Meet the guy that became infinite in 15 minutes, and lives to tell about it.

[Astralsuzy]

I agree that it is good to do things to make ap easier, like you said training wheels.   If it involves using drugs it is a bad idea.   It messes up your brain.   I would imagine it would mess up your ap experiences as well.   You can become addicted to using drugs.   I am very grateful that I do not use drugs.   Life is hard enough without adding another problem.   There are a number of other ways to get training wheels without taking drugs.     

[Lumaza]

 Plasma, it sounds to me like you already made your decision. So why even ask people's opinion here? There have been other threads like this here on the Astral Pulse and they ALWAYS get the same response. You already see that we don't need "drugs" of any kind to succeed here. It takes patience, practice, perseverance and a focused will and intent to succeed.
This is one such thread:
  http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_astral_chat/difference_between_drugs_and_meditating-t23004.0.html

Many others and I have attempted to help you over the years with conventional methods. But for one reason or another you always made excuses why they wouldn't work for you. If you had put half the time that you spent asking questions here at the Astral Pulse into your practice, you would be a natural by now.   You have been a member here since 2010. That's a lot of practice time there.

 Your still looking for that "magic pill". I will tell you one thing, succeeding in a goal in life because of all the learning and effort you put into it is way more fulfilling than a magic pill of any kind.

I have opened other people's eyes up to another possibility/the NP, using my L/S Machine in the past. But not one of them pursued this any further. They saw what they saw and just kind of thought it's not for them I guess. I was shocked. I always thought the "magic pill" would work. But now I see I was mistaken.

[Astralsuzy]

Lumaza said the magic words.   It takes patience, practice, perseverance and a focused will and intent to succeed.  Lumaza advice was excellent.   He has great ideas to ap.   

[PlasmaAstralProjection]

I agree that it is good to do things to make ap easier, like you said training wheels.   If it involves using drugs it is a bad idea.   It messes up your brain.   I would imagine it would mess up your ap experiences as well.   You can become addicted to using drugs.   I am very grateful that I do not use drugs.   Life is hard enough without adding another problem.   There are a number of other ways to get training wheels without taking drugs.    

OK you say that now then tonight when you go to bed, your body will probably release DMT and 5-MEO-DMT to help you astral project. LOL

Again this is a personal preference. What is a God sent for one person can be hell for another who abuses the same substance. It's a sharp double edged sword. Used rightfully it creates heaven on earth. Used with ignorance, and carelessness you create hell on earth.

Again, this is not a topic for babies spiritually just as a sword needs it's a mature handler.

To your credit we do need more studies with these things. So it's understandable that your skeptical of any such means of spiritual growth. But IMO it also means that you don't really understand them either. If you did then you would know that psychedelics aren't addictive except for the dissociative psychedelics. And that anything can be psychologically addictive including food and working out. Do we not eat food because they can be psychologically addictive of course not. Everything in moderation.

Thanks for chiming in Astralsuzy.

It sounds to me like you already made our decision. So why even ask people's opinion here?

Well I've never if ever have heard astral projectors talk about such a deep experience. Clearly what Leo experienced was a true spiritual experience. And if you think it was just a drug high I think your poorly mistaken. But yeah I thought you's would find it interesting at the very least. That is really mostly what I was hoping for.

There have been other threads like this here on the Astral Pulse and they ALWAYS get the same response. You already see that we don't need "drugs" of any kind to succeed here. It takes patience, practice, perseverance and a focused will and intent to succeed.

Good for you taking the soon to be old fashion, tried but true route to astral projection. Why do I call it soon to be old fashion? Well nanobots will be coming soon to give us astral projection on demand. So many will opt to go that route soon.  

Many others and I have attempted to help you over the years with conventional methods.

Yeah and I am very grateful for that. If I wasn't I wouldn't be still hanging around here.

But for one reason or another you always made excuses why they wouldn't work for you. If you had put half the time that you spent asking questions here at the Astral Pulse into your practice, you would be a natural by now.   You have been a member here since 2010. That's a lot of practice time there.

The most I got out of learning about astral projection wasn't the methods, but rather it really helped me loose my fear of hell, since I grew up in a fundamentalist christian home. Besides I've been juggling a health condition back then. And now I'm juggling being a College student and a job. So Excuse me if I don't have too much time for this. And I admit that I really wanted to astral project years ago. But do you know what happened? My health was so bad at the time that I became discouraged with learning to astral project. Every time I tried to astral project I would would have sleeping problems. And just a little bit of sleeping problems would worsen my health condition. Luckily I no longer have those health problems like I use to. But I am very busy. In fact I should be working on homework right now. But this is a very interesting discussion to me.

