The Neverending Thread (was SATAN DECEIVES YOU)

[Tab]

What about the Kabala o wise one?

[alchimiste]

Allanon,
If you really want to save some souls I would suggest you visit www.mysticweb.org. they would surely welcome you with open hearts.

[Allanon]

quote:yes, you have a point, peaceful warrior. there are plenty of people who believe in what the bible says, regardless of lack of historical proof (and even with proof that things could be wrong), but do not have such extreme, eerrr... ah, i can't think of a good word to describe it... psycho-fervor of hate-filled condemnation that this allanon person has. you can believe in everything that the bible says, without believing that everyone is going to the pits of hell for not believing in it, too. and you can believe in it without forcing it down everyone else's throat. and you can believe in it and still respect other's beliefs, too (which i'm sure is what jesus wants us to do... respect and love each other despite differences). perhaps allanon's case is one of extreme difference of interpretation of the bible, and perhaps some hardcore brainwashing to boot. either that, or allanon's playing a prank on us all.

I DO NOT hate any of you. WE ARE ALL EQUALS IN THAT WE HAVE A FALLEN NATURE AND ARE SLAVES TO SIN. God has a Way, One Way that is the True religon and it is found in Hid Word and in His Son.

I pray that the Light will shine into your hearts today and you put away your idols and self worship and give Praise to the pot maker not the pot.

Jesus Loves you and I have a sincere desire to help those that search for the Spring of Eternal Life. I Love all of you in Christ and Hope that you realize the illusions that the sinful mind can create. If you continue in your wicked ways than your mind will be intoxicated with the sting of disbeleif.

I mean no offense to any of you BUT GOD'S WAY IS GOD'S WAY NO MATTER WHAT THE WORLD TELLS YOU.

[Adrian]

Greetings PeacefulWarrior,

quote:Originally posted by PeacefulWarrior

Robert, I see you what you are saying and you are right, but why are you saying this?  If you have seen what I have written in response to Allanon, you will see that i disagree with a lot of what he is saying and especially how he is saying it, but I too believe in Christ and I don't really care about "historical evidence."  If I loooked to historical evidence to support all of the things I believe in, including the OBE phenomena then I wouldn't believe in anything.  

I have read most everything you have written and have corresponded with you privately and have never seen any hint of anti-Christian sentiment, but it seems like you are trying to shut down belief in the New Testament, which for me is a valid document.

Could you clarify please?

I don't speak for Robert and I understand and respect your concerns, but I can only reiterate what I said before.

No one I am sure, and certainly not I doubt the existence of Jesus (Joshua), and his mission to save mankind. But saving mankind does not mean the things put together by people in the bible, but rather he was and is a very high Spiritual leader, an Ascended Master, who came to teach Spiritual truths to a band of people who would themselves become teachers.

However, as Robert said: The only thing that supports the bible is the bible. I say again: there is no historical evidence to support the new testament

And he is absolutely correct in this. The bible does not exist except as the work of man over the millennia, constructed almost as a political tool to control the masses. It is a human construct. People who are vociferously trying to ram the doctrines of the church down peoples throats are therefore stuck in a circular argument because their entire belief is based upon a book which seeks to justify itself, and which book, again, is a human construct, not that of God.

People can experience OBE and Astral projection and visit the Astral realms which requires no faith at all, it is a truism. People on the other hand have no way of verifying any of the bible exists at all.

I do not believe Robert is questioning peoples faith or the right to hold a faith, any faith, but he is rather making the distinction between faith and truth. Believing in the bible is faith not truth.

I hope I explained that alright, because as you know I have much respect for your own faith, and do recognise the LDS church have many beliefs which are very much Spiritually based.

To understand Robert's own position, I would highly recommend his article "The Catch Basket Concept":

http://www.astralpulse.com/articles/robert/articles_44.htm

With best regards,

Adrian.

