is helping cool but if its just a big old stone - its definitely attractive and a talk piece

True.  Good attitude

Also, I've heard that its good to have a crystal that is for grounding and protection

Protection?  From What?  I will let you in on a little secret......THERE ARE NO SUCH THINGS AS NEGS.  Do yourself a favor and look up all you can on Focus 2 in Franks Phasing model.  When most people say the "Astral" what they mean is Focus 2.  In Focus 2 Thoughts=Reality.  So if you think you will see devils, guess what..YOU WILL.  Now, why is this.  The mystics used to think you were "out of Body" and that your thoughts draw these things to you, now we know this is not the case.  In focus 2 you are actually projecting into your subconscious mind, so you can literally make up any place and any scenario.  Read up on Franks Phasing model in the Permanent Astral Topics for a better understanding of the wider reality.

Fear is the mind killer and even BELIEVING in these things is enough to hold you back.  They truly only exist in your head.

Han

[James S]

If you don't believe in the effects of crystals Hans, then why bother commenting?

Have you ever actually experienced their possibilities? Have you ever actually made use of them and seen what they can or can't do?

Have you ever even considered the possibilities that the piezo-electric properties of quartz allows it to alter vibrational frequencies of energy fields, such as the bio-electric energy field of the human body?

Have you considered that the different colours, caused by different impurities affect the frequencies at which quartz oscillates, and that the human energy field also has varying frequencies depending on what region of the body your working with?

Have you also considered that a great many of the afflictions or conditions that we experience in out physical bodies are caused by the condition of our energy body - the life force energy that is a part of all things?

If you haven't, then all you are doing is speaking out of YOUR BELIEFS!

People have been effectively studying and using varieties of quartz crystals in healing practices for many thousands of years. It is not a technique that is in any way new to us, but it is one that has largely been ignored by modern science and medicine, though many naturopaths, many of which are fully trained and qualified general medical practitioners, have found uses for crystals in wholistic medicine.

So why don't you open up your seemingly narrow, limiting beliefs, stop  calling it mumbo-jumbo, accept the possibilities that there may be natural laws behind these things that you just don't know about yet, and maybe put a bit of time into finding out if crystals do or don't have any benefit yourself. If you're not at all interested, then please let others pursue their interest without rubishing their ideas.

In the mean-time...

the voice of silence,

Crystals to aid in astral projection are more a case of personal preference, though many varieties of quartz in the purple / violet colour range are supposed to be very helpful here.

For grounding, Hematite - a form of iron ore is very effective, or tiger-eye or smokey quartz  for something a little softer but still effective.

For protection, flourite is exceptionally good, and helps with harsh EM energies as well. There are many other stones that can be used for protection - obsidian, agate, aventurine.

Consider though that when dealing with issues of psychic protection, you want to be considering it only from a point of keeping away some of the more negative energies, esp negative emotional energies from people around you. To go much further down the path of psychic protection means you could end up becoming your own worst worst enemy by manifesting negativities through your own fears.

Treat psychic protection as something akin to puting on insect repellant - be aware of it, do something about it if you feel the need, then relax and have confidence that what you've done will help. The old "prevention is better than cure" thing works well here, and the best form of prevention is to keep yourself in a positive frame of mind. Think of it as the light dispelling the dark.

Blessings,
James.

[Hans Solo]

If you don't believe in the effects of crystals Hans, then why bother commenting

My beliefs are just as valid as yours.  You didn't tell him you were a crystal healer. So, now he gets both sides of the issue.  Crystalline structures, such as crystals, do have special properties with energy.  Thus, this is why we use silicone in computers.  Hell, even Atlantis had the "Great Crystal" which powered everything and was used in their "death ray".

People have been effectively studying and using varieties of quartz crystals in healing practices for many thousands of years. It is not a technique that is in any way new to us, but it is one that has largely been ignored by modern science and medicine, though many naturopaths, many of which are fully trained and qualified general medical practitioners, have found uses for crystals in wholistic medicine

They also ate goat gonads and tiger penises too, but that doesn't mean it works!  

Crystals to aid in astral projection are more a case of personal preference, though many varieties of quartz in the purple / violet colour range are supposed to be very helpful here.