I have opened other people's eyes up to another possibility, the NP, using my L/S Machine in the past. But not one of them pursued this any further. They saw what they saw and just kind of thought it's not for them I guess. I was shocked. I always thought the "magic pill" would work. But now I see I was mistaken.

Once I get out of College I'll probably go back to working on astral projection methods. Today I told a guy at college that what he experienced could have been astral projection. So I am still on your side. I am the one that is telling others about astral projection too.

Lastly I see right through your post here. You used a logically fallacy called ad hominem to attack me and my character rather than the substance of this talk. So let's not make this personal. OK I am still on your side. I still love astral projection. I still dream about it. Last night I dreamt that I was flying. Let's not make this psychedelics versus astral projection. Since I really strongly believe that one day psychedelics and astral projection live in harmony within society.

[Nameless]

Thanks for replying Nameless. I like to talk about this subject. OK a few things. So as far as I know Leo just started doing psychedelics. So were you saying that Leo has been taking psychedelics since the 70's? I am confused since you worded it weird.

No, not saying he's been doing it since the 70s. I was referring to the 'peace movements' here in the US from the mid 60s to around the mid 70s. The Stoners if you will. Psychedelics were big back then.

Also I would be dead if it wasn't for medications prescribed by doctors. And when psychedelics are legalized and they will, it will be done with purity, controls, and medical personal present. I would feel totally safe in such a controlled environment knowing that if anything went wrong I would have medical professionals ready to help.

I can respect your thinking on that. My personal experience has led me to think the opposite. I'm just not into medications outside taking something for an illness. Drugs are partially responsible for damaging my mother's life and she was not a drug-head. All she did was follow doctors orders.

Define natural for me because we seem to have this idea that natural is somehow better. Volcano's, avalanches, tornadoes, hurricanes, cyanide, naturally genetic diseases, natural disorders. None of these things are good yet they are natural.

Nothing that dramatic more like if I can walk I don't need a wheelchair.

And if someone else relies off of exogenous DMT (outside the body) good for them for finding some very good training wheels that would take the other guy a long time to figure out on his own probably.
...there is more than one way to skin a cat.

This is correct. I can say without experimentation we may as well quit. One thing, my comments are rarely ever to be taken to extremes. I usually stick only with my own thoughts and experience. I think if you want to experiment and you find something that helps you then you should go with that as should everyone. Take what you need and leave the rest. This is a good topic for discussion.

[Szaxx]

You only need to stay still when you wake in the morning. Just be aware of yourself and don't move anything. Opening your eyes kills it. Put yourself as an atom floating in the room like an air element then wait with strong intent to see a whitewashed background. Enlarge yourself so you can see the room and if successful it'll appear in 360 degrees vision. You can stay still and look around, look sideways then try toove slowly forwards. This will be interesting for you as your point of perspective was sideways you'll move in a different direction from what you perceive.
Best of luck with it.
You don't need supplements, just intent.
If a 9 year old can do it, I'm sure you can lol.

[desert-rat]

I just got a few minutes in to the video and heard psychedelics.  I advise any one using any kind of drug to know what they are doing.  To be fair I will watch to whole video.
P.s. I am not sure if I can watch this all the way through.  The guy just looks like some one that has used too many drugs.

[PlasmaAstralProjection]

I just got a few minutes in to the video and heard psychedelics.  I advise any one using any kind of drug to know what they are doing.  To be fair I will watch to whole video.
P.s. I am not sure if I can watch this all the way through.  The guy just looks like some one that has used too many drugs.

Leo has just started taking psychedelics. In fact in some of his recent other videos he advised against any drugs while talking about enlightenment. But he like many others have found that classical psychedelics pose no physical addictive potential. In fact psychedelics are increasingly used to treat addiction with a very high success rate.

Besides Leo has also been working on self-actualization and enlightenment work hardcore without any psychedelics for about 3 years. So if anyone is qualified enough to give an honest look at these substances well call psychedelics it's Leo. He's about as unbiased as you going to get, because he's been on both sides of the field.

EDIT: And yes it's vitally important that one fully researchers any drug/substance/molecule/psychedelic they ingest. I'm fully with you on that.