[Makaveli]

Allanon this has to stop I don't know what your looking for but as you can see nobody is buying into your bible thumping.  I think we all get the point about what your saying but your only posting your own personal beliefs with any evidence or supporting arguments and expecting everyone to take it as fact but that is not debating.  What you are preaching is blind faith and it's easy to make claims like this but coming up with good arguments for the claims and proof is another story.  You are only lowering my opinion about Christianity with ignorance and intolerance like this.  Please stop unless if you have something intelligent to say because this is going nowhere and getting repetitive so I'm done responding to you unless if you can come up with something intelligent.

[Adrian]

Greetings Allanon,

I have to advise you that unless you can support your position with evidence and reasoned discussion, I will lock this thread, and no similar thread started by you will be allowed.

You are pursuing this line of intransigent preaching in multiple forums, and we have all been very patient. But no more please.

With best regards,

Adrian.

[beavis]

"support your position with evidence"

Dont forget that the bible is dogma, not evidence.

[Tao]

Don`t lower yourself Adrian to his level and block him or something.. becuase he eventually has to get bored because if he continue like this he will be ignored by mostly all the folks here...

But deleting posts and threads is something which suits mysticwebB not our forum..

He is just happy to see how much replies he got i think.. and will still try in my opinion to get some more.. but i say we should ignore him if he doesn`t begin to make some sense here.. and use logic in his posts..

Mike

[PeacefulWarrior]

James and Adrian:
Thank you for your kind and intelligent words.  ...and thanks for the clarification Adrian.  I understand exactly what you mean.

Well, I think I've spent about as much time in this thread as I can bear...[xx(]  

-Dan

[Traveler]

Like I said 6 pages ago, Allanon, You're being judgemental.

I recently finished a two year study of the bible. I accept it as the word of God. We found many inconsistancies in translation of words which could affect interpretation. Also I'm convinced there is information that has been left out by those wanting to serve their own purpose. To say that the above did not happen is to say the holocaust didn't happen. There are too many crossreferences between many of the books to say that the book has no merit. The bible is not an easy book to understand, people spend their whole life trying. To dismiss it as fiction, to me, is ludicrous. No one even mentioned the most obvious (to me) example of OBE/AP was John's vision of Christ's revelation in the book of Revelation. He was truly having an astral experience. Does God not want us to AP? He gave us free will, we could do it for bad if we choose or we can use it for good (loving, helping and taking care of others).
Remember the ten commandments in everything you do.

[rodentmouse]

maybe allanon  is  doing all this delberatly  to see how our "new age thinking"  responds to  ignorance and arrogance.

  When  we  get angry and argue with allanon,   we  show  that  our  beleif systems havent  taught  us  to  control  our anger,  or  tolerate those  we think  have  the wrong idea.

but if  he is genuine then i suppose  this  entire thread would be a test,  to  see how  new age thinking  deals with old age thinking.  I for one  beleive that the  kind of knowledge on this board and the general ethos of honesty, truth, growth etc.. is  going to erupt into the world soon.    allanon  embodies  what new age  thinking  will be up against.    



some  of  the responses to allanon have been bitter and  counter productive,   and some of them have challenged him to think.
the former  isnt  what  new-age  thinking  should be.

and allanon,   you say all other religions are  from the devil...

if  a  jew  grows  up  to be a good, caring, honest, loving, loyal, decent, helpful member of society,  why should he go to hell?

if  god punishes  people for not being  xian,  then  why would anyone want to worship a god like that?

and  what  do  you mean  when  you say  "accept jesus" and the like, to me it doesnt make sense,  how does one accept jesus?

[goingslow]

People are answering as individuals with individual beliefs.  Not representing any new age style of thinking.  I think the thread is fine and each person responds the way they chose to..

New age isnt a doctrine or a proper way of behaving.  Christianity is more based on that.. even though its more relaxed on some things.  Like judging everyone one else.. or acting a certain way whether you really believe it or not. Or show it when the priest isnt looking.