Lets see if even the New Age community can agree on this: (these are "ap"stones, or listed as such)

http://thunderwolfsrealm.com/BOS/crystals1.html
1.Apophyllite, color=clearish green
2.Hermatite, color=black/maroon
3.lolite, color=purple

http://www.aznewage.com/crystals.htm
1.azurite, color= blue with green swirls (vice versa)
2.Hermaitie, color=black
3.Silver, color=silver (aligns astral +physical bodies.....WHAT?!!)

http://www.crystalbalance.com/InfoAZ.asp
1.Agate Natural, color=Orange/Green
2.Angelite, color=Powder blue
3.Bismuth, color=blueish,greenish (the color when oil is mixed with water)
4.Calcite Mangano, color=milky, to milky pink

Wow! A virtual kaleidoscope of colors and rocks will help you with astral travel.  However, this is only half of the story.  Whenever a rock was listen on multiple sites, guess what, the different sites had TOTALLY different description of what it does!  One has to conclude that this has to do with the placebo effect if not New Age mumbo Jumbo/fraud.(keep'em buying/chasing for that magical stone which will rocket them in to the "Astral").

Oh, and almost EVERY stone (or at least half) seem to help with protection, must be a lot of scared New Agers running around.

just my opinion, could be wrong,
Han

Ps. Penn&Teller: Email me for show ideas.

[David Warner]

Hans,

How long have you been involved with projecting and experiences?

Tvos

[Hans Solo]

Probably about a year and a half.  The only reason I posted this is because in the beginning I was the same as most people on this board.  Trying to find that magical something that will shoot me into the astral.  I spend a lot of money and nothing seemed to work, and yes I even bought crystals and the like.

I was so scared of negs that I had trouble falling asleep and when I would go into deep trance and would here voices or pops it would really freak me out.  This fear is the sole reason I had trouble projecting.

The reason I refer to Frank's Post so often is because this is the information that pulled me out of this stagnate cycle.  I guess it is a kin to telling all your friends how awesome a movie is and that they HAVE to see it!

James S-  I am open to the possibility that crystals work.   In fact, I hope they do, I love to see alternative medicine gaining footholds in modern medicine.  All I was saying is that this most likely won't be the magic bullet that shoots people into the astral, and that they should probably save their money if they are on a tight budget.  You have most Definitely seen results using crystals in healing and I don't doubt this claim.  I was referring more on the AP level of things.  Sorry chap.

Han

[Heather B.]

A friend of mine who has had about 5 years of AP experience recommended a bismuth crystal.  It's said to have the properties of easing astral projection, as well as easing feelings of loneliness.  I bought one fairly inexpensively.  It is very beautiful--a whole rainbow spectrum of colors, and very intricate shapes.  I think it has boosted the clarity of my dreams a bit.  I had begun to have APs before I got the crystal.  I haven't noticed any change in quantity or quality.  Not yet, at least.  But like you say, it is a very gorgeous, fascinating object!

[David Warner]

Hans,

That's what I thought about your limited projections... try 17yrs and having over thousands of projections and then come back to me and say there's nothing to fear...    "You will be afraid!"

Have you ever read CW.Ledbetter, Blavatsky, Egyptian Hermetics, Muldoon and Carrington, Castaneda, Fox? - These authors are definitely not "new age".  


Anyways, like you I found out that it comes within to project and the true desire to succeed. I'm a analytical thinker and scientist with astral projection. I like to try and test different methods it being crystals, ganzfield effect, trance method induced by sound. But the one that gets me out all the time is the hypnogogic state.

I did purchase a crystal a few weeks ago and its beautiful! If anything its actually kinda of sexy and my wife thinks so too..

But the true nature of projecting - everyone has their method. What works for one doesn't mean it will work for the other.

After all these years I still think I'm a novice at ap and still have a long way to go. I never cut people down for their beliefs, actions, or words for what they practice. I like helping others and sharing my experiences so they can learn and vice versa.

Just food for thought...

Tvos

[Hans Solo]

That's what I thought about your limited projections... try 17yrs and having over thousands of projections and then come back to me and say there's nothing to fear... "You will be afraid

I think you misunderstood me.  I believe (not really "believe" but whatever) in Franks theory on Focus 2 and the "Astral".  Focus 2 is within you and not outside, so therefore "negs" are thought creation and can not harm you.  I too have been the "Astral Warrior" killing all negs in sight and being afraid "sh*tless", untill I read Frank's theory.  Now, its not even an issue.

Believe whatever you want, however I believe real progress is in Focus 3 and Focus 4.  Unless, you want to change subconscious belief structures in focus 2 (which is what I am working on).

17 years--congrats!  I love trying to push all you natural projectors into Focus 3, so everyone can get more knowledge.


If you have time read up on this.  Try the slats method, I am interested to hear your results.  PM me if you can.  I want to hear your Focus3 experiences and I think this post will allow you to go there.

