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hey test.  if you want some quick answers you can find them here but it really would be beneficial to listen to what fat said.

the trance state can be reached by keeping your mind awake as you fall asleep.  it's not necessary to keep your mind completely clear to reach it though.  i think most of us here actually think about something else to get our minds off of our body.  you want to kind of forget about it and let it fall asleep.  the problem is usually when you start to think about something else your mind ends up wandering to the point where it to falls asleep.  it's a tricky balancing act that must be learned.

try doing some of the relaxation tek's before falling asleep at night.  or better yet, try going to sleep for six hours, waking up for about half an hour, then lying back down to sleep.  try to keep your mind alert during the half an hour awake time.  reading is suggested.  don't do any strenous physical activities during this time.  you want to stay as relaxed as possible.  your brain likes to get at least six hours of sleep.  your body would like at least eight.  when you do lay back down your mind should be well awake and your body still feeling sleepy.  if you can keep your mind awake and let yourself relax there is a good chance you will enter into trance.  if you can concentrate on a point outside of your body while in trance you may be able to trigger the projection reflex.

you say rather than entering into trance.  do you mean that you would rather enter into a trance slowly?  after your twenty minutes of letting your body relax what kind of state do you feel that you are in?  do you feel that you are in a trance after those twenty minutes? because twenty minutes or relaxation is normal in the time it takes to reach a nice trance state.

what's the most relaxed you have ever been while doing this?

what is it that you are concentrating or focusing on that brings you out of your relaxation?  usually any thoughts about the body will tend to bring you back towards the physical.  do you notice any physical movement when you start to concentrate?  the slightest bit will bring you out of trance.  for a few months i would break my trance by concentrating too hard and moving parts of my body.  i wasn't aware of it at the time and it took some careful observation to realize what was going on.

everyone is different here in what helps them trigger the projection reflex.  have you started doing NEW yet?  usualy if i am in trance and start raising as much energy as i can into my sub-naval storage area, i can start to feel some vibrations and a little seperation.

have you read ad or the treatises yet?  

if you think going deeper into your relaxation will help then what's stopping you from doing so?  do you fall asleep?

i know i've said this before but be careful waht you say about frank.  he's my cousin and i saw him beat people up before.  he's tough.  

congrats frank.

hey links.  i've heard requesting to meet your guide is as easy as just requesting to meet your guide.  before you go to sleep or before you ap are the best times.  clear your mind as best you can and think or even verbally announce your desire/intent.  if you can't ap then bed time would be preferred.

your signature is a wise saying.  the wise man knows he knows nothing.  do you fully understand it?  there is what i believe is the real meaning behind it and the obvious, surface meaning that many people believe it to mean which is - to think that there is so much knowledge out there that what you do know is relatively so small that it is considered nothing.  i really don't think that's what the saying means.  i'd be more than happy to give you my take on it, or you could think about it for a while yourself.  

have fun w/ your guide.

hey fat turkey.  i know that meditation isn't just about silencing the internal monologue.  i've put my time in  it was just one aspect that i was talking about here.  

leviathan, i very much like to argue.  it's brain candy for me.  know that i won't be offended or get mad at anything you say and that all criticism is welcome.  i don't want this to be like most other arguments on forums where everyone is getting bent out of shape and annoying other members w/ their childish remarks.  
i write how i talk.   when i read it back to myself it makes sense to me.  i don't want to have to worry about rules when i  express myself.  if you dislike how i write you don't have to read it, kindly.  it's nice to see that the only reason you responded to the thread was to criticise something.  that says a lot. i don't believe you can claim that it was said in a nice manner either because even though i'm obviously not as smart as you , i could have come up w/ something better put than that.  also i'm wondering if you would really recommend me dropping all of my meditation practices and pursuing more grammerly correct writing skills.  i guess that would kinda make sense to me.  maybe if i were five years younger and as smart as you it would make more sense.  grammer isn't really something that i complain about but since you like everything to be correct it would be nice to see  the words 'outer' and 'worship' properly spelled.