[Allanon]

Allright maybe I will answer this couple of questions because they really got my itch goin again. I will be gentler this time.

quote:if a jew grows up to be a good, caring, honest, loving, loyal, decent, helpful member of society, why should he go to hell?

Because he has failed to fulfill the whole Law. Jesus is the only One that fulfilled the whole Law.

quote:and what do you mean when you say "accept jesus" and the like, to me it doesnt make sense, how does one accept jesus?

You accept Jesus by HAVING FAITH IN JESUS AND HIS FINISHED WORK.

God is prefect and to be in His presence completely you have to fulfill the Law of God. As most here are New Agers there is that drive you adhere to which says "I will find God in my path, in my way, in my time". You see we can never find God fully again. Not from the way of the world that is. We are lost souls. Look to the mirror and tell me that you deserve to have the rewards of the Saints. None of us do and only by Jesus coming and fulfilling the Law through Grace are we allowed to finally have the peace and rest that we all want in life.

ONLY GOD CAN REPAY GOD.

[shadowatcher]

pmlonline: Are you really on first name terms with Mr. Bruce?

[Nita]

Hello Everyone
Allanon is a name in the states for an organization that saves drug addicts and helps their families by using Christianity. It is a lot like Alchoholics Anonymus in that way.
They want to believe that Christ saved them and are people that believe in every word of the bible even though the different translations prove how much it has been changed. Try reading a Greek Orthodox bible it is a lot different than the King James version for example.
Now that said people who go through these things believe that everyone else has made terrible mistakes just like they have made. They go around trying to make up for their mistakes by shoving their beliefs down everyones throats. I have seen one tell my Mother she is not Christian when she is a deacon in a Presbyterian church.
I agree with Adrian everyone has been patient with you Allanon. Please go and reform the people around where you live and who you grew up with in your life. They are the ones who made you what you are and they are the ones who should be hearing these speeches.
You do not know what others believe or care about and should quit harassing them. Every person on this earth learns their own lessons and goes on their own Path. You have chosen your Path don't drive everyone else away from it by your preaching.
  Nita

[WalkingThePath]

Hello everyone

"You were made in the image and likeness of God"

We don't create God so us He can meet OUR needs. Just because we are revengeful and want to punish doesn't mean God is so.
God is supposed to be infinately loving and compassionate, how can he condemn anyone for anything?
I don't think God sits on a golden throne and goes around judging people. I do not believe God even expects from us anything! God has free will, he is a Creator, and because we were made "in the image and likeness of God" we have free will too and that's just what that is.
Why would God give us free will, and then punish us for anything? It's like saying you can do what you want but if you don't do what I want you will burn in Hell! This is just, wrong! God loves and accepts people because they Are, for that is unconditional love. If God has not unconditional love then noone does!

I am a born Christian, and i love and admire Jesus for what he REALLY was and did.  I am not really religious, and i never truly was, but for the first time i feel closer to God and that makes me happy. If this is wrong then so be it.


Malvina

[Allanon]

quote:Hello Everyone
Allanon is a name in the states for an organization that saves drug addicts and helps their families by using Christianity. It is a lot like Alchoholics Anonymus in that way.
They want to believe that Christ saved them and are people that believe in every word of the bible even though the different translations prove how much it has been changed. Try reading a Greek Orthodox bible it is a lot different than the King James version for example.
Now that said people who go through these things believe that everyone else has made terrible mistakes just like they have made. They go around trying to make up for their mistakes by shoving their beliefs down everyones throats. I have seen one tell my Mother she is not Christian when she is a deacon in a Presbyterian church.
I agree with Adrian everyone has been patient with you Allanon. Please go and reform the people around where you live and who you grew up with in your life. They are the ones who made you what you are and they are the ones who should be hearing these speeches.
You do not know what others believe or care about and should quit harassing them. Every person on this earth learns their own lessons and goes on their own Path. You have chosen your Path don't drive everyone else away from it by your preaching.
Nita

I did not know that. It sounds like a GREAT organization though.