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=18538&highlight=f2+f3


Han

[James S]

James S-  I am open to the possibility that crystals work.   In fact, I hope they do, I love to see alternative medicine gaining footholds in modern medicine.  All I was saying is that this most likely won't be the magic bullet that shoots people into the astral, and that they should probably save their money if they are on a tight budget.  You have most Definitely seen results using crystals in healing and I don't doubt this claim.  I was referring more on the AP level of things.  Sorry chap.

Han

No problems Han.
Thank you for your thoughts here, I really appreciate them. Now I can see you're not just dissing the whole crystal thing, I'm sorry if I considered your thoughts narrow minded, I can see where you're coming from now.

Where it comes to a lot of the crystal and "new-age" sites on the internet, I tend to be rather sceptical, because many of them are just out to sell something. I have two reference guides for crystals - Judy Hall's "The Crystal Bible", and Melody's "Love Is In The Earth  - a Kaleidoscope of Crystals" - possibly one of the largest and most comprehensive crystal guides around. These books are great - they're not trying to sell you on anything (other than buying the book itsself), so I  pay more attention to them.

I agree very much that crystals aren't a magic bullet. Funny you should use that phrase - that's exactly what my reiki master said when I attended her crystal healing course last year. Crystals work on the energy body, therefore they tend to have very subtle effects. You can sometimes get a very pronounced effects, but not often.

If you ever meet someone who tries to sell crystals as being some kind of magic cure, or they say it will definitely do this or that, just nod your head, turn around, and walk, or run, far away from them!

You're right in noting that there's so many crystals around of different types that are reported to do the same thing. Very simple answer here - what works for one person doesn't necessarily work for another. The makeup of our energy bodies are as individual as we are.

For instance, my wife has a different approach to chosing crystals for personal use to most - she doesn't care about what they're supposed to do. She sets firmly in mind what she wants from the crystal, goes up to a collection of crystals, closes her eyes, and feels for the right one, which will usually draw her to it like a magnet. More often than not, we'll look up it's properties after, and she'll have made exactly the right choice. Chances are also that it will be different to one I'd have chosen for the same thing.

It's all so much about personal preference, what works with you. There will always be some common grounds, but still, I always advocate going and trying for yourself.

Blessings,
James.

[David Warner]

James,

I just purchased a amethyst and quartz crystal a few weeks ago. I've noticed a increased in dream recall, physical thoughts, objectives carrying over into my dreamllife - which is good.

My question to you is this. Does it hurt to have one or more crystal at a time or should I only use the one I'm wearing now around my neck? Some people have told me that I need a grounding and protection crystal when I project. So far I've been doing this for 17yrs and never really had the need for one. Always found my way back and called on God for sticky situations.

Please advise and Thank You for the info. you talked about earlier in this thread.

Tvos

[Ben K]

The human mind is an extraordinary thing. If you can take an objective item like crystals and have it actually help your projection, go for it! But like Han said, we already have all the tools we need to develop this skill. Also, keep in mind that nothing is free, and this applies even to things like a.p. crystals. Watch out for tricky side effects.

voice of silence - You talk like 17 years of experience means something. Sure you can astral project, good for you, but that doesnt mean that you understand the mechanics any more than Han and Frank do. If anything, that amount of experience is a DISadvantage because of all the habits and "mind-rubbish" you come across- like negs. 17 years in the grand scope of things is nothing. Im guessing you were one of those people who either learned all of this on your own or became involved in something "occult". Once you can learn to let go of all the b.s. like han, frank, myself and others, you will have a much more rewarding experience.

Or dont, its up to you. Im not going to tell you how to do this kind of thing.

[David Warner]

Ben,

I do appreciate the info about the crystals - what side effects are you talking about?

Secondly, you are right about the 17yrs - its a long road for projecting and I do agree with you on alot of what you say. To me its not how many times one projects, but its the quality and what is being learned. I know it sounds like sometimes I come off the man with the experience, but it actuality I still consider myself a novice.

I came across AP back in 1988 who a friend introduced me and I started reading up on it. I pursued it whole heatedly with fire and conviction to see if it was real or not. I did get my answer within less then two months. After that, I tried different methods to see how I was getting out- pyramids, crystals, food, exercise, etc...etc.. But after awhile when I became fluid and I realized it was just 'me' doing all the work.

I do believe to a degree that alot of what I mentioned earlier did help along the way with practice, but it was the work being put fourth that gave me the success. I never followed any kinda of occult, new age or anything of the sorts. Before 1988 I had exp. projections but on a quick small scale and never payed attention. Also, it was the feelings behind it that I did project that it started to come to me.