also i just notice that your signature also criticises all of western religion, not to mention that you do so and don't suggest or offer anything else.  do you have any problems w/ eastern religion?  i'd like to know which one you think i should follow.  i think bold and stupid are clearly defined sometimes.

i read your bio.  it's really awesome that you put down as one of your online activities 'discussing intelligent topics'. man, come off it. who are you trying to impress?  if you are looking for a girlfriend i'll ask my sister to give you a call.

my topic was started to at least try and help others.  your reply was poop.

i don't think there is enough tough friendly arguing going on on this forum.  i think i'll start a 'lets argue' topic in the chat forum.

ok, your turn.

part of me feels that fighting the internal dialouge and trying to grab those resources by force may not be the best thing.  it certainly seems hard enough  at times to merit it being wrong. forcefully can have a few different meanings itself.  but it seems the best way to make progress, for me at least.  there are a limitless amount of meditation practices.  some of them require a good deal of attention and mental clarity.  i believe the progress in all of them to be proportional to your ability to concentrate.  if concentration is learned first it can be directed at all of the other practices and progress will be great.  there was  a good deal of time spent meditating where i was in a kind of dazed, dreamlike state.  even though my intent when i sat down was to be aware of my thoughts, i couldn't help being so lost in them that i was completely unaware.  when i would come out of my meditation it was like i just woke up from a dream and the memories of what just happened were not there or very hazy.  this made me feel the only way for me to make progress w/ any meditation was to be able to gain a good level of mental clarity.  even when using  a mantra to try and gain some calm in my thoughts, i couldn't help but day dream.  it's easier now to see why learning this skill properly is valued so much as being a firm base for proper meditation.

there is also a lot of good info in the treatises.  the links are on the main page.

try making a snowball instead.

when i read your title for the post i thought you were talking about something that i say when people ask me what's going on.  i usually say ' this is what's going on '.  it woulda been ironic as hell if you were talking about the same thing.  

about your journey: do it till it's done

i read a carlos castenada book once where don jaun was talking about why he was so old but still so healthy.  he was talking to carlos about how he never agreed to get old and therefore his body had to comply.  i think his exact words were ' i never agreed to get old'. kind of mind over matter.  he may have then went on to say that most people already 'know' that they are going to be old and when they get old they succumb to old characteristics.  i'm not old enough yet to have any experience w/ this but i keep it in mind as much as possible.  i don't really believe in celebrating birthdays anymore but i will reckognize that it's your bday and wish you a happy day.  

is this bad for your eyes at all?  sixty minute seems like a long time to be doing something like this.

that's damn funny kakkarot.  i saw the same thing the first time and thought it was my imagination too.

i havne't tried the last one yet but the first two i can do w/out my finger.  it took less than a minute.  it's easy if you move your finger back and forth to see where the best spot is.  after you find the easiest spot for yourself and get the visual trick down, you can take your finger away.  the image will appear blurry the first few times you get it but after a few minutes you should be able to see the image clearly, w/out your finger.   how will this help me see aura's?  i've never really tried before because i thought it would take a lot of time to be able to do.  maybe if i can do this so easily i would do good w/ that.

who is saddam hussein?

some people believe the universe will collapse in on itself and then expand again infinitely.  if this happens we will be born again and do the exact things that we are doing now/then forever.  since we would have already experienced everything that we are about to do, we get the feeling that we've already done it.  i thought i already told you this?

tool

maybe my idea of trance is wrong.  i always thought that when you entered any kind of trance that the expansion feelings on your head and body were part of it.  i don't consider myself in trance if i'm not feeling them.  for me, those feelings are what let me know that i'm able to project.  i can't meditate for more than half an hour w/out feeling it throughout my body.  are these expansion type feelings part of your normal trance/meditation routine? or something that happened just that once?  