[Allanon]

Jesus Is Coming

7 Behold, I am coming soon! Blessed is he who keeps the words of the prophecy in this book.
8
I, John, am the one who heard and saw these things. And when I had heard and seen them, I fell down to worship at the feet of the angel who had been showing them to me.
9 But he said to me, Do not do it! I am a fellow- servant with you and with your brothers the prophets and of all who keep the words of this book. Worship God!
10 Then he told me, Do not seal up the words of the prophecy of this book, because the time is near.
11 Let him who does wrong continue to do wrong; let him who is vile continue to be vile; let him who does right continue to do right; and let him who is holy continue to be holy.
12
Behold, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to everyone according to what he has done.
13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.
14 Blessed are those who wash their robes, that they may have the right to the tree of life and may go through the gates into the city.
15 Outside are the dogs, those who practise magic arts, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the idolaters and everyone who loves and practises falsehood.
16 I, Jesus, have sent my angel to give you this testimony for the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, and the bright Morning Star.
17
The Spirit and the bride say, Come! And let him who hears say, Come! Whoever is thirsty, let him come; and whoever wishes, let him take the free gift of the water of life.
18
I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book.
19 And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.
20 He who testifies to these things says, Yes, I am coming soon. Amen. Come, Lord Jesus.
21 The grace of the Lord Jesus be with God's people. Amen.

[cainam_nazier]

quote:11 Let him who does wrong continue to do wrong; let him who is vile continue to be vile; let him who does right continue to do right; and let him who is holy continue to be holy.

Interesting you would use this line.  I was wondering how long it would take for you to supply us with the ammo.  Listen to the words you put down and leave us to our own devices and stop trying to save us.  If we had not already chosen our path, chosen that which we will be judged on, then maybe you would have a chance to save us.  Then again we also would not be here consorting with people of like mind.

Most of us are here to learn.  And nobody here, infact I argue that nobody on Earth, truely knows what is going to happen to them after they die.  I personally don't think about it anymore.  I no longer care.  I say this because no matter how much I search or question for that answer I will never be able to truely tell what is going to happen.  There is not a single person on the face of the Earth, not even you, that can tell me with out a doubt what my final fate will be.  Even if I was to follow "your book" to the letter there would be no garentee.  After all, even though the book was "inspired" by God it was written by a man, and only God knows my judgement.  

I find it funny how easily you pass judgement on to us, placing yours above that of God's.  You have no idea who we are, you do not know us at all.  You only know a few words written by a name, but you do not know the person behind the name.  So how can you be so vien in thinking that you are totally and 100% correct about the people you are judging?

I said it in another thread but I will say it here also.  It is not your place to judge us.  That my friend is God's job.  If we are to be judged and sentanced so forcably, then it will be God's doing.  And to, if we are to be saved then God will show us the way.  I know that you will respond with, "But God has shown you the way, and its in this book...blah, blah, blah."   But no, if God had shown me the way I would not be having this discussion with you.  What I mean is that God would have made it more apparrent that I needed to change, some thing more obvious.

However given previous corispondance I believe that this will fall on deaf ears and you will not understand the basics of what I mean.  But I am compelled to respond anyhow.

[Allanon]

quote:nobody here, infact I argue that nobody on Earth, truely knows what is going to happen to them after they die.

Look to God and His Word for the answer you seek.

[no_leaf_clover]

quote:Now that said people who go through these things believe that everyone else has made terrible mistakes just like they have made. They go around trying to make up for their mistakes by shoving their beliefs down everyones throats. I have seen one tell my Mother she is not Christian when she is a deacon in a Presbyterian church.

Allanon was literally defined in that post.