I've had my exposure to entities, some pleasant and some I wish not to remember. But I do realize and understand in my experience that I'm shown things for reasons.  What kinda of b.s. would you say that I need to let go off?

Please be more specific.

Tvos

[Ben K]

Well ive never used crystals myself so i couldnt answer that- im just saying that everything comes at a price so while the short term may benefit from the crystals, there could be some unknown side effects that you would never expect. Just keep your eyes open is all

As for the b.s.- i simply mean any limiting or negative beliefs that you might have. I used negs as an example- il keep that going.

When you project into F2- and im assuming that this is where you have had most of your experiences- you are actually projecting within YOURSELF. So any negs you come across are actually seperations of consciousness that YOU created. Next time you project you can play around with this.

Just think about a monster or something. Soon enough, and i mean soon, you will be face to face with your creation. THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THIS CREATION AND WHAT PEOPLE TYPICALLY CALL "negative entities". We naturally fear the unknown. This is why so many people who practice astral projection face so many "negs"- they dont know what they are doing! In an environment where THOUGHT = ACTION, of COURSE you are gonna come across some creepy sh*t! and i dont blame you, having to practice A.P. by oneself in todays scientific world would probably suck! Luckily we have the internet where you can learn about all the UNKNOWNS

Anyway thats just one example. Just dont limit your beliefs, keep in mind that YOU CANNOT BE HARMED in any way, and you should be fine

[David Warner]

Ben,

Anything in life comes with a price - if its losing weight, studying for a test, learning how to drive a car. What are the side effects and will it hurt me or propell me? What are the causes of effect, are there any dangers involved etc...

On a percentage of experiences, I would pro bally say that 95% of my experiences are positive, beautiful, breathtaking and enjoyable. The other 5% its inevitable where you will come across entities that are bad and mean harm. I've been in some real tough heart thumping situations
where I never thought I would be back. I've had starred the monster in the face as it said to me "take my hand and be a part of us" and have been attacked. But I am still here!

My question to you is this - I was just listening to audio interviews with Robert the Bruce (gotta love the name). He states that people who are under psychic attacks as like him or he's helped. Do you think they are making all that up?

Tvos

[James S]

Hi tvos,

It doesn't hurt at all to have more than one crystal or type of crystal on at a time. My wife has some "chakra" jewllery she wears a lot which has several stones for each of the chakras on it.  She really likes the feel of it - finds it balancing.

Go with your heart here - wear what you feel led to wear. Right at the moment I have a pewter Dragon pendant that has both Aventurine and Hematite on it. I also have another pure Aventurine pendant that sits over my heart, and I'm carrying a piece of Citrine in my pocket. More often I'll carry a piece of blue Agate around, and sometimes I'll change the Aventurine pendant for an Amethyst pendant.

Each stone helps with different areas of the energy body, and it will often be your intuition that will tell you what areas might enjoy the assistance a crystal will bring.


Your Aventurine & clear quartz combination would be great for dreams. I have those two on my bedside table too. They both help to open up the third eye and crown chakras, helping us to connect with the higher energies or higher planes. Just perfect for dreams, visions or OBEs.

And while everybody here busily tells you what you do or don't need, what is or isn't right, let your experiences and feelings guide you. Trust in them. Your soul brings them to you for a reason.

Blessings,
James.

Blessings,

[Ben K]

lola- what negative energies are you talking about? im sorry that sounds way to far fetched to think that there is "negative energy" that can be absorbed by magical crystals. is someone out to get you?

all these crazy useless constructs around here....but to each his own i guess =\

anyway, tvos- i cant comment on the robert bruce thing just cuz i dont have enough info... what do you mean by "psychic attack"? I highly doubt that these people are making it up, but an objective event like a simple headache can be interpreted lots of different ways- or the people could have had a placebo effect. I couldnt say.

[Ben K]

i dont pretend to know how they work and i mean no offense- i just dont see why someone would want to waste all this time on shiny pieces of rock and all these beliefs that go along with it. do you put on, take off, and "cleanse" crystals whenever you project? It just doesnt seem productive to me. But like i said, to each his own

[James S]

i dont pretend to know how they work and i mean no offense- i just dont see why someone would want to waste all this time on shiny pieces of rock and all these beliefs that go along with it. do you put on, take off, and "cleanse" crystals whenever you project? It just doesnt seem productive to me. But like i said, to each his own

No offence taken.  
It's good to retain some scepticism about things until you can see for yourself what they can or can't do. Just be open to the possibilities.