we are able to concentrate on numerous things at one time.  driving is a good example.  driving and talking on the phone is another.  you could even be day dreaming while on the phone, while driving somewhere.  this is why it's easy to concentrate on counting or whatever you are meditating on, and be aware of those other thoughts you are having in the background.  an important part of the goal is to keep the mind in one spot.  using an object for meditation is recommended to start.  putting a ball in front of you on the floor is one good way.  it's  easier than trying to keep an image in your mind.  if you gaze at the ball w/out thinking 'ball' you will be on a  good path.  as soon as you notice you are thinking about something else, bring your attention back to the ball and clear your mind.  this is extremely difficult to master.  the first few minutes are usually the easiest for me.  after that my thoughts tend to become longer when i have them.  it's important not to get annoyed when you realize you have just zoned out for five minutes or more.  this will easily happen.  the moment that you realize you have zoned out is the exact moment that you have the oppurtunity to progress w/ your meditation.  as soon as you realize this has happened make every effort to return your awareness to the object.  if you don't try as hard as you can to do this you will find yourself realizing you were just day dreaming and continuing on your day dream w/ the background thought now being 'i am supposed to be concentrating on the ball'.  
you could spend an easy half an hour meditating w/ only two scattered minutes total that you achieved your goal in.  this is completely normal.  it takes great mental discipline to be able to sit for a minute straight w/out thought.  as soon as you are able to keep the object firmly in mind w/out thought, you are ready to move onto meditation w/out an object.  
i have tried both and even though the object type meditation is recommended, i've found the objectless meditation to be easier and more progressive for me.  after i made some significant progress w/ the silent meditation i went back to the object and found it a lot easier than before.  
when just starting out, five minutes, six times a day vs half an hour straight is sometimes more rewarding.  always add to the time when you can though.  
you do not need to be able to do any of this to be successful at oobe.  it would help greatly though.
i believe lack of clarity to be caused by laxity.  it may not seem so at first but when you strengthen your intention to reach your goal, clarity increases dramatically.  preparing yourself  before meditation will help w/ your intent.  
i used to get somewhat frustrated wheni realized i had been day draming.  i used that as fuel to increase my intent.  it worked like a charm.  
i feel that i've progressed very much w/ in the last six months.  it was/is very hard. if anyone has any questions at all post them here.  i feel that i'd be able to help.

human kind isn't a seperated consciousness.   that's the illusion.  there is only one consciousness.  our reality is  important though.  it's not irrelevant.  trying to see through this illusion is part of my goal.  maybe it's not a must for everyone.  maybe.  there are certain things that i believe to be wrong.  there are people that i respect and admire that believe certain things to be wrong.  w/ every person there are a number of things that they blieve to be wrong that i do not.  some of these people i believe to be free from this illusion that we are talking about.  i believe if i was also free from illusion that i would agree more in what is right and wrong and would act accordingly.  being able to see things as they truly are is  a must for me.

this reality is definetly an illusion.  i have seen it break many times.  as i'm sure many of you have as well.  i believe when we can silence out internal monologue that we have no choice but to be fully present.  i believe it's this presence that will show us true reality, which is actually just the lack of any reality.

when i do certain types of energy work my eyes stay blurry for up to an hour afterwards.  my vision is perfect.  i don't know why this happens but nothing bad has come from it for me.  it's been happening for half a year now. it's possible that it may be due to eye strain while meditating.  sometimes i really want to see the three d blackness so bad that i start looking before it's there.

wow

in ad robert talks about these tunnels.  i don't recall which page it's on.  a search on here would show some previous topics discussing the same things.  try searching for tubelike structures.

you two may be referring to sleep paralysis.  it's the mind awake/body asleep state that is desired for projection.  there should be something about it in the treatise.  you can access it from the main page by going to the treatise section.

he has shows in new york alot.  i'm only two hours away and i would like to go to the next one.  it may be in april.  i believe i read that's it's only twenty dollars to get in.  i'm sure it will be incredible.