We shouldn't have to constantly deal with posts like this, but yet we do, several times a day. I don't enjoy looking through topics and seeing massive amounts of preaching, and all coming from one person. I think it's well established that not many people here do. I've yet to read a post by anyone that agrees totally with what Allanon is doing. We shouldn't have to deal with this, yet there is nothing that we can do. It's that simple. We just have to wait for moderator or administrative action.

[Allanon]

quote:We shouldn't have to constantly deal with posts like this, but yet we do, several times a day. I don't enjoy looking through topics and seeing massive amounts of preaching, and all coming from one person. I think it's well established that not many people here do. I've yet to read a post by anyone that agrees totally with what Allanon is doing. We shouldn't have to deal with this, yet there is nothing that we can do. It's that simple. We just have to wait for moderator or administrative action.

Ignore my statements of Truth or just visit one of the other hundreds of threads here on the board. You write against the Word because you want it to go away. Your inner child knows the Truth but the sins of the world cloud the mind from Grace.

[no_leaf_clover]

Don't misinterpret my negative feelings towards your posting as success. If your words were that magical I would be Christian by now, trust me.

[timeless]

Dear Allanon,

If you were offering Christ's love I would support you.  But you are not offering Christ's love...for I do not see harmony around you.  You only offer YOUR WILL, FEAR, and quote after quote like a sword of truth. Love is not a sword it is a healer.  You hold nothing in your hand.  

Jesus the Christ spoke about love again and again and ego has no place in love. Your ego sins and you disgrace Christianity.

Hopefully, love will save you but based on what I have read in your previous posts it will not happen any time soon.

I have now spoken to you as you speak to others.  NOW do you see the ego in your foolish words. OR are you blind.

Do you not see that your attitude is precisely what starts religious wars.  Do you think God rejoices in war?  Love does not start wars.  Will and Ego start wars because they are the mother and father of hatred.  What ugly cheap substitutes you offer for LOVE.  

[Allanon]

Dear Timeless.....In answer to this statement.....

quote:Do you not see that your attitude is precisely what starts religious wars. Do you think God rejoices in war? Love does not start wars. Will and Ego start wars because they are the mother and father of hatred. What ugly cheap substitutes you offer for LOVE.

Raise a banner on a bare hilltop,
shout to them;
beckon to them
to enter the gates of the nobles.
3 I have commanded my holy ones;
I have summoned my warriors to carry out my wrath-
those who rejoice in my triumph.

4 Listen, a noise on the mountains,
like that of a great multitude!
Listen, an uproar among the kingdoms,
like nations massing together!
The LORD Almighty is mustering
an army for war.
5 They come from faraway lands,
from the ends of the heavens-
the LORD and the weapons of his wrath-
to destroy the whole country.

6 Wail, for the day of the LORD is near;
it will come like destruction from the Almighty. [1]
7 Because of this, all hands will go limp,
every man's heart will melt.
8 Terror will seize them,
pain and anguish will grip them;
they will writhe like a woman in labor.
They will look aghast at each other,
their faces aflame.

9 See, the day of the LORD is coming
-a cruel day, with wrath and fierce anger-
to make the land desolate
and destroy the sinners within it.
10 The stars of heaven and their constellations
will not show their light.
The rising sun will be darkened
and the moon will not give its light.
11 I will punish the world for its evil,
the wicked for their sins.
I will put an end to the arrogance of the haughty
and will humble the pride of the ruthless.
12 I will make man scarcer than pure gold,
more rare than the gold of Ophir.
13 Therefore I will make the heavens tremble;
and the earth will shake from its place
at the wrath of the LORD Almighty,
in the day of his burning anger.

quote:Love is not a sword it is a healer. You hold nothing in your hand.

34"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35For I have come to turn
  " 'a man against his father,
      a daughter against her mother,
  a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law--
       36a man's enemies will be the members of his own household.'[5]
37"Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me; 38and anyone who does not take his cross and follow me is not worthy of me. 39Whoever finds his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life for my sake will find it.