I'm not going to preach about the use of crystals, its entirely up to you if you want to know about them or not, but I'd just like to throw a few thoughts your way for consideration.

When you go to use a calculator you don't have to believe it's going to work to make it work. You just switch it on and start punching numbers in.

When you become used to working with crystals, you no longer have to believe that they're going to work for you either. You just pick them up and use them because you know they're going to work. They become like any other tool, the only difference being these tools are not doing their work in the physical plane so we can't measure their effectiveness in a purely empirical "scientific" manner.

So for those of us here who can tell you about the effects or benefits of crystals, its not a belief system. We're not trying to convert people to some kind of religion. They're just tools to be used to do a job.

As to the need for cleansing them... if you've used a knife from the kitchen drawer, you'd wash it before putting it back because it would have residue on it from the last thing you used it on. Crystals are much the same, only the residue that gets left on them is energy. Before you use them again, especially in any kind of healing practice, you need to clean them.

It just all sounds very weird because it's not working with "physical" principals - it's energy based stuff.

Runlola,

I think of crystals as healing & learning tools.
I haven't really used them for projection but certain
stones have that effect on me. They can be quite powerful.

A definite ditto to that.
I've recently found a prefence towards tumbled stones for everyday use. Their energies are softer. I really have to be in the right mood to cope with the terminated "angular" crystals. I've a double terminated Amethyst pendant that's absolutely gorgeous, but it can send me reeling sometimes.

James

[David Warner]

James,

Thank You for the advice and I appreciate it. I've talked with other people on crystals - some say its crazy, some take them into faith. Its all preference and what works. But I can see you are definitely knowledgeable and a great person!

Ben,

You state in your profile you play guitar. What educational level are you at with guitar? novice, average,or pro? What is your background with the instrument? Have you taken theory, how did you learn, what guitar picks do you use, did you have an instructor. How much do you know about transposing, or composition writing? What are the tools that got you there? Lets say you started playing on a $50. cheap guitar - would you have achieved that level of respect playing on a $8,000.00 guitar.

I'm a classical and electric guitarist. I compose/write/perform my own  material and do a lot of session work with other musician via internet. I've been through the theory training, composition writing etc..etc. What I am getting at is the tools we use to achieve our level of success will differ from each other. - The same goes with astral projection - its all about what works for one doesn't mean it will work for the other.

Since I've bought my crystal amethyst pendant, I have seen a little more activity in my dreams, being able to recall better. Could it all be coincidence or genuine - what ever! Its fun, I'm having a good time with it and at least I am having some positive results.

I do like your approach of being objective but you also have to give other mechanics to astral projection it a chance.

Tvos

[David Warner]

James,

If I'm wearing my quartz and amethyst crystal around my neck. Should I still ever month under the waning full moon cleanse the crystal?

What do you suggest?

Tvos

[chrishill]

i am not experienced but  i am not stupid i have been trying 3 days with out effect  but have been studying for a year now

the most basic thing that i have herder is it is in the thought  

i think that if you think the Crystal will work keep using it and cleansing it if you want and let others try what they want to

i am open to the idea of Crystal's having a magical property to them matter of fact i think any thing that is made by some sort of natural process that has not been altered by humans  can have some sort of magical property  

i think it is best to find what works for you

and if no one minds how long do you fell paralyzed for after returning

[David Warner]

Chrishill,

Depends on the hypnogigic state and the experience. I've had at times where my mind awakes and the vibes hit me so hard that I freeze and I  just can't move at all which brings terror and a unpleasant start to projecting. Other times, if the vibes are relaxing I can easily slip out gracefully.

On occasion when I return it might take a little bit to re-align into my physical body. I can definitely feel and sense the alignment taking place and the two bodies coming together. Usually, during this process its a natural feeling and there's no paralysis.

Hope this helps..

Tvos

[Nay]

I wish I could find the thread that James talked about nailing some jello onto a tree and you would get the same effect....IF YOU BELIEVE.. of course, I came away with a thumb nailed to the tree! LOL..  Remember James?..lol.

Nay

[James S]

Hehehe  
Yes, I remember Nay. Your comment cracked me up!

Tvos,

Full moon cleansing?
Yes, absolutely. Especially ones you wear regularly, as they're the ones most likely to get "grubby". If you have some crystals from which you can feel strong effects, be a little carefull of them after a full moon cleansing. They'll tend to be more potent.

Blessings,
James.