[PlasmaAstralProjection]

I will reply to the rest of you's later.

[desert-rat]

I will watch to whole video.   I don't use drugs myself.  All I was doing was advising any one else to understand the effects of any substance before using it.

[Astralsuzy]

You will become additive to the drug.   Not because the drug itself is addictive as you say.   You will become dependent on taking the drug if ap works.   If ap works you will want to take the drug again and again.   You have obviously made up your mind that you will take the drug and we cannot persuade you not to do it.   It is your choice, your life.   

[PlasmaAstralProjection]

No, not saying he's been doing it since the 70s. I was referring to the 'peace movements' here in the US from the mid 60s to around the mid 70s. The Stoners if you will. Psychedelics were big back then.
I can respect your thinking on that. My personal experience has led me to think the opposite. I'm just not into medications outside taking something for an illness. Drugs are partially responsible for damaging my mother's life and she was not a drug-head. All she did was follow doctors orders.
Nothing that dramatic more like if I can walk I don't need a wheelchair.

I am sorry your mother died. But let's be clear here any drug that is prescribed is prescribed because the that medical professional has weighed that the pros outweigh the cons any given medication. So if your mom died it likely wasn't because of any drugs prescribed.

I would be dead a couples of time over if modern medicine didn't come and save me with medications and treatments, and I am only 34 years old right now. I've also just recently dealt with severe depression caused by a rare reaction from an acne antibiotic medication. And am still recovering months later from that but overall I've been saved from them more often than not. You just have to be very careful taking any sort of drug and even not taking medication once you get old.

This is correct. I can say without experimentation we may as well quit. One thing, my comments are rarely ever to be taken to extremes. I usually stick only with my own thoughts and experience. I think if you want to experiment and you find something that helps you then you should go with that as should everyone. Take what you need and leave the rest. This is a good topic for discussion.

Finally someone gets it here. Finally someone understands that it's not necessarily about what everyone else is doing. It's not about the standard versus the fringe. It's not about that at all, it's about WHAT WORKS!!! And please correct me if I misrepresentation what you meant there. What actually works to bring us closer to our source/God/Love whatever you want to call it.

Thanks for chiming in Nameless.

[PlasmaAstralProjection]

You only need to stay still when you wake in the morning. Just be aware of yourself and don't move anything. Opening your eyes kills it. Put yourself as an atom floating in the room like an air element then wait with strong intent to see a whitewashed background. Enlarge yourself so you can see the room and if successful it'll appear in 360 degrees vision. You can stay still and look around, look sideways then try toove slowly forwards. This will be interesting for you as your point of perspective was sideways you'll move in a different direction from what you perceive.
Best of luck with it.
You don't need supplements, just intent.
If a 9 year old can do it, I'm sure you can lol.

You know Szaxx, if anyone here could convince me to try and astral project again it would be you. You have done more to help me than anyone else here. And I must say that you got me seriously thinking about it again. But I admit that I really think it would take a lot of effort and time for me to accomplish this than what you would think it would take. After all you have been astral projecting naturally since you were a kid. So be understanding for those that aren't naturals at it like myself. For you I will try some of my own techniques that I like using. And maybe I'll incorporate some of this stuff into it too. I can't guarantee that I can keep up for years without success but I will try to do it when I can.    And if I do succeed then I am sure it would only motivate me to go further. Perhaps micro-dosing magic mushrooms would help. 

Either way thanks Szaxx.

[PlasmaAstralProjection]

I will watch to whole video.   I don't use drugs myself.  All I was doing was advising any one else to understand the effects of any substance before using it.

OK

[PlasmaAstralProjection]

You will become additive to the drug.   Not because the drug itself is addictive as you say.   You will become dependent on taking the drug if ap works.   If ap works you will want to take the drug again and again.   You have obviously made up your mind that you will take the drug and we cannot persuade you not to do it.   It is your choice, your life.   

Contrary to what you might think I've never taken DMT, 5-MEO-DMT, LSD, and many other psychedelics. I can't even count the amount of psychedelics I've taken in my whole life on one hand. And I've never astral projected on any of them. I won't go into the benefits I got from them least a moderator locks this thread. But I will say that I've benefited from them. And I've never taken a strong dose. And I've never gotten addicted from any psychedelic. Like I said psychedelics aren't addictive except for the dissociative psychedelics which have some addiction potential. Personally I wouldn't recommend any of those for spiritual use.

Lastly try telling the shamans in Peru and the Amazon that the people they treat with ayahuasca and peyote, tell them that they are going to make a bunch of drug addicts. Grow up.

Thanks for chiming in these discussions need to be had.

[desert-rat]

I just dont trust any exp. while using drugs . I tried weed once 25+ years ago . I know how it change your percpt. of reality .

[PlasmaAstralProjection]

I just dont trust any exp. while using drugs . I tried weed once 25+ years ago . I know how it change your percpt. of reality .

Well not all tools are created equally. And I admit that since we don't have really good science on these psychedelics it's really hard to say with absolute confidence anything about them unless we take them ourselves over a period of time or we study what others have to say. Which isn't for the vast majority of people. So your view is understandable. At the same time it also means that you really don't know much of anything about this type of spiritual tool called psychedelics. And BTW marijuana isn't a real psychedelic. So it's like comparing apples and oranges, not a good idea.

Let me ask you Desert Rat if a certain type of nanobot were scientifically proven to give people spiritual enlightenment within one year would you use the nanobots to catalyze your spiritual growth?

[desert-rat]

I guess its that I have scene too many people wreck there lives abusing drugs .  Inc. alc. , to be fair I do drink beer .  I am for the leagalization of all drugs , if one wants to screw them selfs up , thats there choise . 
On nano bots , I am sure there on there way .  Put in side people to fix them up .  i dont know about any thing spiritural tho .   Personaly I will see how they work on others first .   

[Xanth]

Plasma, please keep the drug talk out of here. 

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_astral_chat/aup_addendum_must_read-t44680.0.html

This goes to everyone else as well please.

[PlasmaAstralProjection]

Plasma, please keep the drug talk out of here.

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_astral_chat/aup_addendum_must_read-t44680.0.html

This goes to everyone else as well please.

I don't think I broke the rules as the link you posted says.

"There are no taboo topics here and mental conditions and drug use are a part of our reality and can be appropriate for discussion but only for academic purposes, meaning they are only up for discussion as to what role they play in our theoretical understanding of the larger reality. Questions in regards to how much of a supplement or drug should be ingested (even legal ones) are not our area of expertise so please refrain from asking and use common sense before posting similar questions."

You can't get into a "theoretical understanding" without getting into personal opinion. Which is what I did. I never directly promoted any molecule that our body doesn't already make anyway. So in that sense 5-MEO-DMT isn't a drug. Because if 5-MEO-DMT is a drug then our body is full of drugs. Which doesn't make sense. But beyond any psychedelic talk all I really wanted out of this thread was to get people to see a very interesting story about a very powerful "larger reality" experience psychedelic or not.

OK I've got a theoretical question for you Xanth. If 5-MEO-DMT was eventually legalized for medical use and scientifically proven to give permanent enlightenment in 90 percent of people that consistently take it, and 100 percent proven to give a spiritual experience, then would you consider taking it in a medical setting?

[PlasmaAstralProjection]

On another note Leo just said something I never thought I would hear him say since he's been such a naturalist, he quoted Thomas Campbell in his new video here. I forget exactly where it's at but it's in the first half of the video I know.

Low Quality vs High Quality Consciousness
https://youtu.be/Hg8JDHlkIrM

If Leo is listening to Thomas Campbell I know he's definitely changed his train of thought about reality to a pretty high degree, and IMO his psychedelic use catalyzed that. And little other things he's said makes me think this too. This is theoretical of course.

[Lumaza]

I don't think I broke the rules as the link you posted says.

Perhaps it was your comment on "Nanobots being used for spiritual advancement and Astral Projection" that got you that warning Plasma, lol! 

[PlasmaAstralProjection]

Perhaps it was your comment on "Nanobots being used for spiritual advancement and Astral Projection" that got you that warning Plasma, lol! 

 

[Xanth]

I don't think I broke the rules as the link you posted says.

You're promoting it's use.   Please stop, or the thread will get deleted.

The Astral Pulse DOES NOT condone the use of drugs in order to project.
Our stance is that you need to learn to do it yourself.  You gain very little, if anything at all from using drugs to project.

[EscapeVelocity]

Thank you Xanth!

Plasma, I can feed you a variety of drugs or crack you in the head with a crowbar...each will possibly introduce you in some fashion to the Astral. Neither of them are recommended and that is the position the Pulse has to take, so your entreaty needs to come to an end.

You need to learn to do it yourself.